Top-Posting Vs. Bottom-Posting

[Neil]

I received a message in another newsgroup saying that I shouldn't top-post
my replies. I always top-post, because I feel it's easier for the reader to
see the reply, rather than having to go to the bottom of the previous
message. But, since this is the main newsgroup I post in, I thought I'd ask
its members, especially Sir Larry, what the preferred method is (if any).
Here are the links the fellow provided me:

<http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>
<http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html >
<http://www.netmeister. org/news/learn2quote.htm l>
<http://cfaj.freeshell. org/google/ (taming google)
<http://members.fortune city.com/nnqweb/ (newusers)

Do you guys agree or disagree or don't care?

Thanks,

Neil

[Tom van Stiphout]

On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 01:23:28 -0600, "Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote:

I'm just very surprised there isn't a technical solution for this.
Surely newsreaders can be made smart enough to follow the user's
preferences. Indeed Google News utilizes some technology to suppress
some text it deems superfluous.

-Tom.

>I received a message in another newsgroup saying that I shouldn't top-post
my replies. I always top-post, because I feel it's easier for the reader to
see the reply, rather than having to go to the bottom of the previous
message. But, since this is the main newsgroup I post in, I thought I'd ask
its members, especially Sir Larry, what the preferred method is (if any).
Here are the links the fellow provided me:

<http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>
<http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html >
<http://www.netmeister. org/news/learn2quote.htm l>
<http://cfaj.freeshell. org/google/ (taming google)
<http://members.fortune city.com/nnqweb/ (newusers)

Do you guys agree or disagree or don't care?

Thanks,

Neil

[Neil]

My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express. So I have a message window open,
and I can go to the top or the bottom of the quote.
"David W. Fenton" <XX*******@dfen ton.com.invalid wrote in message
news:Xn******** *************** ***********@66. 250.146.128...

"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:vT******** ******@nlpi068. nbdc.sbc.com:

>As for your statement that it's easier for the poster, I disagree.
I find it easier to post at the end, when I'm done reading. It's
actually extra work for me to return to the top and place my
comment. So I find that statement to be incorrect at best, but
disengenuous at worst. ;-)

That all depends on your news reader. If it defaults to top posting,
it will be easier to top post. If you prefer to top post, you should
check your news reader's defaults and change them to match your
preferences.

--
David W. Fenton http://www.dfenton.com/
usenet at dfenton dot com http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/

[David W. Fenton]

"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:O5******** ********@newssv r21.news.prodig y.net:

"David W. Fenton" <XX*******@dfen ton.com.invalid wrote in message
news:Xn******** *************** ***********@66. 250.146.128...

>"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:vT******* *******@nlpi068 .nbdc.sbc.com:

>>As for your statement that it's easier for the poster, I
disagree. I find it easier to post at the end, when I'm done
reading. It's actually extra work for me to return to the top
and place my comment. So I find that statement to be incorrect
at best, but disengenuous at worst. ;-)

That all depends on your news reader. If it defaults to top
posting, it will be easier to top post. If you prefer to top
post, you should check your news reader's defaults and change
them to match your preferences.

My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

So I have a message window open,
and I can go to the top or the bottom of the quote.

But where is the cursor in the message window that opens when you
reply? When you're typing, you're not reading, since you've already
read the post (I assume you're smart enough to read the post before
replying?). When you're replying, your newsreader (or in your case,
your broken email client that has been badly adapted to barely
function as a news client) will place the cursor before or after the
quoted material, on the assumption that that's where you'll start
typing your reply. OE defaults to putting the cursor at the top.

--
David W. Fenton http://www.dfenton.com/
usenet at dfenton dot com http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/

[David W. Fenton]

Tom van Stiphout <no************ *@cox.netwrote in
news:j5******** *************** *********@4ax.c om:

I'm just very surprised there isn't a technical solution for this.
Surely newsreaders can be made smart enough to follow the user's
preferences. Indeed Google News utilizes some technology to
suppress some text it deems superfluous.

News readers from 20 years ago offered this kind of control. It's
the latecomers, like the substandard offerings from Microsoft, that
have dropped those features.

My newsreader, xNews, allows me to select a section of a post to
reply to, and quotes everything. It suppresses everything past the
signature delimiter (which is "-- " not just "--", as defined for a
long time in Usenet convention, if not in any RFCs that I know of)
in the quoted material, unless I've specifically selected it to
include. It's a problem when a top poster puts a sig between the
reply and the quotation if I want the poster's quotations to be
included, as it's past the signature delimiter, and thus my
newsreader says "nothing past this delimiter needs to be quoted."
Fortunately, I can highlight the part past the signature delimiter
and get it quoted.

There's a typical problem created by top posting, i.e., making it
harder for news readers to figure out where the signature begins and
the quoted material is located.

--
David W. Fenton http://www.dfenton.com/
usenet at dfenton dot com http://www.dfenton.com/DFA/

[Bob Quintal]

"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:t8******** ********@newssv r19.news.prodig y.net:

I received a message in another newsgroup saying that I shouldn't
top-post my replies. I always top-post, because I feel it's easier
for the reader to see the reply, rather than having to go to the
bottom of the previous message. But, since this is the main
newsgroup I post in, I thought I'd ask its members, especially Sir
Larry, what the preferred method is (if any). Here are the links
the fellow provided me:

<http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>
<http://www.caliburn.nl/topposting.html >
<http://www.netmeister. org/news/learn2quote.htm l>
<http://cfaj.freeshell. org/google/ (taming google)
<http://members.fortune city.com/nnqweb/ (newusers)

Do you guys agree or disagree or don't care?

Thanks,

Neil

Top posting has several disadvantages. I can jump into a thread at
the third message and read, in chronological sequence, what has been
said, in those groups where top-posting is banned. I can also
archive one message for future reference and have it reasonably
presented, in that I don't have to scroll down to see if the
question is the one I want an answer to.

I know a visually impaired person, who uses a narrator device to
listen to his mail, and he hates Jeopardy posting - Answer first,
then the question, :-)

I come from a time when usenet replies sometimes took days, and
unless the question came first, one often didn't remember what the
trigger to the answer was.

My $0.02.

--
Bob Quintal

PA is y I've altered my email address.

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

[Keith Wilby]

"David W. Fenton" <XX*******@dfen ton.com.invalid wrote in message
news:Xn******** *************** ***********@66. 250.146.128...

"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:O5******** ********@newssv r21.news.prodig y.net:

>>
My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

I think it's perfectly adequate for a very simple task.

[Neil]

>My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

>
Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

:-D I love Outlook Express. Why substandard?

>

>So I have a message window open,
and I can go to the top or the bottom of the quote.

But where is the cursor in the message window that opens when you
reply? When you're typing, you're not reading, since you've already
read the post (I assume you're smart enough to read the post before
replying?).

Oh sh*t! THAT'S what I've been doing wrong! I'm supposed to read *before*
posting??? Sh*t! :-)

When you're replying, your newsreader (or in your case,
your broken email client that has been badly adapted to barely
function as a news client) will place the cursor before or after the
quoted material, on the assumption that that's where you'll start
typing your reply. OE defaults to putting the cursor at the top.

Yes, of course, David, it's at the top. Ctrl+End, it's at the bottom. Not a
big deal either way. That was my point.

[Neil]

"Keith Wilby" <he**@there.com wrote in message
news:47******** **@glkas0286.gr eenlnk.net...

"David W. Fenton" <XX*******@dfen ton.com.invalid wrote in message
news:Xn******** *************** ***********@66. 250.146.128...

>"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:O5******* *********@newss vr21.news.prodi gy.net:

>>>
My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

I think it's perfectly adequate for a very simple task.

Well, maybe I need to explore new heights. I've been very happy with OE for
many years. But if there's something better, I'm all for it. So, tell me:
what do you use?

[Keith Wilby]

"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in message
news:h%******** ******@newssvr2 2.news.prodigy. net...

>
"Keith Wilby" <he**@there.com wrote in message
news:47******** **@glkas0286.gr eenlnk.net...

>"David W. Fenton" <XX*******@dfen ton.com.invalid wrote in message
news:Xn******* *************** ************@66 .250.146.128...

>>"Neil" <no****@nospam. netwrote in
news:O5****** **********@news svr21.news.prod igy.net:
My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

I think it's perfectly adequate for a very simple task.

Well, maybe I need to explore new heights. I've been very happy with OE
for many years. But if there's something better, I'm all for it. So, tell
me: what do you use?

Erm ... me? I use OE, hence my remark :-)

Keith.

[Salad]

Neil wrote:

>>>My newsreader? I just use Outlook Express.

Well, that might explain why you are confused, since you're using
substandard tools to post.

:-D I love Outlook Express. Why substandard?

I used OE...once. Which reminds me of the movie Johnny Dangerously and
the character Danny Vermin.

You shouldn't grab me, Johnny. My mother grabbed me once... ONCE!

You shouldn't kick me in the balls, Mrs. Kelly. My sister kicked me in
the balls once... [Stumbles in pain]

You shouldn't hang me on a hook, Johnny. My father hung me on a hook
once. Once!

You shouldn't have shot me, Johnny. My grandmother shot me once...