Microsoft's Martin Taylor: A Desperate Man

[Ministry Of Jute]

I returned home from work today to find an Airborne Express Letter
Express mailer leaning up against my apartment door.

The return addressee was

Microsoft
Suite 300
1165 Eastlake Avenue E
Seattle, WA 98109

Inside was a 4-color folder containing:

Windows 2003 evalution CD
Letter from Martin Taylor ( Sent Feb 1, 2004 according to the
letter...so much for Airborne )
A multipage brochure decrying that Windos was better than Linux.

SAD POOR PITIFUL FOOLS !!!!

....and into the garbage it went..........

PS -- Martin Taylor has been described as:

http://www.linuxpipeline.com/trends/18200168

"Microsoft' s Top Anti-Linux General"

More like a Private Last Class I'd Say.........

[Dino Chiesa [Microsoft]]

no problem,

maybe we need to establish a
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.advoca cy
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.flames
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.ridicu le
and so on

seriously, what do you think? should we make a space for this sort of
discussion?
I think the current dotnet.* groups are not well defined and differentiated,
so maybe we just need to be clearer about what goes where, and create a few
new groups to serve this constituency.

"William Ryan eMVP" <do********@com cast.nospam.net > wrote in message
news:uJ******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP10.phx.gbl...

Sorry about that Dino, I know better than responding to this.

--
W.G. Ryan MVP Windows - Embedded

www.devbuzz.com
www.knowdotnet.com
http://www.msmvps.com/williamryan/
"Dino Chiesa [Microsoft]" <di****@online. microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:%2******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP12.phx.gbl. ..

Can you please restrict this type of discussion to COLA and other advocacy

groups?
This group is intended to serve technical dotnet developers and users, not advocates for or against a particular company, issue, business model, etc. Thanks

--
Dino Chiesa
Microsoft Developer Division
d i n o c h @ OmitThis . m i c r o s o f t . c o m

"Ministry Of Jute" <al*******@jute .net> wrote in message
news:5c******** ********@newsre ad1.news.pas.ea rthlink.net...

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

> ---What if you like Unix/Linux, Windows and MAC. For instance, I have

a > linux firewall and use Apache as a web server for a lot of what I

do.

I
Then you would be helping to spread FUD about Linux as a server OS.

In other words, helping Gate$ and Ball-Me to keep Linux off the desktop -- where it belongs.

> have a good amount of work that I need to do with Office and I find XP

much

> more convenient to use on my laptop. I also find doing graphics and
> multimedia to be the most pleasant on Mac OS X. Am I ignorant

becase

of > this?

No, you're just several thousand bucks lighter in the wallet than
someone who can do the same on Linux.
>There's stuff about all three environments that I like just like
> there's stuff I don't like. As far as OSS in general, Apache is a killer

> web server. However I think both Oracle and SQL Server have a lot more

to

> offer in terms of convenience and power than say, MySql (at least w/

it's

> current implementation running 0.9.2 command center)

There's also PostgreSQL

> --That's not the premise of MS. There are a lot of people in the

world

who

> aren't all that into computers and the easier they are to use, from

their

> perspsective, the better.

But a computer that is a swiss cheese to viruses and crashes just will
doing simple web browsing is not /easier/ -- face it, M$ is just
selling people defective equipment. Pretty soon that MVP is going to
look like a badge from Saddam Hussein's Republican Guard.

> Some people have other stuff to do than learn a
> complex but powerful os. What the hell does my grandmother have to

gain

by

> learning Linux over Windows when most of the people she knows use

Windows

??? See -- that is the stupidiest thing ever written. You're
grandmother knows that she can send email using the TCP/IP protocol

with any OS that can network TCP/IP. Go ahead. Ask Gramma. She'll know.

As far as the second part of your comment, what would Microsoft have to gain

> by employing such a strategy? Do you really think Bill Gates is

going direct

> corporate policy in such a way that he'll build inferior stuff just

so I

can

> go out and make money fixing it?

DING DING DING. WE HAVE A WINNER. DENSE BOY FIGURED IT OUT !!!!
> --Microsoft has NO control whatsoever over this. How can they stop

me from

> learning about other operating systems?

1. Giving $$$ to schools under the guise of a phoney /Foundation/.

2. Using $$$ to buy off corporate leaders.

3. Subverting the Constitution and the Justice Department, making a
mockery of civil law, etc. etc. etc.

> Nonetheless, are you really trying to argue that on the whole,

people are

> less computer literate in the US for instance, in 2004 than they

were in > 1995? Come on, you can't possibly believe that

Can you believe that the Soviet Union fell behind in technology during
the Stalin era because of suppression of outside facts?

Can you then believe that the U.S. with it's centrally controlled

media, which can be bought by M$ millions, might be brainwashing its people,
all the while the rest of the world is switching to Linux -- leaving the US in a /backward/ state?

> Do you mean as a desktop accessing the internet or as servers running it?

> If it's the former you have to be kidding. If it's the latter, then

explain

> why so many people use IIS and Windows even after they found out

about > Linux.

So they 'find out' about linux. Suppose they work for Citibank. Are
they going to bring in their own copy of Linux and install it? Get

real.

[William Ryan eMVP]

--
W.G. Ryan MVP Windows - Embedded

www.devbuzz.com
www.knowdotnet.com
http://www.msmvps.com/williamryan/
"Dino Chiesa [Microsoft]" <di****@online. microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:uG******** *****@tk2msftng p13.phx.gbl...

no problem,

maybe we need to establish a
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.advoca cy
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.flames
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.ridicu le
and so on

seriously, what do you think? I've heard some people mention this before. I think the whole advocacy
thing is sort of a joke but I guess it does afford a forum wherein non
development stuff can be discussed. However, if you were to do it, make
sure that it can only be accessed with Outlook Express, force people to Top
Post and prohibit words like Mafia$oft, Micro$oft, Gate$ etc This would
guarantee that the COLA guys don't come over and bother everyone. A
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.vbnetV ersusC# would be a great one ;-).

The more I think about it the more I like the ideas you mentioned although
the flame and ridicule ones would probably get out of hand quickly. I'm
sure it'd be pretty funny though, just like the SmartPhone NG. Maybe a
dotnet.general. development and dotnet.general. discussion would work. This
is definitely something that's worth throwing out there though and getting
some feedback about the ideal grouping..... Definitely think you are on to
something here.

Thanks again,

Bill

should we make a space for this sort of discussion?
I think the current dotnet.* groups are not well defined and differentiated, so maybe we just need to be clearer about what goes where, and create a few new groups to serve this constituency.

"William Ryan eMVP" <do********@com cast.nospam.net > wrote in message
news:uJ******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP10.phx.gbl...

Sorry about that Dino, I know better than responding to this.

--
W.G. Ryan MVP Windows - Embedded

www.devbuzz.com
www.knowdotnet.com
http://www.msmvps.com/williamryan/
"Dino Chiesa [Microsoft]" <di****@online. microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:%2******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP12.phx.gbl. ..

Can you please restrict this type of discussion to COLA and other advocacy groups?
This group is intended to serve technical dotnet developers and users, not advocates for or against a particular company, issue, business model, etc. Thanks

--
Dino Chiesa
Microsoft Developer Division
d i n o c h @ OmitThis . m i c r o s o f t . c o m

"Ministry Of Jute" <al*******@jute .net> wrote in message
news:5c******** ********@newsre ad1.news.pas.ea rthlink.net...
> William Ryan eMVP wrote:
>
> > ---What if you like Unix/Linux, Windows and MAC. For instance, I have

a

> > linux firewall and use Apache as a web server for a lot of what I do.

I

>
> Then you would be helping to spread FUD about Linux as a server OS.

In > other words, helping Gate$ and Ball-Me to keep Linux off the desktop -- > where it belongs.
>
> > have a good amount of work that I need to do with Office and I find XP

much
> > more convenient to use on my laptop. I also find doing graphics

and > > multimedia to be the most pleasant on Mac OS X. Am I ignorant

becase

of

> > this?
>
> No, you're just several thousand bucks lighter in the wallet than
> someone who can do the same on Linux.
>
>
> >There's stuff about all three environments that I like just like
> > there's stuff I don't like. As far as OSS in general, Apache is a
killer
> > web server. However I think both Oracle and SQL Server have a lot

more

to
> > offer in terms of convenience and power than say, MySql (at least w/ it's
> > current implementation running 0.9.2 command center)
>
> There's also PostgreSQL
>
> > --That's not the premise of MS. There are a lot of people in the

world

who
> > aren't all that into computers and the easier they are to use, from their
> > perspsective, the better.
>
> But a computer that is a swiss cheese to viruses and crashes just will > doing simple web browsing is not /easier/ -- face it, M$ is just
> selling people defective equipment. Pretty soon that MVP is going to > look like a badge from Saddam Hussein's Republican Guard.
>
> > Some people have other stuff to do than learn a
> > complex but powerful os. What the hell does my grandmother have to gain

by
> > learning Linux over Windows when most of the people she knows use
Windows
>
> ??? See -- that is the stupidiest thing ever written. You're
> grandmother knows that she can send email using the TCP/IP protocol

with > any OS that can network TCP/IP. Go ahead. Ask Gramma. She'll

know. >
> As far as the second part of your comment, what would Microsoft have

to gain
> > by employing such a strategy? Do you really think Bill Gates is going direct
> > corporate policy in such a way that he'll build inferior stuff just so

I

can
> > go out and make money fixing it?
>
> DING DING DING. WE HAVE A WINNER. DENSE BOY FIGURED IT OUT !!!!
>
>
> > --Microsoft has NO control whatsoever over this. How can they

stop

me from
> > learning about other operating systems?
>
> 1. Giving $$$ to schools under the guise of a phoney /Foundation/.
>
> 2. Using $$$ to buy off corporate leaders.
>
> 3. Subverting the Constitution and the Justice Department, making a
> mockery of civil law, etc. etc. etc.
>
> > Nonetheless, are you really trying to argue that on the whole, people are
> > less computer literate in the US for instance, in 2004 than they were

in

> > 1995? Come on, you can't possibly believe that
>
> Can you believe that the Soviet Union fell behind in technology

during > the Stalin era because of suppression of outside facts?
>
> Can you then believe that the U.S. with it's centrally controlled

media, > which can be bought by M$ millions, might be brainwashing its people, > all the while the rest of the world is switching to Linux -- leaving the > US in a /backward/ state?
>
> > Do you mean as a desktop accessing the internet or as servers running it?
> > If it's the former you have to be kidding. If it's the latter, then explain
> > why so many people use IIS and Windows even after they found out about > > Linux.
>
> So they 'find out' about linux. Suppose they work for Citibank. Are > they going to bring in their own copy of Linux and install it? Get

real.

>
>

[Daniel O'Connell [C# MVP]]

"Dino Chiesa [Microsoft]" <di****@online. microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:uG******** *****@tk2msftng p13.phx.gbl...

no problem,

maybe we need to establish a
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.advoca cy
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.flames
and
microsoft.publi c.dotnet.ridicu le
and so on

seriously, what do you think? should we make a space for this sort of
discussion?
I think the current dotnet.* groups are not well defined and
differentiated,
so maybe we just need to be clearer about what goes where, and create a
few
new groups to serve this constituency.

While I agree that it would be interesting and would (hopefully) allow those
of us who aren't interested in these discussions to avoid them, I don't
think it'll help with bailo one bit. He posts here to annoy, its interesting
that many of the COLA people call him a wintroll while here he is considered
a linux or java troll(or general idiot, you pick). Most of the posts here
aren't meant to be serious discussions, they are attacks meant to enrage and
start arguments. Which, IMHO, means that .general is a bigger, brighter
target than say, dotnet.advocacy would be.

Still, it might not be a bad idea to give people a forum to complain on and
pass on success stories, etc.

[Jeff Relf]

Hi Ministry Of Jute,

You wrote,
" In a world where we are all * forced *
to contribute to building a wing on the Gate$ Ca$tle
because MSFT is locked into the 401k stock funds
and because our Federal, State and Local governments
still purchase MicroCrapWare with our tax money --
there is no * CHOICE * -- you stupid dumshit, you. "

It's not that we are all slaves to Master Gates ...
it's just that Apple is always trying to dump
it's overpriced hardware on us,
so it refuses to allow it's OS to virtualize many devices.
( e.g. The AMD 64 comes to mind )

Also, Every Ton Dick and Harry who produces yet another
Linux distro doesn't have the resources
to virtualize many devices.
( e.g. No Trackball Explorer driver for SuSE )

Gates is just one puny man.
You can't blame him for what the entire world is doing,
including the armies of lawyers that are tying his hands.

Gates is not a demigod. Einstein was not a demigod.
Saddam is was not a demigod.

The reality is much Much more complex than that.

[Jango Johnny]

Jeff Relf wrote:

The reality is much Much more complex than that.

The defense of the Empowered and the Pharisee.

--
Bush-W-4