Microsoft's Martin Taylor: A Desperate Man

[Ministry Of Jute]

I returned home from work today to find an Airborne Express Letter
Express mailer leaning up against my apartment door.

The return addressee was

Microsoft
Suite 300
1165 Eastlake Avenue E
Seattle, WA 98109

Inside was a 4-color folder containing:

Windows 2003 evalution CD
Letter from Martin Taylor ( Sent Feb 1, 2004 according to the
letter...so much for Airborne )
A multipage brochure decrying that Windos was better than Linux.

SAD POOR PITIFUL FOOLS !!!!

....and into the garbage it went..........

PS -- Martin Taylor has been described as:

http://www.linuxpipeline.com/trends/18200168

"Microsoft' s Top Anti-Linux General"

More like a Private Last Class I'd Say.........

[The Lurking Horror]

On Wed, 19 May 2004 03:31:49 GMT, Ministry Of Jute wrote:

I returned home from work today to find an Airborne Express Letter
Express mailer leaning up against my apartment door.

The return addressee was

Microsoft
Suite 300
1165 Eastlake Avenue E
Seattle, WA 98109

Inside was a 4-color folder containing:

Windows 2003 evalution CD
Letter from Martin Taylor ( Sent Feb 1, 2004 according to the
letter...so much for Airborne )
A multipage brochure decrying that Windos was better than Linux.

SAD POOR PITIFUL FOOLS !!!!

...and into the garbage it went..........

PS -- Martin Taylor has been described as:

http://www.linuxpipeline.com/trends/18200168

"Microsoft' s Top Anti-Linux General"

More like a Private Last Class I'd Say.........

Microsoft have offices on Eastlake? That's news to me. Sure it's not a PR
firm or duplication house?
--
No one ever got fired for blaming Microsoft.

[XML Man]

The Lurking Horror wrote:

Microsoft have offices on Eastlake? That's news to me. Sure it's not a PR
firm or duplication house?

Well the From: address definitely says 'Microsoft' on it.

Suite 300.

I might call them tomorrow and berate them for sending me insulting and
slanderous mail.

--
Valhallah !

[William Ryan eMVP]

Hey there Ministry of Jute:

Whatever you think of the technology, you have to admit that one of the
biggest problems with Linux is the people that hang out over at COLA. I'm
using OE and Top posting just for them. I'm actually making an exception
for my hatred of COLA (note, not a hatred of Linux - just COLA) people in
your case dear Bailo b/c I've come to realize you have a great sense of
humor. And at least your barbs are usually pretty witty.
http://msmvps.com/williamryan/posts/6569.aspx Long Live Outlook Express,
Long Live Top Posting

Cheers,

Bill
"Ministry Of Jute" <al*******@jute .net> wrote in message
news:Fy******** *******@newsrea d1.news.pas.ear thlink.net...

I returned home from work today to find an Airborne Express Letter
Express mailer leaning up against my apartment door.

The return addressee was

Microsoft
Suite 300
1165 Eastlake Avenue E
Seattle, WA 98109

Inside was a 4-color folder containing:

Windows 2003 evalution CD
Letter from Martin Taylor ( Sent Feb 1, 2004 according to the
letter...so much for Airborne )
A multipage brochure decrying that Windos was better than Linux.

SAD POOR PITIFUL FOOLS !!!!

...and into the garbage it went..........

PS -- Martin Taylor has been described as:

http://www.linuxpipeline.com/trends/18200168

"Microsoft' s Top Anti-Linux General"

More like a Private Last Class I'd Say.........

[Tom B.]

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

[...]
http://msmvps.com/williamryan/posts/6569.aspx [...]

So you're saying that the those whom you take to be "Linux advocates" in
c.o.l.a. (you mentioned John Bailo and Liam Slider) are the biggest
obstacle to the success of open-source.

Thanks for the laugh.

--
"My way of joking is to tell the truth; it's the funniest joke in the
world." - Unknown

[William Ryan eMVP]

Hi Tom:
"Tom B." <to*@invalid.ad dress> wrote in message
news:c8******** **@newsg4.svr.p ol.co.uk...

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

[...]
http://msmvps.com/williamryan/posts/6569.aspx [...]

So you're saying that the those whom you take to be "Linux advocates" in
c.o.l.a. (you mentioned John Bailo and Liam Slider) are the biggest
obstacle to the success of open-source.

Thanks for the laugh.

--
"My way of joking is to tell the truth; it's the funniest joke in the
world." - Unknown

Well, it was said somewhat flippantly. However I do think that if many of
the 'advocates' encouraged people to use Linux and OSS without calling them
stupid if they like Windows, it'd have a better image. There's a local talk
show around here for instance that discusses tech issues exclusively. The
host doesn't have any axes to grind so he helps people with Linux/Mac and
Windows Problems. Just about every show will have some Linux advocate
insinuate that that Linux is superior AND it's the Stupidity( or Ignorance
or some other snide comment) of the average user that is the only reason
people use MS or Mac stuff. I've heard mroe than a few such comments on
David Lawrence's show too. I guess the point is that a lot of people use MS
products and go on with their lives. The OS on their computer just isn't
that big of a deal to most people, so listening to people get so hyped up
over it just doesn't make sense.

I used mostly Berkley Unix/Solaris w/ Oracle for the first two years I was
started working in development. Really liked it, still do. I was still
using it when Linux started getting big but never messed with Linux until
about 4 years ago. I have RH9 loaded on my machine and I work with Mono (not
as much as I'd like) when I can. But will I go to a Linux users group
meeting? Not in this town. I've been to one here and one in Charlotte and
everyone spent more time talking trash about Windows (and IIS in particular)
than anything technological. I know, this is probably just two isolated
groups and all that, but the point is that many advocates turn people off to
OSS (to be honest, my post was probably better suited to OSS on the whole).
The whole Micro$oft, Windo$ and all that other crap is an annoying
distraction and while trivial, it's indicative about what most discussions
turn into when you talk about those people.

Also, I think Bailo is a pretty funny dude and actually have come to enjoy
his posts. And I know many of the COLA people are cool and don't act like
they forgot to take their lithium but the ones that do are quite annoying.
And PR wise, if these cats weren't so rude and annoying, I think Linux would
be a lot more attractive to many folks.

But I'm just some Wintroll who uses Outlook Express so that automatically
disqualifies everything I have to say. Didn't mean to be offensive if I
was, just sort of got annoyed by a few of them again.

Bill

[Tom B.]

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

Hi Tom:
"Tom B." <to*@invalid.ad dress> wrote in message
news:c8******** **@newsg4.svr.p ol.co.uk...

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

[...]
http://msmvps.com/williamryan/posts/6569.aspx [...]
So you're saying that the those whom you take to be "Linux advocates" in
c.o.l.a. (you mentioned John Bailo and Liam Slider) are the biggest
obstacle to the success of open-source.

Thanks for the laugh.

Well, it was said somewhat flippantly. However I do think that if many of
the 'advocates' encouraged people to use Linux and OSS without calling them
stupid if they like Windows, it'd have a better image.

The newsgroup c.o.l.a. is so full of Linux-bashing, and many other kinds
of, trolls that it can't be taken as representative of the Linux
community as a whole.

While there may still be some Linux advocacy in c.o.l.a., the troll
posts and subsequent flaming seem to take precedence these days. Due to
this, several "real" Linux advocates have ceased to participate in this
newsgroup any more, from what I've read. Longer-term c.o.l.a.
participants would know more about this than me, though.
[...]

But I'm just some Wintroll who uses Outlook Express so that automatically
disqualifies everything I have to say. Didn't mean to be offensive if I
was, just sort of got annoyed by a few of them again.

I guess that it's easy (for me, at least) to be a bit hyper-sensitive in
c.o.l.a. with the seemingly constant barrage of anti-Linux,
FUD-spreading trolls we get in here. I'd say that you're free to use
whichever software you like; but if I know of alternatives which I
believe are better, and I think that you are ignorant of them, I'd
probably /suggest/ them to you.

Linux is largely about freedom, so Linux advocacy is largely about
freedom advocacy.

Just my £0.02.

--
"My way of joking is to tell the truth; it's the funniest joke in the
world." - Unknown

[Philip Callan]

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

Well, it was said somewhat flippantly. However I do think that if many of
the 'advocates' encouraged people to use Linux and OSS without calling them
stupid if they like Windows, it'd have a better image.

Liking Windows doesn't make you stupid, it makes you ignorant.

But hey, when you have a multi-billion dollar company, founded on the
premise of keeping people ignorant about their computers, and the
operating system they run, so that they can pay some 'MCSE' or 'MVP' to
come fix an operating system that should not have been let on the
Internet to begin with.

People are not stupid, everyone can /learn/, but Microsoft doesnt want
them too. People knew /MORE/ about the computers they ran before
Windows95 hit the streets, since then its been a gradual decline in
average proficiency.

Thats one of the reasons people who have formed Windows habits find it
so difficult to migrate, they are so used to having their hand held and
choices made for them or without even letting them know a choice was
available, that it freaks them out having to actually make up their own
mind.

'liking' windows and 'respecting' are 2 different things, when I want to
play a game, or work in Adobe, I flip into WindowsXP to do it, as for
gaming, now that I have the ati drivers installed, I'm having tons of
fun playing ut2k4 20% faster than under Windoze.

Windows has it place and its purpose, but unlike what Microsoft wishes,
it is /NOT/ on the Internet.

[Ministry Of Jute]

Tom B. wrote:

The newsgroup c.o.l.a. is so full of Linux-bashing, and many other kinds
of, trolls that it can't be taken as representative of the Linux
community as a whole.
What bashing? The number of threads or posts within threads devote to
Linux Advocacy far outnumber the troll posts.
While there may still be some Linux advocacy in c.o.l.a., the troll
posts and subsequent flaming seem to take precedence these days. Due to
this, several "real" Linux advocates have ceased to participate in this
newsgroup any more, from what I've read. Longer-term c.o.l.a.
participants would know more about this than me, though.
Look. For a globally read newsgroup, telling me about installing a
distro at the local senior center is touching -- but, unless providing
some generalized information, hardly relevant.
Linux is largely about freedom, so Linux advocacy is largely about
freedom advocacy.

And FREEDOM is about throwing off the yoke of oppression. You sound
like some mam-by pam-by Liberal who thinks the world is all about
/choice/. Wake Up my Bleeding Heart friend. In a world where a
Desparate Man such as Martin Taylor can inflict his Newspeak on us with
a barrage of unwanted dis-information using Airborne Express -- there is
no Equality. In a world where we are all *forced* to contribute to
building a wing on the Gate$ Ca$tle because MSFT is locked into the 401k
stock funds and because our Federal, State and Local governments still
purchase MicroCrapWare with our tax money -- there is no *CHOICE* -- you
stupid dumshit, you.

[William Ryan eMVP]

--

W.G. Ryan, eMVP

http://forums.devbuzz.com/
http://www.knowdotnet.com/williamryan.html
http://www.msmvps.com/WilliamRyan/
"Tom B." <to*@invalid.ad dress> wrote in message
news:c8******** **@news5.svr.po l.co.uk...

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

Hi Tom:
"Tom B." <to*@invalid.ad dress> wrote in message
news:c8******** **@newsg4.svr.p ol.co.uk...

William Ryan eMVP wrote:

[...]
http://msmvps.com/williamryan/posts/6569.aspx [...]

So you're saying that the those whom you take to be "Linux advocates" in
c.o.l.a. (you mentioned John Bailo and Liam Slider) are the biggest
obstacle to the success of open-source.

Thanks for the laugh.
Well, it was said somewhat flippantly. However I do think that if many of the 'advocates' encouraged people to use Linux and OSS without calling them stupid if they like Windows, it'd have a better image.

The newsgroup c.o.l.a. is so full of Linux-bashing, and many other kinds
of, trolls that it can't be taken as representative of the Linux
community as a whole.

-- I agree. I'm actually going to post a clarification about this b/c I
think I came off a little different than what I intended to

While there may still be some Linux advocacy in c.o.l.a., the troll
posts and subsequent flaming seem to take precedence these days. Due to
this, several "real" Linux advocates have ceased to participate in this
newsgroup any more, from what I've read. Longer-term c.o.l.a.
participants would know more about this than me, though. -- Yes and that's unfortunate. However, I guess my original point was that
it's these type of people that yack the loudest and they are often the 'face
of Linux' to much of the world. I know about 7 people that are true
professionals and also Linux users. They don't have time to waste spelling
Gates with a $ or engaging in most of that other stuff. The whole reason OSS
stuff is as good as it is is b/c there are a lot of serious and smart
professionals out there working on it. They however are usually to busy
being productive to waste getting in OS Freestyle battles or getting all
f***d off over top posting or people using Outlook express as their
newsreader.

[...]

But I'm just some Wintroll who uses Outlook Express so that automatically disqualifies everything I have to say. Didn't mean to be offensive if I
was, just sort of got annoyed by a few of them again.
I guess that it's easy (for me, at least) to be a bit hyper-sensitive in
c.o.l.a. with the seemingly constant barrage of anti-Linux,
FUD-spreading trolls we get in here. I'd say that you're free to use
whichever software you like; but if I know of alternatives which I
believe are better, and I think that you are ignorant of them, I'd
probably /suggest/ them to you.

--Yes I agree with you. I think being a partisan, particularly in this
arena is silly. You should keep your mind open and use what fits instead of
trying to fit square pegs into round holes. This, at least with the current
scenario is exemplified by people calling Windows users stupid b/c they
don't use Linux instead. Many people that got a computer late in the game
have enough trouble as it is learning how to use the thing. For them, a Mac
or a Windows PC is probably going to be easier to use up front. If they
decide they want more power or want the flexibility provided by an OS like
RH9, they can always move to it. But i see no value in berating people b/c
they disagree with you on an OS (I'm using 'you' in a general sense here)
and that seems to happen quite a bit. I'm not saying it's always the case,
but I know what I've seen, and I know more than a few other folks that have
had similar experience.
Linux is largely about freedom, so Linux advocacy is largely about
freedom advocacy. --It should be, I agree. And to be honest, I'm hard pressed to find one
thing I actually disagree with you about. It's a shame that people with
your attitude (not to mention decorum) are unfortunately eclispsed in that
NG by the trolls.

Anyway, I'm going to add a follow up to my other blog entry b/c if the Linux
'advocates' over there were just cool about stuff like you've been, there
wouldn't be anything to cricitize over there.

I defintely appreciate your perspective.

Bill


Just my £0.02.

--
"My way of joking is to tell the truth; it's the funniest joke in the
world." - Unknown