Popups, web applications, accessibility

[Harlan Messinger]

Can you help me figure out what to do about popups?

Sometimes we develop web applications where popups make very good sense for
precisely the same reasons they make sense in traditional locally-installed
application interfaces. I understand some people object, on grounds having
nothing to do with disabilities, to links that generate new browser windows.
I don't know what the basis of their objection is, but I wonder whether the
same people object every time their word processing application prompts them
for information with dialog boxes (for font selection, saving the file, and
so forth) rather than removing their document from the main window and
replacing it there with the prompt. Or whether it bothers them that the Help
command launches a separate window rather than, again, replacing the
document they're working on with the Help content.

Anyway, popups are useful for web-interface applications for exactly the
same reasons. But now, learning about accessibility issues, I have read that
popups are troublesome for people using adaptive software for visual
impairments. I would have thought that it might suffice to provide a
positive indication to such users that a link will open a separate window,
to indicate in the new window that it *is* a new window, and to provide a
message in the new window indicating that it should be closed to return to
the main window.

Apparently, that's not enough, and popups aren't allowed. Trying to find out
*why* there's an outright ban, I found in Google Groups a posting explaining
that, "It is a royal pain in the posterior to find your way back to where
you started when sites start spawning new windows. In MS Windows, you
cannot assume that when you kill the new window (Alt-F4 or whatever) you
will go back to the previous windows. The OS might decide to give the
desktop the focus, for example."

If I provide cues such as those I mentioned above, is this the sole
remaining objection? If so, can this be overcome by placing a link at the
top of the popup that reads, "Return to main window", and which uses script
to explicitly activate the main window before closing the popup?

Theoretically script is also not allowed--but I had understood that that was
only if it caused changes in the interface that weren't discernible to the
disabled user. The use of script here is specifically to *make* a change
discernible to the user. Does that change things?

If none of these considerations is sufficient to override the general ban on
popups, then what does one do instead, keeping in mind that the application
*also* has to operate in a manner that will be intuitive to the sighted
user?

--
Harlan Messinger
Remove the first dot from my e-mail address.
Veuillez ôter le premier point de mon adresse de courriel.

[Jim Dabell]

Jeff Kish wrote:

[snip]

Does anyone know the basics or mechanics of how the popups are blocked?

Just a complete guess, but the way I would implement it is have a
user-interaction flag that defaults to false. Upon any user interaction
(clicking on something that has a Javascript onclick event handler, for
example), the flag is set to true for that event handler. Then, in
window.open(), check to see if the flag is set or not. If it isn't, don't
display the popup.

Of course, you can just disable Javascript or window.open() entirely; I'm
just talking about so-called "smart" popup blockers that are intended to
block popup ads, but not "legitimate " popups.

--
Jim Dabell

[Steve Pugh]

Jeff Kish <je*******@mro. com> wrote:

Does anyone know the basics or mechanics of how the popups are blocked?

At the most basic - look for window.open in the code and hit it with a
large hammer until it stops working.

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <st***@pugh.net > <http://steve.pugh.net/>

[Isofarro]

Steve Pugh wrote:

Jeff Kish <je*******@mro. com> wrote:

Does anyone know the basics or mechanics of how the popups are blocked?

At the most basic - look for window.open in the code and hit it with a
large hammer until it stops working.

Oh, you mean _this_ snippet:

if (obj==window.op en) {
obj.bork().bork ().bork()
}
Or does that only work in the special edition of Opera7?
--
Iso.
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