http://gto.ie-studios.net/index.php
When you view the above site in IE, if the 1st of the three product
images is tall enough to push the cell down a couple of pixels, IE
somehow doesn't show that happening.
But if you look at it in Firefox you can see the small gap of white
where the semi-circle image is broken.
I've tried changing the background colors to gray in cells and tables
where I can, but no change.
I know the proper fix is to change the size of the image to be a few
pixels smaller, and I will, but in the meantime, why can't I find what
cell is being puched, and why doesn't my changing bgcolors fix the
break from being so obvious, and why does Firefox show the break but
IE is somehow ignoring it. That's the more annoying question.
Thanks!
Liam
Jul 23 '05
33  4781 
LRW wrote: Holy moly! You're kidding?! 76 errors on the one page?
Indeed!
Even after using
Dreamweaver MX (so much for assuming it coded appropriately,)
Excuse me while I laugh until I wet myself.
and what I
thought was pretty basic, standard, ordinary HTML when by hand.
That's...astoun ding.
Yes.
How.
I don't know, I'm, still damp.
Looking through some of these...a lot are ALT tag required.
ALT tags?
Now, I know ALT
tags
ALT TAGS?????
<alt>?
Or do you mean the alt attribute? See, I'm sorta picking on you, but I
mean to illustrate that when you use the wrong term it looks sorta silly
and makes people react in a different way than you'd prefer. Since you're
obviously new to HTML I'll cut you a little slack.
But I'll tell you a secret - I rarely post here without looking shit up,
without testing code on 4 different browsers, and you know why? I don't
want to be seen as an idiot. That's the lengths I go to, and I think
they're appropriate...
are nice for when people are using audible site readers or text
browsers like Lynx, but..."required "? Why are they required?
What if the user is on a low bandwidth connection and must turn off
browsers to do anything within 20 minutes? It's sure nice for them.
It's not nice, however, for the blind. It's ESSENTIAL. And that's why it's
required.
And, even for sites that have a LOT of individual images, especially when
they're just background, for appearance only images?
If the image delivers a specific message, use that as the alt value.
<img src="buynow.png " ... alt="Buy WhamNet Now!!!">
If the image gives information otherwise not available in the content,
provide it in the alt.
<img src="chart3.jpg " ... alt="In 1997, Joe Flank owned 37% of WhamNet
stock, Sally Poopstain owned 31%, and Hopkin Green Frog owned the
remaining 32%.">
If the image could be eliminated and the user would suffer no loss in
content, use null alt text.
<img src="prettypic. jpg" ... alt="">
In our last episode, <IaQqd.175919$R 05.163664@attbi _s53>, the lovely and
talented LRW broadcast on comp.infosystem s. www.authoring.html: "jmm-list-gn" <jm************ ***@sohnen-moe.com> wrote in message
news:Re******** ************@gi ganews.com... LRW wrote:
All the uh, validation errors? New to HTML, eh?
<http://validator.w3.or g/detailed.html>
<http://validator.w3.or g/check?uri=http% 3A%2F%2Fgto.ie-studios.net%2Fi ndex.php&charse t=%28detect+aut omatically%29&d octype=Inline>
Holy moly! You're kidding?! 76 errors on the one page? Even after using
Dreamweaver MX (so much for assuming it coded appropriately,) and what I
thought was pretty basic, standard, ordinary HTML when by hand.
That's...astoun ding.
How.
Looking through some of these...a lot are ALT tag required. Now, I know ALT
tags are nice for when people are using audible site readers or text
browsers like Lynx, but..."required "? Why are they required?
And, even for sites that have a LOT of individual images, especially when
they're just background, for appearance only images?
Since the ALT text is supposed to be substituted for the image, it is
logical to use an empty ALT text (i.e. ALT="") when the image is purely
decorative (like scrollwork, for example). Otherwise many user agents will
insert something like [IMAGE] and the user will wonder what the image is
(besides the all of the [IMAGE]s where the images are only spacers will make
mincemeat out of the page). There is no ALT attribute for images that are
only background, but then, they don't belong in the HTML.
--
Lars Eighner -finger for geek code- ei*****@io.com http://www.io.com/~eighner/
War hath no fury like a noncombatant.
- Charles Edward Montague
On Tue, 30 Nov 2004 01:42:12 GMT, LRW <de**@celticbea r.com> wrote:
"jmm-list-gn" <jm************ ***@sohnen-moe.com> wrote in message
news:Re******** ************@gi ganews.com... LRW wrote:
All the uh, validation errors? New to HTML, eh?
<http://validator.w3.or g/detailed.html>
<http://validator.w3.or g/check?uri=http% 3A%2F%2Fgto.ie-studios.net%2Fi ndex.php&charse t=%28detect+aut omatically%29&d octype=Inline>
Oh yeah, sorry to post again but I just thought of something else...
Line 255, column 94: value of attribute "ALIGN" cannot be "ABSMIDDLE" ;
must
be one of "TOP", "MIDDLE", "BOTTOM", "LEFT", "RIGHT"
Since when is "ABSMIDDLE" not allowed? It's an option in one of my HTML
books, one of my cheatsheets (a published one someone wrote, not one I
made,) and an option in Dreamweaver (which I guess is evidently
meaningless.)
I like you. Here's a link.
[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html]
This is a list of every official HTML 4.01 element in existence. And the
following is all the attributes.
[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/attributes.html]
If it's not in these lists, it cannot validate.
Now, some browsers will accept non-standard attributes and values. It's
like the sign, though, hung in a nearby trailer park: "This home protected
by shotgun three nights a week. You guess which 3."
Are ALL of these errors serious errors? I mean, will 90% of them really
cause any actual problems for anyone?
All will cause problems for someone, I can't say more. But as it's so easy
to cause problems for no one, why do it?>
"Neal" <ne*****@yahoo. com> wrote in message
news:op******** ******@news.ind ividual.net... LRW wrote: Even after using Dreamweaver MX (so much for assuming it coded appropriately,)
Excuse me while I laugh until I wet myself.
Wow. There was a time I laughed at people who used Frontpage...lit tle did I
know Dreamweaver would become today's Frontpage. =/
ALT TAGS?????
<alt>?
Or do you mean the alt attribute? See, I'm sorta picking on you, but I
mean to illustrate that when you use the wrong term it looks sorta silly
and makes people react in a different way than you'd prefer. Since you're
obviously new to HTML I'll cut you a little slack.
OK, I'm going to go ahead and embarass myself and say that I'd been using
HTML since 1996 with "Teach Yourself HTML is 21 Days".
I used to write Web pages with CoffeeCup and Notepad and laugh and people
who used GUI's. Until I realized why the heck am I spending 4 times as long
to do something I could use a GUI for (mainly talking about tables) and so
started using Dreamweaver.
Yeah, so I use the wrong terms all the time...that comes from teaching
oneself how to do something by looking at other people's source code. =/
It's not nice, however, for the blind. It's ESSENTIAL. And that's why it's
required.
Fairnuff.
If the image could be eliminated and the user would suffer no loss in
content, use null alt text.
<img src="prettypic. jpg" ... alt="">
Never thought of that. I guess that's a good tip to remember.
Thanks.
"Lars Eighner" <ei*****@io.com > wrote in message
news:sl******** ***********@goo dwill.io.com... Since the ALT text is supposed to be substituted for the image, it is
logical to use an empty ALT text (i.e. ALT="") when the image is purely
decorative (like scrollwork, for example). Otherwise many user agents
will
insert something like [IMAGE] and the user will wonder what the image is
(besides the all of the [IMAGE]s where the images are only spacers will
make
mincemeat out of the page). There is no ALT attribute for images that are
only background, but then, they don't belong in the HTML.
Wait, what? Don't belong in the HTML? OK you lost me here. How can something
not be in the HTML? I mean, even dynamicly generated data like PHP, the echo
to the browser still has to be in HTML.
What evidently basic and fundamental aspect of Web design am I completely
missing?
(I have a feeling it's something to do with CSS or XML...or something. The
former I've only taught myself enough to not use FONT tags anymore, and the
later....I know how to spell. *g*).
Thanks for replying!
Liam
"Neal" <ne*****@yahoo. com> wrote in message
news:op******** ******@news.ind ividual.net... Since when is "ABSMIDDLE" not allowed? It's an option in one of my HTML
books, one of my cheatsheets (a published one someone wrote, not one I
made,) and an option in Dreamweaver (which I guess is evidently
meaningless.)
I like you. Here's a link.
[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html]
This is a list of every official HTML 4.01 element in existence. And the
following is all the attributes.
[http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/attributes.html]
Well, thanks. That's some good info I was not aware of.
All will cause problems for someone, I can't say more. But as it's so easy
to cause problems for no one, why do it?>
OK, here's my problem. Aside from being an idiot. As I mentioned before, I
taught myself HTML back in '96, and since then basically piecemeal from
Google searches and source code viewing and Dreamweaver. (And to think I
thought that was an industry standard program.) I thought I already knew the
basics of HTML. Little did I realize that it's actually heavily regulated
and standardized and...whatever.
So, although I know how to write a table by hand in Notepad and use DIV tags
more than your average Web author, I guess I didn't know that there was a
LOT that I didn't know. Know what I mean?
Now that I know I know not at all close to what I thought I knew, and
evidently should know...uhm, what do you recommend I do from here to relearn
the right way? or new way for all I know. A lot has probably changed in 8
years. (Hey, I'm fortunate I found out FONT tags were no longer appropriate
and learned about CSS's. *g*)
Is there a particular book or beginners Web site you'd recommend for the
HTML beginner who is at least bright enough to have taught himself once
before?
Thanks for the replies!
Liam
Previously in comp.infosystem s. www.authoring.html, LRW
<de**@celticbea r.com> said:
[background images] Wait, what? Don't belong in the HTML?
That's what he said. :-)
OK you lost me here. How can something not be in the HTML?
Don't put it there.
I mean, even dynamicly generated data like PHP, the echo
to the browser still has to be in HTML.
Doesn't *have* to be, but usually the content of the page is in the
HTML, yes.
What evidently basic and fundamental aspect of Web design am I completely
missing?
CSS.
(I have a feeling it's something to do with CSS or XML...or something.
You feel right. HTML describes the semantic structure of the page. CSS
suggests the presentation.
The
former I've only taught myself enough to not use FONT tags anymore,
Then its about time to learn. :-)
css tutorials and other fun 'n giggly css stuff: http://www.css.nu/ http://www.mako4css.com/ http://www.richinstyle.com/ http://www.blazonry.com/css/ http://www.w3schools.com/css/ http://www.websitetips.com/css/ http://www.htmlhelp.com/reference/css/ http://www.pageresource.com/dhtml/indexcss.htm http://www.climbtothestars.org/coding/cssbasic/ http://www.htmlcenter.com/tutorials/index.cfm/css/ http://www.freewebmastertips.com/php...nt.php3?aid=48 http://www.canit.se/~griffon/web/wri...ylesheets.html http://www.utoronto.ca/ian/books/xht...pt/css-4a.html http://idm.internet.com/articles/200...utorial1a.html http://www.greytower.net/en/archive/.../tsutsumi.html http://www.westciv.com.au/style_mast.../css_tutorial/ http://webmonkey.com/authoring/style...tutorial1.html
layout examples: http://www.glish.com/css/ http://www.csszengarden.com/ http://www.wannabegirl.org/css/ http://tantek.com/CSS/Examples/ http://www.saila.com/usage/layouts/ http://www.bluerobot.com/web/layouts/ http://www.benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/ http://www.xs4all.nl/~apple77/columns/ http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/ http://www.htmler.org/tutorials/3/1.html http://css.nu/articles/floating-boxes.html http://webhost.bridgew.edu/etribou/layouts/ http://www.roguelibrarian.com/lj/index.html http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=CssLayouts http://ecoculture.com/styleguide/r/rollovers.html http://thenoodleincident.com/tutoria...son/index.html http://www.webreference.com/authorin...yout/advanced/
rounded corners: http://www.albin.net/CSS/roundedCorners/ http://www.webweaver.org/dan/css/corners/ http://www.guyfisher.com/builder/workshop/css/corners/
slants: http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/slantinfo.html
centring: http://stone.thecoreworlds.net/www/centre/
lists: http://www.alistapart.com/stories/taminglists/
pure css menus: http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/menus/demo.html
master compatibility charts: http://www.xs4all.nl/~ppk/css2tests/intro.html http://www.blooberry.com/indexdot/css/index.html http://macedition.com/cb/resources/a...sssupport.html
old: http://www.immix.net/html/CSSGuide.htm http://devedge.netscape.com/library/...3/css-support/
hiding CSS from crappy browsers: http://centricle.com/ref/css/filters/ http://www.ericmeyeroncss.com/bonus/trick-hide.html http://www.w3development.de/css/hide_css_from_browsers/
css checkers: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/ http://www.htmlhelp.com/tools/csscheck/
cascading style sheets, level 1 specification http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-CSS1.html
cascading style sheets, level 2 specification http://www.w3.org/tr/rec-css2/cover.html
cascading style sheets, level 2 revision 1 working draft http://www.w3.org/TR/2002/WD-CSS21-20020802/
(thanks brucie)
--
Mark Parnell http://www.clarkecomputers.com.au
In our last episode, <MvQqd.110641$V 41.33887@attbi_ s52>, the lovely and
talented LRW broadcast on comp.infosystem s. www.authoring.html: "Lars Eighner" <ei*****@io.com > wrote in message
news:sl******** ***********@goo dwill.io.com...
Since the ALT text is supposed to be substituted for the image, it is
logical to use an empty ALT text (i.e. ALT="") when the image is purely
decorative (like scrollwork, for example). Otherwise many user agents
will
insert something like [IMAGE] and the user will wonder what the image is
(besides the all of the [IMAGE]s where the images are only spacers will
make
mincemeat out of the page). There is no ALT attribute for images that are
only background, but then, they don't belong in the HTML.
Wait, what? Don't belong in the HTML? OK you lost me here. How can something
not be in the HTML? I mean, even dynamicly generated data like PHP, the echo
to the browser still has to be in HTML.
What evidently basic and fundamental aspect of Web design am I completely
missing?
Removing things like background-image to stylesheets. Okay you can
put it in style attributes. But there is still no ALT attribute required
(or allowed) for background images.
Okay, there is a way to emulate ALT text for background images. Use
display: none; with the text. Styles-enabled browsers will show the
background image and ignore the text. Browsers without style or with
styles off will show the text and ignore the background image.
<div class="sample">
<p class="hide">Ex treme close-up of foo in background</p>
</div>
with the styles:
..sample { background-image: url("bigfoo.gif "); }
/* Note: no place for an alt attribute in url */
..hide { display: none; }
(I have a feeling it's something to do with CSS or XML...or something. The
former I've only taught myself enough to not use FONT tags anymore, and
the later....I know how to spell. *g*).
Thanks for replying!
Liam
--
Lars Eighner -finger for geek code- ei*****@io.com http://www.io.com/~eighner/
War on Terrorism: Bad News from the Sanity Front
"Tactical nuclear capabilities should be used against the bin Laden
camps in the desert of Afghanistan." -Thomas Woodrow,_Washin gton Times_
Previously in comp.infosystem s. www.authoring.html, LRW
<de**@celticbea r.com> said: Well, thanks. That's some good info I was not aware of.
Unfortunately many (probably most) web authors aren't.
OK, here's my problem. Aside from being an idiot. As I mentioned before, I
taught myself HTML back in '96, and since then basically piecemeal from
Google searches and source code viewing and Dreamweaver. (And to think I
thought that was an industry standard program.)
It pretty much *is* the industry standard. Doesn't mean it's any good.
:-)
So, although I know how to write a table by hand in Notepad and use DIV tags
more than your average Web author, I guess I didn't know that there was a
LOT that I didn't know. Know what I mean?
Indeed. BTW: You *do* know that using tables for layout purposes is
frowned upon, don't you? ;-)
Now that I know I know not at all close to what I thought I knew, and
evidently should know...uhm, what do you recommend I do from here to relearn
the right way?
Read the specs. Then read them again. Then if you've got any questions,
ask here.
or new way for all I know. A lot has probably changed in 8
years.
Yes, a *lot* has changed since 1996.
(Hey, I'm fortunate I found out FONT tags were no longer appropriate
and learned about CSS's. *g*)
That's just the beginning of what CSS can do.
Is there a particular book or beginners Web site you'd recommend for the
HTML beginner who is at least bright enough to have taught himself once
before? http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/ http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS2/
--
Mark Parnell http://www.clarkecomputers.com.au
LRW wrote: Is there a particular book or beginners Web site you'd recommend for the
HTML beginner who is at least bright enough to have taught himself once
before?
I'd recommend [ http://www.w3schools.com] for a starter. Do it all in
Notepad, or download Crimson Editor, which is what I use
[ http://www.crimsoneditor.com]. Then, look at [ http://www.htmldog.com] but
do not fall for the XHTML bit, it's not needed and if it ever is a
well-coded HTML 4.01 Strict page will easily convert. Use HTML 4.01
Strict, which is amazingly similar to XHTML 1.0 Strict (because it's based
on HTML) aside from a few quirks you'll discover. This thread has been closed and replies have been disabled. Please start a new discussion. Similar topics | |
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