IE <-> Mozilla is driving me insane.

[dip]

pardon the coversational manner of my thread subject.
i'm having issues with the way that the two browsers handle CSS.

this is an element i've defined in my style sheet.

===========
sm {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}
===========

in mozilla, i can insert this tag anywhere i want, and the browser
renders it fine. (ie. <sm>this is text</sm>)

IE ignores the tag completely.

if i create an element that looks like this...

===========
..small {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}
===========

.... and then use it as a "div class," IE mostly gets it right.
(ie. <div class="small">t his is text</div>

am i doing something "wrong?"
is one of these methods "more correct" than the other?

i'm at the point where i want to scrap CSS altogether and go back to
defining fonts inline. at least then i had a pretty good idea of how
they would render.
(i won't even go into the "tableless" nonsense.)

[Jim Moe]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

this is an element i've defined in my style sheet.
===========
sm {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}
===========
in mozilla, i can insert this tag anywhere i want, and the browser
renders it fine. (ie. <sm>this is text</sm>)

IE ignores the tag completely.

You must prepend a dot (".") to the class name: ".sm". IE only
implements a subset of CSS and parts of that are poorly done.

--
jmm dash list (at) sohnen-moe (dot) com
(Remove .AXSPAMGN for email)

[C A Upsdell]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

pardon the coversational manner of my thread subject.
i'm having issues with the way that the two browsers handle CSS.

this is an element i've defined in my style sheet.

sm {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}
There is no such tag as 'sm' in HTML, so AFAIK you can't set CSS
properties for it. Mozilla accepts it, but I don't know why.
if i create an element that looks like this...

.small {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}

... and then use it as a "div class," IE mostly gets it right.
(ie. <div class="small">t his is text</div>

Instead of using:

font: 10px arial;

I would suggest that you use:

font-size:10px; font-family:Arial, sans-serif;

since I seem to remember that some older browsers don't handle the first
as well.

You say "IE mostly gets it right": please be more specific; give an
example with a URL.

[Steve Pugh]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

this is an element i've defined in my style sheet.

sm {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}

in mozilla, i can insert this tag anywhere i want, and the browser
renders it fine. (ie. <sm>this is text</sm>)
Is this an HTML or an XML document?
You can't just invent HTML elements at your whim.

And why invent a <sm> element when the <small> element already exists,
isn't deprecated and could easily be given the above styles by your
style sheet?
IE ignores the tag completely.

if i create an element that looks like this...

.small {
font: 10px arial;
color: #53278F;
}

... and then use it as a "div class," IE mostly gets it right.
(ie. <div class="small">t his is text</div>
How does IE only get it "mostly" right? What does IE get wrong?
am i doing something "wrong?"
Using px for font sizes.
Setting a specific font-family without setting a generic family.
Setting a colour without setting a background colour.
Using a class name that refers to what the class looks like rather
than what it is.
is one of these methods "more correct" than the other?
The second method is "less incorrect".
i'm at the point where i want to scrap CSS altogether and go back to
defining fonts inline. at least then i had a pretty good idea of how
they would render.
(i won't even go into the "tableless" nonsense.)

Okay, we won't go into helping you.

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <st***@pugh.net > <http://steve.pugh.net/>

[dip]

these might be a dumb questions:

if i prepend a dot to anything, do i have to use <div class="sm"></div>
in the HTML?

should i make sure all of my style elements are .something, and always
use div?

[Steve Pugh]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

if i prepend a dot to anything, do i have to use <div class="sm"></div>
in the HTML?
..foo is the CSS selector for any element with class="foo" in the HTML.

..foo matches <div class="foo">... </div> and <p class="foo">... </p> and
<strong class="foo">... </strong>

p.foo only matches <p class="foo">... </p>
should i make sure all of my style elements are .something, and always
use div?

No. Use the most appropriate HTML element for the content you are
marking up. Then add CSS on top of that as needed.

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <st***@pugh.net > <http://steve.pugh.net/>

[kaeli]

In article <11************ **********@f14g 2000cwb.googleg roups.com>,
di*@butter.toas t.net enlightened us with...

should i make sure all of my style elements are .something, and always
use div?

Or a span. Or a paragraph. Or whatever you want. A .something can apply to
any element as long as what you have in there applies to the element you're
using it on.

..bordered { border: 1px solid navy; }

<p class="bordered ">yada yada</p>
<table class="bordered "> ...</table>

Or if you almost always want an element to look some way, say all your
emphasized elements should be black and bold unless you specify otherwise, do

em {
color: black;
font-weight: bold;
}

em.purple {
color: purple;
font-weight: bold;
}

<em>this is normal emphasized text</em>
<em class="purple"> this is purple emphasized text</em>

Note that you can do this because the EM element already exists, unlike your
SM example.

--
--
~kaeli~
He had a photographic memory that was never developed.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

[dip]

>Is this an HTML or an XML document?

You can't just invent HTML elements at your whim.
it's HTML.
and apparently i can, so long as i'm only viewing the page with
Mozilla.
And why invent a <sm> element when the <small> element already exists,
isn't deprecated and could easily be given the above styles by your
style sheet?
it was just an example...
and yes, you're right.
How does IE only get it "mostly" right? What does IE get wrong?

well, in continuing to develop my apparently very incorrect style
sheet, i tried to create superscript.

sup {
font:10px arial;
color: #53278F;
vertical-align: 20%;
}

IE appears to ignore the vertical align element.

i'm sorry if i'm asking the question the wrong way, or if my lack of
knowledge is somehow offensive. i hope that in asking stupid
questions, someday i might be as cool as you.

[Beauregard T. Shagnasty]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

Is this an HTML or an XML document? You can't just invent HTML
elements at your whim.
it's HTML.

No, it's not.
and apparently i can, so long as i'm only viewing the
page with Mozilla.
Apparently, Mozilla is mis-interpreting it as xml/xhtml or something
else. It is not html.
well, in continuing to develop my apparently very incorrect style
sheet, i tried to create superscript.

sup { font:10px arial; color: #53278F; vertical-align: 20%; }
sup { font:70% arial, sans-serif; color: #53278F; vertical-align: 20%;}

...seems to work for me in Firefox and IE6. (Don't use px/pt for font
sizes, and specify a generic fallback.) I have good luck using
line-height: 0; instead of a vertical-align.
IE appears to ignore the vertical align element.
Which version?
i'm sorry if i'm asking the question the wrong way,
There is a knack to it...
or if my lack
of knowledge is somehow offensive. i hope that in asking stupid
questions, someday i might be as cool as you.

Um, statements like that don't help.

--
-bts
-This space intentionally left blank.

[Steve Pugh]

di*@butter.toas t.net wrote:

well, in continuing to develop my apparently very incorrect style
sheet, i tried to create superscript.

sup {
font:10px arial;
color: #53278F;
vertical-align: 20%;
}
If you had any problems using google to look up why px for font size,
font family with no generic family, and colour with no background
colour are problems then you can always ask here (the middle one is
actually debatable but the first and last are sound advice).

Now, do you want your superscripts to be a different colour and font
to the surrounding text? Normally you don't so you wouldn't set those
properties. Just font-size and vertical-align and/or line-height.
IE appears to ignore the vertical align element.
Seems to work here. The baseline of the superscript is roughly 20%
above the baseline of the rest of the text (IOW somewhat lower than
the unstyled baseline for superscripts) in IE5.01, IE6, Firefox 1.0
and Opera 8b3.
i'm sorry if i'm asking the question the wrong way, or if my lack of
knowledge is somehow offensive. i hope that in asking stupid
questions, someday i might be as cool as you.

It's eleven o'clock on a bank holiday Monday and I'm at home posting
to Usenet. If you think I'm cool then your life must really suck.

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <st***@pugh.net > <http://steve.pugh.net/>