Quick questions...

[earthlinkmail]

....you experienced programmers of C; did you start with C? What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today? Would you
suggest starting with REALbasic first for a n00b? I am completely new
to programming and using a Mac and would like some input as to where to
begin a career in programming. I know this is probably a somewhat
undefined question, but would appreciate you input/advice. Thanks.

[Greg Comeau]

In article <00************ *************** **@news.verizon .net>,
Randy Howard <ra*********@FO OverizonBAR.net > wrote:

Thad Smith wrote
(in article
<43*********** ************@au th.newsreader.o ctanews.com>):

What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today?

I think the OP will discover that the answer depends upon the
age of the respondent, and won't be of much use today. He
probably doesn't want to start out with PDP-11 assembler,
Fortran, Snobol, Basic, etc.

IMO, the problem is that you don't not want something like that
either, given whatever the flavor of the month is today.
...
True, although as others have said, C probably isn't a great
first language, unless you have a really good teacher.

IMO, the problem is that this is true of any language.
Obviously some more than others, but often a rock and
a hard place through which to legitamately choose something
truly superior for first language, whatever that means or
should mean anyway.
--
Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?

[vishnuvyas]

Walter Roberson wrote:

In article <11************ *********@g14g2 000cwa.googlegr oups.com>,
vishnuvyas <vi********@gma il.com> wrote:

But thats still the tip of the iceberg, if you want a career in
programming you have to know a whole bunch of languages from purely
declarative ones like SQL to a bunch of domain specific languages that
no-one uses. Also you have to deal with monstrocities like standards
compliance, compiler issues, optimisiations, portability and friends..
[OT]

I suspect you did not mean to write that friends are a form of
monstrosity ;-)

Well, I din't mean friends in the C++ sense if thats what you mean.
What I meant was you have to worry about things like portability and
things associated with portability (things like when i exactly need 32
bits what type should I actually use).
If you lie to the compiler, it will get its revenge. -- Eric Sosman

[Walter Roberson]

In article <11************ **********@z14g 2000cwz.googleg roups.com>,
vishnuvyas <vi********@gma il.com> wrote:

Walter Roberson wrote:

In article <11************ *********@g14g2 000cwa.googlegr oups.com>,
vishnuvyas <vi********@gma il.com> wrote:

>Also you have to deal with monstrocities like standards
>compliance, compiler issues, optimisiations, portability and friends..

I suspect you did not mean to write that friends are a form of
monstrosity ;-)

Well, I din't mean friends in the C++ sense if thats what you mean.
What I meant was you have to worry about things like portability and
things associated with portability (things like when i exactly need 32
bits what type should I actually use).

Heh, no, I knew what you -meant-... I was just remarking OT-ishly
on a bit of grammatical trivia according to which your sentance has
another meaning completely.

As written, your sentance was equivilent to,
"... with monstrosities like friends, standards, compliance [...]"
implying that as you develop a career in programming, those whom you
have friendships with start to appear to become monsterous. It's the
stereotypical geek anti-socialization effect -- that the more technoid
you become, the fewer friends you make.

The sentance you wanted to write should have an 'and' before
'portability', but there is debate over which of these two to use:

Also you have to deal with monstrocities like standards
compliance, compiler issues, optimisiations and portability and friends..

versus

Also you have to deal with monstrocities like standards
compliance, compiler issues, optimisiations, and portability and friends..
--
If you lie to the compiler, it will get its revenge. -- Eric Sosman

[Erik de Castro Lopo]

ea***********@e arthlink.net wrote:

...you experienced programmers of C; did you start with C?
Before C I had programmed in BASIC, Pascal, Modula2 and
assembler.
What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today?
I did a Baechelor of Engineering degree in Computer
Engineering.
Would you
suggest starting with REALbasic first for a n00b?

Probably no. The BASIC family of langugaes are not
highy reguarded in the programing world.

Python is at least as good a learning language as
BASIC and it will prevent you learning some of
the bad habits that BASIC may teach you.

Erik
--
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
Erik de Castro Lopo
+-----------------------------------------------------------+
Open Source and Free Software means that you never sacrifice quality
of the code for meeting deadlines set up by people not participating
directly in the software development process.

[Randy Howard]

Greg Comeau wrote
(in article <dk**********@p anix1.panix.com >):

In article <00************ *************** **@news.verizon .net>,
Randy Howard <ra*********@FO OverizonBAR.net > wrote:

Thad Smith wrote
(in article
<43************ ***********@aut h.newsreader.oc tanews.com>):

What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today?

I think the OP will discover that the answer depends upon the
age of the respondent, and won't be of much use today. He
probably doesn't want to start out with PDP-11 assembler,
Fortran, Snobol, Basic, etc.

IMO, the problem is that you don't not want something like that
either, given whatever the flavor of the month is today.

You can you decode all the extra negatives in there? I'm not
sure I follow what you intended to say.
--
Randy Howard (2reply remove FOOBAR)
"The power of accurate observation is called cynicism by those
who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw

[Greg Comeau]

In article <00************ *************** **@news.verizon .net>,
Randy Howard <ra*********@FO OverizonBAR.net > wrote:

Greg Comeau wrote
(in article <dk**********@p anix1.panix.com >):

In article <00************ *************** **@news.verizon .net>,
Randy Howard <ra*********@FO OverizonBAR.net > wrote:

Thad Smith wrote
(in article <43************ ***********@aut h.newsreader.oc tanews.com>):
> What course
> of study did you pursue to get to where you are today?
I think the OP will discover that the answer depends upon the
age of the respondent, and won't be of much use today. He
probably doesn't want to start out with PDP-11 assembler,
Fortran, Snobol, Basic, etc.

IMO, the problem is that you don't not want something like that
either, given whatever the flavor of the month is today.

You can you decode all the extra negatives in there? I'm not
sure I follow what you intended to say.

You said something won't be of much use and that we probably
don't want to do something. I'm saying it might be of use,
and that we might want to.
--
Greg Comeau / Celebrating 20 years of Comeauity!
Comeau C/C++ ONLINE ==> http://www.comeaucomputing.com/tryitout
World Class Compilers: Breathtaking C++, Amazing C99, Fabulous C90.
Comeau C/C++ with Dinkumware's Libraries... Have you tried it?

[vishnuvyas]

Walter Roberson wrote:

Heh, no, I knew what you -meant-... I was just remarking OT-ishly
on a bit of grammatical trivia according to which your sentance has
another meaning completely. Thanks for the grammar check.
As written, your sentance was equivilent to,
"... with monstrosities like friends, standards, compliance [...]"
implying that as you develop a career in programming, those whom you
have friendships with start to appear to become monsterous.

I guess the opposite is rather true, I do get 'You look scary' comments
after a 16hr hackathon ;-)

Cheers
Vishnu.

[Emmanuel Delahaye]

ea***********@e arthlink.net a écrit :

...you experienced programmers of C; did you start with C? What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today? Would you
suggest starting with REALbasic first for a n00b? I am completely new
to programming and using a Mac and would like some input as to where to
begin a career in programming. I know this is probably a somewhat
undefined question, but would appreciate you input/advice. Thanks.

82-84 : BASIC (Apple II, Commodore, IBM-PC) (self-learning)
87 : Pascal (The Revelation !) (self-learning)
87 : ASM 86 (course), C (self-learning)
88 : C (course), HP BASIC (HP 9000) (job)
91 : ASM 51 (job)
93 : ASM 68k, some VB.. (job)
94 til now : C (job)

--
C is a sharp tool

[Das]

ea***********@e arthlink.net wrote:

...you experienced programmers of C; did you start with C? What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today? Would you
suggest starting with REALbasic first for a n00b? I am completely new
to programming and using a Mac and would like some input as to where to
begin a career in programming. I know this is probably a somewhat
undefined question, but would appreciate you input/advice. Thanks.

Are You serious??? then discuss the pros and cons and field of
application then decide.

If you ask me how i started then, Well there were some stuffs we called
it HC(Home Computers BBC Micro), They have a BASIC Interpreter inside
the ROM. So it it infered i started with BASIC. Then To some other
BASICs e.g BASICA,GWBASIC. ..
Well Then to FORTRAN(My graduate course included it), Then to PASCAL,
Assembly-x86, C and then C++.

To your surprise i have forgotten all except C and some Assembly Stuff.
And For your information I am learning C and Assembly everyday.

[John B]

ea***********@e arthlink.net wrote:

...you experienced programmers of C; did you start with C? What course
of study did you pursue to get to where you are today? Would you
suggest starting with REALbasic first for a n00b? I am completely new
to programming and using a Mac and would like some input as to where to
begin a career in programming. I know this is probably a somewhat
undefined question, but would appreciate you input/advice. Thanks.

If you want to be a programmer, the language you must learn first is
pseudo-code.

The secret of a good programmer is nothing to do with which language you
write your code in but everything to do with planning the program correctly,
understanding what the program is supposed to do and getting the logic
correct. Once you have written your program in pseudo-code then translate it
to whichever language you need to use for the customer that is paying your
wages.

--
John B