Python & the job market

[kbass]

I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market looks
for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs (probably one or
two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA and SA positions that I
have seen require Perl and most development position require Java or C++ so
how can learning Python benefit my career if there are little to no chance
that an employer will require the use of Python or consider using Python
over other programming languages such as Java?

kbass

[Aahz]

In article <a1************ ******@fe3.colu mbus.rr.com>,
kbass <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote:

I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market
looks for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs
(probably one or two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA
and SA positions that I have seen require Perl and most development
position require Java or C++ so how can learning Python benefit my
career if there are little to no chance that an employer will require
the use of Python or consider using Python over other programming
languages such as Java?

Have you looked at http://www.python.org/Jobs.html ?

In general, jobs that require programming but not as a primary skill
(such as DBA and SA positions) allow one the opportunity to add Python
gradually and silently. They're easier than straight programming jobs in
some respects because projects tend to be smaller and less visible.
--
Aahz (aa**@pythoncra ft.com) <*> http://www.pythoncraft.com/

"usenet imitates usenet" --Darkhawk

[Cameron Laird]

In article <a1************ ******@fe3.colu mbus.rr.com>,
kbass <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote:

I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market looks
for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs (probably one or
two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA and SA positions that I
have seen require Perl and most development position require Java or C++ so
how can learning Python benefit my career if there are little to no chance
that an employer will require the use of Python or consider using Python
over other programming languages such as Java?

kbass

Learning Python is highly unlikely to benefit your career in
the sense of qualifying you for an advertised position, for
the reasons you have cited. The Python job market is ridi-
culously small, although it's grown more over the past year
than I expected.

Learning Python quite likely will benefit your career because
you'll be a better programmer.
--

Cameron Laird <cl****@phaseit .net>
Business: http://www.Phaseit.net

[Skip Montanaro]

kbass> I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job
kbass> market looks for programming using Python.

Better than a year ago. I don't know what it is in overall numbers, but
it definitely seems to be growing.

kbass> I really don't see many jobs (probably one or two) that require
kbass> Python experience at all.

Have you checked out

http://www.python.org/Jobs.html

and the job sites it refers to?

kbass> Most DBA and SA positions that I have seen require Perl and most
kbass> development position require Java or C++ ...

This is not surprising. These languages all have larger installed bases
than Python.

kbass> ... so how can learning Python benefit my career if there are
kbass> little to no chance that an employer will require the use of
kbass> Python or consider using Python over other programming languages
kbass> such as Java?

A fair number of us have figured out ways to do that. Here are some
suggestions:

* Get a job which is nominally not a programming position (say, sys
admin). For the little bits and pieces you wind up writing to do your
job better use Python, then make them available to your fellow sys
admins.

* Infiltrate a job for which another programming language is "required".
Then start looking here

http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/moinmoin/PythonAdvocacy

for ways to convince your colleagues that Python might be a better
choice for some things.

* Hang out your shingle as an independent consultant.

* Got some good ideas and some good skills? Check out Mark
Shuttleworth's bounties page:

http://www.markshuttleworth.com/bounty.html

You have to be a bit more patient and creative, but it's definitely
possible.

Skip

[kbass]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Skip Montanaro" <sk**@pobox.com >
Newsgroups: comp.lang.pytho n
To: "kbass" <kb***@midsouth .rr.com>
Cc: <py*********@py thon.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2004 7:13 PM
Subject: Re: Python & the job market

kbass> I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job
kbass> market looks for programming using Python.

Better than a year ago. I don't know what it is in overall numbers, but
it definitely seems to be growing.

kbass> I really don't see many jobs (probably one or two) that require
kbass> Python experience at all.

Have you checked out

http://www.python.org/Jobs.html

and the job sites it refers to?

kbass> Most DBA and SA positions that I have seen require Perl and most kbass> development position require Java or C++ ...

This is not surprising. These languages all have larger installed bases
than Python.

kbass> ... so how can learning Python benefit my career if there are
kbass> little to no chance that an employer will require the use of
kbass> Python or consider using Python over other programming languages kbass> such as Java?

A fair number of us have figured out ways to do that. Here are some
suggestions:

* Get a job which is nominally not a programming position (say, sys
admin). For the little bits and pieces you wind up writing to do your job better use Python, then make them available to your fellow sys
admins.

* Infiltrate a job for which another programming language is "required". Then start looking here

http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/moinmoin/PythonAdvocacy

for ways to convince your colleagues that Python might be a better
choice for some things.

* Hang out your shingle as an independent consultant.

* Got some good ideas and some good skills? Check out Mark
Shuttleworth's bounties page:

http://www.markshuttleworth.com/bounty.html

You have to be a bit more patient and creative, but it's definitely
possible.

Skip

I have experience about 4 years of Java experience (designed and developed
numerous projects as a consultant in the past), 10+ years of Oracle
experience, about 5 years of Perl experience so programming is not a problem
.. I guess my main point that I should have touch upon was learning Python
and influencing management to go the Python route in a company where Java is
the standard.

The Python Advocacy site is a good starting point to achieve the goal of
influencing direct management but influencing other programmers could be an
endeavor within itself too. One to five programmers developing in Python
would be considered 'rouge programmers' at my company so convincing Java and
VB programs to use Python will be a definite challenge.

It took me about 2 to 4 months to successfully influence management that
Linux AS was a direction that our departmental server should be but
influencing them about Python maybe an uphill battle due to other I.T.
departments and non-I.T. departments using Java and VB. I am up for the
challenge.

I reviewed the projects on Mark Shuttleworth's bounties page and I think
that I will attempt to do some research and try one soon.

kbass

[Cameron Laird]

In article <ma************ *************** ********@python .org>,
kbass <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote:

[DilbertFan]

Do what you love and the money will follow. It works. Don't worry about
jobs.
Read something on metaphysics that talks about how abundance flows to you
when you simply engage in something that is fun and allows the kid in you,
or the Spirit in you, or whatever, to play and to create great stuff.

If you give yourself to other through your talent, (and the more you enjoy
what you're doing, the more value you're giving to everyone who makes use of
your creation), the more value comes right back to you.
If you don't like the spiritual angle here, than read Quantum Physics about
how we create our reality through intentions and thoughts, like The
Holographic Universe by Talbot. If you're 'buzzing' through the joy of
engaging in your passion, you may naturally attract abundance by other
completely unrelated means if doesn't come through programming, or it may
come directly from this area.

Closer to home, read what Bruce Eckel wrote about Doing what you love:
http://mindview.net/WebLog/log-0037

"kbass" <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote in message
news:a1******** **********@fe3. columbus.rr.com ...

I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market looks
for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs (probably one or two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA and SA positions that I have seen require Perl and most development position require Java or C++ so how can learning Python benefit my career if there are little to no chance
that an employer will require the use of Python or consider using Python
over other programming languages such as Java?

kbass

[kbass]

Strangely enough, I have taken on that philosophy in my life and it had lead
me to the love of doing database architecture and development as a career.
:) Using Python or any other programming language would assist me in my
continued endeavor.

kbass


"DilbertFan " <st************ ***********@hot mail.com> wrote in message
news:ct******** **********@news svr27.news.prod igy.com...
| Do what you love and the money will follow. It works. Don't worry about
| jobs.
| Read something on metaphysics that talks about how abundance flows to you
| when you simply engage in something that is fun and allows the kid in you,
| or the Spirit in you, or whatever, to play and to create great stuff.
|
| If you give yourself to other through your talent, (and the more you
enjoy
| what you're doing, the more value you're giving to everyone who makes use
of
| your creation), the more value comes right back to you.
| If you don't like the spiritual angle here, than read Quantum Physics
about
| how we create our reality through intentions and thoughts, like The
| Holographic Universe by Talbot. If you're 'buzzing' through the joy of
| engaging in your passion, you may naturally attract abundance by other
| completely unrelated means if doesn't come through programming, or it may
| come directly from this area.
|
| Closer to home, read what Bruce Eckel wrote about Doing what you love:
| http://mindview.net/WebLog/log-0037
|
| "kbass" <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote in message
| news:a1******** **********@fe3. columbus.rr.com ...
| > I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market
looks
| > for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs (probably one
| or
| > two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA and SA positions
that
| I
| > have seen require Perl and most development position require Java or C++
| so
| > how can learning Python benefit my career if there are little to no
chance
| > that an employer will require the use of Python or consider using Python
| > over other programming languages such as Java?
| >
| > kbass
| >
| >
|
|

[Terry Reedy]

"kbass" <kb***@midsouth .rr.com> wrote in message
news:a1******** **********@fe3. columbus.rr.com ...

I am starting to learn Python but I want to know how the job market looks
for programming using Python. I really don't see many jobs (probably one or two) that require Python experience at all. Most DBA and SA positions that I have seen require Perl and most development position require Java or C++ so how can learning Python benefit my career if there are little to no chance that an employer will require the use of Python or consider using Python
over other programming languages such as Java?

It is not no chance. For instance, Python (desired, a plus, etc) appears 7
times on this page: http://www.google.com/jobs/eng/sw.html

tjr

[Dang Griffith]

On several occasions in the past, Aahz wrote:
A: No.
Q: Is top-posting okay?

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:23:14 GMT, "kbass" <kb***@midsouth .rr.com>
wrote:

"DilbertFan " <st************ ***********@hot mail.com> wrote in message
news:ct******* ***********@new ssvr27.news.pro digy.com...

Do what you love and the money will follow. It works. Don't worry about
jobs.
Read something on metaphysics that talks about how abundance flows to you
when you simply engage in something that is fun and allows the kid in you,
or the Spirit in you, or whatever, to play and to create great stuff.

If you give yourself to other through your talent, (and the more you enjoy
what you're doing, the more value you're giving to everyone who makes use of
your creation), the more value comes right back to you.
If you don't like the spiritual angle here, than read Quantum Physics about
how we create our reality through intentions and thoughts, like The
Holographic Universe by Talbot. If you're 'buzzing' through the joy of
engaging in your passion, you may naturally attract abundance by other
completely unrelated means if doesn't come through programming, or it may
come directly from this area.

Closer to home, read what Bruce Eckel wrote about Doing what you love:
http://mindview.net/WebLog/log-0037

Strangely enough, I have taken on that philosophy in my life and it had lead
me to the love of doing database architecture and development as a career.
:) Using Python or any other programming language would assist me in my
continued endeavor.

Not so strange. I would think that doing anything other than that
would be strange.
--dang