working with classes + php

[Auddog]

I'm new to working with classes. I'm pretty much a self taught php
programmer that uses php mostly for database entry and listings. I would
like to expand my talents and start working with classes. Is there a good
tutorial out there on the web that a novice can understand. I currently
wanting to add a password generator class to one of my existing webpages at
my helpdesk. The class is located at PHPclasses.com
(class.password .generator.php) . Thanks for any help that you can give.

A

[Mike P2]

On May 15, 3:09 pm, "Auddog" <wil...@hotmail .comwrote:

I'm new to working with classes. I'm pretty much a self taught php
programmer that uses php mostly for database entry and listings. I would
like to expand my talents and start working with classes. Is there a good
tutorial out there on the web that a novice can understand. I currently
wanting to add a password generator class to one of my existing webpages at
my helpdesk. The class is located at PHPclasses.com
(class.password .generator.php) . Thanks for any help that you can give.

A

I think learning OOP in PHP causes bad habits. There are too many
different ways to do it. If you learn from a language like Java, you
will certainly get it down very well. PHP5 has many of the features of
Java OOP (not all of them, though).

If you don't have a plethora of time and need to go with the more
practical approach of learning OOP where you will be using it, in PHP,
the PHP manual is the most accurate way to learn it.

http://php.net/oop

-Mike PII

[Dikkie Dik]

I think learning OOP in PHP causes bad habits. There are too many

different ways to do it. If you learn from a language like Java, you
will certainly get it down very well. PHP5 has many of the features of
Java OOP (not all of them, though).

On the contrary. Java also has quite a few unwanted characteristics as
an OO language. I agree that Eiffel would be a better place to start,
but it remains abstract, as it is hardly used. Also, PHP programmers
often have to learn javascript as well, so you gain an understanding of
both class-based and template-based object orientation.

I think the "bad habits" are a good thing to start from. As a resource
on how to learn OO programming, I would also recommend "Refactorin g" by
Martin Fowler. The examples alone in that book can teach you as much as
a good theory book.

I think PHP offers you the opportunity of gently discovering the
advantages of objects. In fact, a lot of people only need to realize the
power of a component like PHPMailer or FPDF to give abstract words like
"code reuse" a firm body.

Best regards

[Jerry Stuckle]

Dikkie Dik wrote:

>I think learning OOP in PHP causes bad habits. There are too many
different ways to do it. If you learn from a language like Java, you
will certainly get it down very well. PHP5 has many of the features of
Java OOP (not all of them, though).

On the contrary. Java also has quite a few unwanted characteristics as
an OO language. I agree that Eiffel would be a better place to start,
but it remains abstract, as it is hardly used. Also, PHP programmers
often have to learn javascript as well, so you gain an understanding of
both class-based and template-based object orientation.

I think the "bad habits" are a good thing to start from. As a resource
on how to learn OO programming, I would also recommend "Refactorin g" by
Martin Fowler. The examples alone in that book can teach you as much as
a good theory book.

I think PHP offers you the opportunity of gently discovering the
advantages of objects. In fact, a lot of people only need to realize the
power of a component like PHPMailer or FPDF to give abstract words like
"code reuse" a firm body.

Best regards

I don't know what "unwanted characteristics " java has as an OO language.
It is a pure OO implementation. And I agree with Mike - I think Java
is a much better language to learn OO programming.

And I've found the "bad habits", once you get into them, are very hard
to break. I don't know how many times I've had C++ programmers who got
off to the wrong start with OO programming and the result was a
horrendous mess of OO and non-OO code.

Smalltalk is also a great language for learning OO, but it's not used in
web programming.

--
=============== ===
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
js*******@attgl obal.net
=============== ===

[Thomas Gagne]

Jerry Stuckle wrote:

<snip>
I don't know what "unwanted characteristics " java has as an OO
language. It is a pure OO implementation.

I'm curious why you think Java "is a pure OO implementation? "
--
Visit <http://blogs.instreamf inancial.com/anything.php>
to read my rants on technology and the finance industry.

[Jerry Stuckle]

Thomas Gagne wrote:

Jerry Stuckle wrote:

><snip>
I don't know what "unwanted characteristics " java has as an OO
language. It is a pure OO implementation.

I'm curious why you think Java "is a pure OO implementation? "

Because it is designed that way. It has all the aspects of OO, and you
must do everything in an OO manner.

But that doesn't mean you can't write bad code in it.

Why do you think it isn't?

--
=============== ===
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.
js*******@attgl obal.net
=============== ===

[gosha bine]

On 17.05.2007 03:01 Jerry Stuckle wrote:

I don't know what "unwanted characteristics " java has as an OO language.
It is a pure OO implementation. And I agree with Mike - I think Java
is a much better language to learn OO programming.

Technically, Java is not "pure OOP" language, because it has many
non-oop features, e.g. primitives.

As to learning, why if you try to explain to someone who is new to
programming, why this

class Test {
public static void main(String[] args) {
System.out.prin tln("hello");
}
}

is any better than

echo "hello";
;)

>
Smalltalk is also a great language for learning OO, but it's not used in
web programming.

Seaside (http://www.seaside.st) is a great Smalltalk-based
web-development framework.

I personally find Ruby (which is essentially "smalltalk for the masses")
an ideal language to learn OOP and webprogramming.
--
gosha bine

extended php parser ~ http://code.google.com/p/pihipi
blok ~ http://www.tagarga.com/blok

[Willem Bogaerts]

>I'm curious why you think Java "is a pure OO implementation? "

Why do you think it isn't?

Because it is not pure OO. Not everything is an object. There are "basic
types" and "objects" in java. And Strings, that are both/neither basic
types and objects.

In pure OO languages (like Ruby), ALL types are objects. Including
integers, floats, etc.

--
Willem Bogaerts

Application smith
Kratz B.V.
http://www.kratz.nl/

[Thomas Gagne]

gosha bine wrote:

On 17.05.2007 03:01 Jerry Stuckle wrote:
<snip>

>>
Smalltalk is also a great language for learning OO, but it's not used
in web programming.

Seaside (http://www.seaside.st) is a great Smalltalk-based
web-development framework.

I personally find Ruby (which is essentially "smalltalk for the
masses") an ideal language to learn OOP and webprogramming.

Stuckle is partially correct--nothing indicates that Smalltalk for
growing as a web language as fast as other languages are, but I did hear
at conference two weeks ago the Ruby on Rails presenter (a big Ruby fan)
suggesting anyone using Seaside would be moving backwards to Rails.
Indicating that if you think Rails is cool (and it is) you should see
what Seaside can do.

--
Visit <http://blogs.instreamf inancial.com/anything.php>
to read my rants on technology and the finance industry.

[Toby A Inkster]

Mike P2 wrote:

I think learning OOP in PHP causes bad habits. There are too many
different ways to do it. If you learn from a language like Java, you
will certainly get it down very well.

I'd agree with what others have posted that Java is not an ideal place to
start learning object-oriented programming, though for different reasons.

In object-oriented programming, everything's focused on "nouns". In real
life, verbs are just as important. In pure OO, a verb (method) can only
exist as an appendage to a noun (object). Thus instead of creating a
function like log_error(), OO programmers create an object ErrorLogger
with a method doIt() and somehow imagine that this is a better design.

This leads to a proliferation of FooProvider, FooFacilitator, FooFactory
and FooInitialiser objects in large OO programs.

There's a good article on such problems here...
http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2006...-of-nouns.html

PHP, I think, as a much better balance than Java. It has good OO
facilities, but doesn't force you to use them when they're not the
best tool for the job.

--
Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
http://tobyinkster.co.uk/
Geek of ~ HTML/SQL/Perl/PHP/Python/Apache/Linux