Because of historical reasons, I have both C# and C++ managed/unmanaged code
mixed together in my class library.
But I prefer to port code to C# since it compiles faster and the syntax is
much more readable so I can do more in less time.
The big question now, will I gain/lose performance, given the fact that I
create pure managed code, if I port the managed C++ classes to C# classes? I
cannot port all the classes at once, too much to port, not enough time.
I use the C++ and C# standard edition 2003. For C++ no speed optimizing is
possible, but since C# uses the C# compiler from the .NET framework, I might
have faster speed this way?
Nov 17 '05
29  1794 
Olaf Baeyens wrote: Compiles much faster. :-)
This compile time is what slows me down because of the huge number of lines
in my class library.
Yes VC++ compilation may be slower (since) but more compile time
optimisations take place.
--
Ioannis Vranos
> > My tests so far are closer to 10% between managed and unmanaged. But I
think it depends what you do.
I am talking only about pure IL code.
And since on the subject let me give some examples of language strength:
Can you do this kind of thing in C# at *compile time*, producing 100%
verifiable code?
Very nice, but now is the question do we really need this?
The part that I am porting is not very critical in speed for the end-user.
But it helps me compiling faster, reducing development time.
Olaf Baeyens wrote: My tests so far are closer to 10% between managed and unmanaged. But I
think
it depends what you do.
I am talking only about pure IL code.
And since on the subject let me give some examples of language strength:
Can you do this kind of thing in C# at *compile time*, producing 100%
verifiable code?
Very nice, but now is the question do we really need this?
Yes. Especially to write compile-time optimal generic facilities to be
placed in libraries. :-)
Generics will be run-time and more limiting.
The part that I am porting is not very critical in speed for the end-user.
But it helps me compiling faster, reducing development time.
Anyway. :-)
--
Ioannis Vranos
> > Very nice, but now is the question do we really need this?
Yes. Especially to write compile-time optimal generic facilities to be
placed in libraries. :-)
Generics will be run-time and more limiting.
Don't worry, I still use C++. ;-)
It is only parts of the code that gets ported.
I am busy right now doing the (partial) port, and I already feel it that I
can compile faster.
With no noticible slow down of the program.
I am wondering how long C++ will stay here since all languages tend to move
to .NET framework so the speed will become more and more the same.
Sooner or later one .NET language will use components from other .NET
languages and we will have one big pool with components.
I believe that unmanaged C++ will be phased out just like assembler did at
some future point of time.
Assembler still exists, just integrated into C++.
Olaf Baeyens wrote: I am wondering how long C++ will stay here since all languages tend to move
to .NET framework so the speed will become more and more the same.
Sooner or later one .NET language will use components from other .NET
languages and we will have one big pool with components.
I believe that unmanaged C++ will be phased out just like assembler did at
some future point of time.
Assembler still exists, just integrated into C++.
Again, previously I was not talking about native C++ but for pure
managed CLI (.NET) code.
Native code will always be around.
In addition, in Longhorn edition of VS (code named Orcas), these 4
things will be possible:
CLI types in managed heap/stack (available today / VC++ 2005)
Native types in unmanaged heap/stack (available today)
CLI types in *unmanaged heap*.
Native types in *managed heap*.
--
Ioannis Vranos
Olaf Baeyens wrote: I am busy right now doing the (partial) port, and I already feel it
that I can compile faster.
My $0.02 worth:
The C# compiler is quite speedy and easy to use on smallish projects, but
when the project gets large (100's to 1000's of source files), the lack of a
real incremental build tips heaviliy in favor of C++ (except for
Rebuild-All, of course).
In the end, it's hard to say which compiler will slow you down more.
-cd
Carl, The C# compiler is quite speedy and easy to use on smallish projects, but
when the project gets large (100's to 1000's of source files), the lack of
a real incremental build tips heaviliy in favor of C++ (except for
Rebuild-All, of course).
My own experience is that, with a decent machine (not super, just fairly
decent), we can recompile one of our project's code bases from scratch
(consisting of about 50.000 lines of code and about 250 source files that
compile into about 25 dlls) in less than a minute with the C# compiler. The
larger code base (around 250.000 lines of code) used to be compilable from
scratch in a couple of minutes or so...
It's not bad, really. However, the project model, overall, usually causes a
fairly big recompile when you change one of the bottom dependencies, which
can slow the process down.
--
Tomas Restrepo to****@mvps.org
> > The C# compiler is quite speedy and easy to use on smallish projects,
but when the project gets large (100's to 1000's of source files), the lack
of a real incremental build tips heaviliy in favor of C++ (except for
Rebuild-All, of course).
My own experience is that, with a decent machine (not super, just fairly
decent), we can recompile one of our project's code bases from scratch
(consisting of about 50.000 lines of code and about 250 source files that
compile into about 25 dlls) in less than a minute with the C# compiler.
The larger code base (around 250.000 lines of code) used to be compilable from
scratch in a couple of minutes or so...
It's not bad, really. However, the project model, overall, usually causes
a fairly big recompile when you change one of the bottom dependencies, which
can slow the process down.
The same is true in C++. Change one constant, or accidentily type a space in
one of the base headers and I am off agin for another 17 minute recompile.
I have a code base of about 180.000 lines now.
If the C++ people could find a way to avoid this "#include system" and use
the C# like technology then it would help a lot from developer viewpoint in
speeding up development.
Olaf Baeyens wrote: The same is true in C++. Change one constant, or accidentily type a
space in one of the base headers and I am off agin for another 17
minute recompile. I have a code base of about 180.000 lines now.
Changing a widely included header does cause great pain. Of course, a great
deal (a very great deal actually) of that pain can be mitigated by proper
construction and use of header files to minimize coupling and dependencies
(read John Lackos - "Large Scale C++ Development" for lots of
recommendations ). Nonetheless, when you have to change something at the
lowest level, it hurts - no denying it.
If the C++ people could find a way to avoid this "#include system"
and use the C# like technology then it would help a lot from
developer viewpoint in speeding up development.
Some day. Maybe. Unfortunately, compatibility with C has us stuck with a
primitive text splicing mechanism instead of a real module concept.
Personally, I think this is an area where a vendor, such as Microsoft, needs
to step in and build a well thought-out module mechanism that can replace
the preprocessor for most (but probably not all) use. Only then is there a
real chance that the C++ community at large will finally move on this issue.
It's been discussed for over a decade now and nothing's happened.
To an extent, this is already happening with .NET.
-cd
Carl Daniel [VC++ MVP] wrote: Some day. Maybe. Unfortunately, compatibility with C has us stuck with a
primitive text splicing mechanism instead of a real module concept.
Personally, I think this is an area where a vendor, such as Microsoft, needs
to step in and build a well thought-out module mechanism that can replace
the preprocessor for most (but probably not all) use. Only then is there a
real chance that the C++ community at large will finally move on this issue.
It's been discussed for over a decade now and nothing's happened.
To an extent, this is already happening with .NET.
What mechanism does C# provide for inclusion of source code files?
--
Ioannis Vranos This thread has been closed and replies have been disabled. Please start a new discussion. Similar topics | |
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