See inline
Willy.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMM ERSDIEtakempis. com> wrote in message
news:eG******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP15.phx.gbl. ..
| Hi Willy,
|
| > 1. You aren't supposed to program against DirectX on Vista (at least not
| > in
| > managed code, which is what this NG is about, right?), you are gonna use
| > WinFX and the WPF framework classes which are a managed layer on top of
| > DirectX on XP or on top of a new graphics engine WGF, costing of
| > Direct3D10
| > and the new hardware accelerated Graphics drivers on Vista.
| > Watch this...
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...1b26f7d901.asp
|
| First of all, the documentation you referred to was about a very limited
set
| of UI graphics, not all graphics, which includes 3D drawing. That
particular
| reference was to UI Controls only. In other words, there is a very limited
| set of (UI only) drawing you can do with this particular set of tools,
which
| is UI-specific. To give you an example from the current platform, you can
| create a form and you can override the Paint event to draw in 2 Dimensions
| on a Control. However, you cannot draw a 3D game interface on a Control
| using GDI+ or System.Drawing. Graphics. For that, you have to use DirectX.
|
Sorry, but you should read the OP's question first.
<snip
I am writing an application in C# which need to plot graphs and simple
shapes (polygons, circles, squares etc). Which library is better for this
purpose and why? Thanks.
/snip>
See, the question is about simple shapes, you don't need DirectX for this
point.
Then you suggested to use DirectX because it would be part of WPF on Vista,
And I say you don't need to go down that level to draw simple or even
complex shapes on Vista, just use the WPF classes they wrap 2D/3D complex
drawing using the WPF engine (called the Desktop Window Manager (DWM), which
uses only uses DirectX for rendering).
| These UI classes run on top of DirectX.
No, they are drawing classes in the System.Windows. Media and the
System.Windows. Media.Media3D namespaces, they run on top of DWM, they are
extremely powerfull/functional.
Please don't confuse WPF drawing/rendering with DirectX, both serve
different purposes, they run in different airspaces (just like native
Win32/GDI), both share the same DirectX rendering engine and the VDDM (Vista
Display Driver Model), while Win32/GDI uses the GDI rendering engine like on
all other Windows platforms.
They are not DirectX, but you can
| certainly draw using DirectX "directly." And, if you recall from my
original
| reply, I recommended DirectX *over OpenGL*, since in Vista, OpenGL is
likely
| to sit on top of DirectX as well, and therefore, not perform quite as
well.
| That I can't be sure of, but that is how I'd bet.
|
| As for DirectX being managed, I've been working with Managed Direct3D for
| almost 2 years now. No, the most current release of the DirectX SDK does
not
| contain a Managed DirectX library for Windows Vista. But it's coming, and
| when Vista is released, it will be here.
|
It does, it's called DirectX3D10! But you need Vista class driver and
hardware accelerated GPU's (actually, some limitted support ) to use them.
And I use them since a couple of months since I'm on the beta team for
Vista.
| > 2.XAML is a new XML-based declarative programming language with the
| > potential to create UI without the need for code, and the potential of
| > drawing 2D shapes without code, which was the OP's request. <snip from
the
| > URL you posted...
| > XAML enables you to create a UI without using code. You can create quite
| > elaborate documents or pages entirely in markup using controls, text,
| > images, shapes and so forth.
|
| Again, you're talking about UI only. If you limit yourself to a discussion
| of what to use to draw UI, you eliminate both DirectX and OpenGL from the
| conversation, regardless of whether you're discussing the current or next
| version of Windows.
No, I don't eliminate DirectX from the discussion, I just said you don't
need it to draw simple/shapes shapes and graphs on the current platform, and
certainly not on Vista, I don't want to push the OP towards something he/she
doesn't need.
And again, I was answering the question which is the
| title of this thread "directx or opengl." I was specifically addressing
this
| question, not the question of whether either of the 2 technologies was the
| best choice for doing simple graphics. This is exactly what I said: "For
the
| purpose of planning ahead, I would use DirectX, *if it was a choice
between
| the 2*." Obviously, neither is necessary for simple graphics. And UI-level
| classes will suffice for that purpose.
|
| > 3.
| > | You don't write graphics programming code with it. See ..
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...asp?frame=true.
| >
| > This page refers to the "unmanaged DirectX" interfaces available on
Vista.
| > This is the API used by applications written in 'native' C++ code, are
| > Vista
| > only API's and must run on hardware that implements the Windows Vista
WDDM
| > (new driver model for hardware accelerated Graphical devices).
|
| *I* do 3D graphics programming with Managed Direct3D. And I have every
| expectation that it will be available on Windows Vista, regardless of the
| fact that it hasn't been pre-released for it yet. Updates for managed
| DirectX come out every couple of months. And it's not going away.
|
See above native Direct3D10 is in the latest SDK (beta), but no (publicly
available) managed framework exists for it (yet).
| --
| HTH,
|
| Kevin Spencer
| Microsoft MVP
| .Net Developer
| We got a sick zebra a hat,
| you ultimate tuna.
|
|
| "Willy Denoyette [MVP]" <wi************ *@telenet.be> wrote in message
| news:%2******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP11.phx.gbl. ..
| > 1. You aren't supposed to program against DirectX on Vista (at least not
| > in
| > managed code, which is what this NG is about, right?), you are gonna use
| > WinFX and the WPF framework classes which are a managed layer on top of
| > DirectX on XP or on top of a new graphics engine WGF, costing of
| > Direct3D10
| > and the new hardware accelerated Graphics drivers on Vista.
| > Watch this...
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...1b26f7d901.asp
| >
| > 2.XAML is a new XML-based declarative programming language with the
| > potential to create UI without the need for code, and the potential of
| > drawing 2D shapes without code, which was the OP's request. <snip from
the
| > URL you posted...
| > XAML enables you to create a UI without using code. You can create quite
| > elaborate documents or pages entirely in markup using controls, text,
| > images, shapes and so forth.
| > /snip>
| >
| > 3.
| > | You don't write graphics programming code with it. See ..
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...asp?frame=true.
| >
| > This page refers to the "unmanaged DirectX" interfaces available on
Vista.
| > This is the API used by applications written in 'native' C++ code, are
| > Vista
| > only API's and must run on hardware that implements the Windows Vista
WDDM
| > (new driver model for hardware accelerated Graphical devices).
| >
| > and ....
| > | And WMP is an acronym for "Windows Media Player," which has nothing to
| > do
| > | this topic.
| >
| > was a typo, sorry.
| >
| > Willy.
| >
| >
| >
| > "Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMM ERSDIEtakempis. com> wrote in message
| > news:%2******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP15.phx.gbl. ..
| > |> You are gonna use the WMP classes and/or XAML for this do you,
DirectX
| > is
| > | > not the API to use from WPF.
| > |
| > | First of all, XAML is a presentation language. See
| > |
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...40017c22e4.asp
| > |
| > | You don't write graphics programming code with it. See
| > |
| >
http://windowssdk.msdn.microsoft.com...asp?frame=true.
| > |
| > | Direct3D is the graphics "layer" for Windows Vista. See
| > |
http://msdn.microsoft.com/windowsvista/experience/
| > |
| > | To quote:
| > |
| > | "A new graphics driver model has been introduced with Windows Vista
that
| > is
| > | stable and secure; it has built-in fault tolerance to enable constant
| > use
| > of
| > | the graphics processor unit (GPU) for the rich graphics sported by the
| > | operating system and the applications. The GPU memory manager and
| > scheduler
| > | in this driver model enable multiple graphics applications to use the
| > GPU
| > to
| > | run simultaneously.
| > | Windows Graphics Foundation 2.0 (WGF), also known as Direct3D10, sits
on
| > top
| > | of, but is distinct from, the new driver model. Applications can use
| > this
| > | application programming interface (API) for compelling next-generation
| > | cinematographic visuals as well as taking advantage of the massive
| > | computational horsepower available on the GPU for more general purpose
| > | applications that are easily parallelized (termed GPGPU). An example
of
| > such
| > | use is image processing."
| > |
| > |
| > | And WMP is an acronym for "Windows Media Player," which has nothing to
| > do
| > | this topic.
| > |
| > | --
| > | HTH,
| > |
| > | Kevin Spencer
| > | Microsoft MVP
| > | .Net Developer
| > | We got a sick zebra a hat,
| > | you ultimate tuna.
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > | "Willy Denoyette [MVP]" <wi************ *@telenet.be> wrote in message
| > | news:%2******** ********@TK2MSF TNGP12.phx.gbl. ..
| > | > You are gonna use the WMP classes and/or XAML for this do you,
DirectX
| > is
| > | > not the API to use from WPF.
| > | >
| > | > Willy.
| > | >
| > | >
| > | >
| > | > "Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMM ERSDIEtakempis. com> wrote in message
| > | > news:eQ******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP09.phx.gbl...
| > | > | For the purpose of planning ahead, I would use DirectX, if it was
a
| > | > choice
| > | > | between the 2. DirectX is going to be part of the foundation of
| > Windows
| > | > | Presentation Services in Windows Vista.
| > | > |
| > | > | --
| > | > | HTH,
| > | > |
| > | > | Kevin Spencer
| > | > | Microsoft MVP
| > | > | .Net Developer
| > | > | We got a sick zebra a hat,
| > | > | you ultimate tuna.
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | > | "Willy Denoyette [MVP]" <wi************ *@telenet.be> wrote in
| > message
| > | > | news:ec******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P15.phx.gbl...
| > | > | >
| > | > | > "Jessica Weiner" <je*****@gmail. com> wrote in message
| > | > | > news:VC******** ***********@new ssvr29.news.pro digy.net...
| > | > | > |I am writing an application in C# which need to plot graphs and
| > | > simple
| > | > | > | shapes (polygons, circles, squares etc). Which library is
better
| > for
| > | > | > this
| > | > | > | purpose and why? Thanks.
| > | > | > |
| > | > | > |
| > | > | >
| > | > | > System.Drawing and System.Drawing. Drawing2D do contain the
classes
| > | > that
| > | > | > wrap
| > | > | > GDI++ and are in general all you need to draw simple shapes.
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | > | > Willy.
| > | > | >
| > | > | >
| > | > |
| > | > |
| > | >
| > | >
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|
