I recently posted a question which was answered by Allen Browne and gave me
some tips to structure the tables. However, when it comes to searching the
database, performance is unacceptably slow and I am now thinking of doing
the unthinkable with my tables and wonder whether anyone has used (or still
uses) this sort of approach.
The database stores libraries and classifies the types of book they keep. So
I have the classic 3-table design: tblLibrary, tblCategory, tblLibCat, which
is the junction table showing LibID and CatCode. Additionally, the CatCodes
are masked so that
050000 = Languages
050100 = European Languages
050101 = English
050102 = French
050103 = German
This enables me to ask "who stocks books on any European language?" as LIKE
"0501??". This was going OK until I tried to find out who stocks (maths and
physics) or (computers and philosophy). This did not sound an
overly-complex question to ask but as you may be able to guess from the SQL,
my pc went on strike for the next ten minutes, protesting mainly over the OR
clause. There are, by the way, about 25,000 libraries with about 80,000
junction table records.
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE "07????"))
AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE "09????"))
OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE "12????"))
AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE "19????"))
So what I did (shock/horror) was to create a field tblLibrary.LibS ubjectList
which contained a comma-separated list of all the categories stocked e.g.
",070111,120100 ,120200,170602, " which is just the sort of thing you don't
normally do in a relational database, although I am keeping the junction
table as being the master list so I can always re-sync the subject list.
The query now becomes:
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,07????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE "*,09????,* " )
OR
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,12????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE "*,19????,* " )
and performance is lightning quick. In fact, I can't ask a question about
which books are held which is not answered almost immediately. There are
some drawbacks though:
1. The SubjectList is a 255-character indexed text field which means the
maximum number of subjects per library is 36. That is, 6 characters per
subject plus a trailing comma multiplied by 36 then add a comma to the
beginning of the list gives 253 characters. This limitation is acceptable.
2. I cannot enforce referential integrity. Although I can always re-sync
the subject list with the junction table and the classifications should stay
virtually unchanged throughout the life of the database, it is still
something I need to be extremely cautious about. If the two lists don't
match, all the searching goes wrong.
3. I have never used this approach before, but no other seems to give
acceptable speed and I can't turn round and say (maths and physics) or
(computers and philosophy) is too difficult a question!
Any comments anyone?
4  1289 
I don't know if this would help at all, but you may try re-wording your
LIKE statement. Would it make a difference if you used "07*" instead
of "07????" ?
This may keep the SQL engine from having to perform operations on
fixed-length strings and that may speed things up. Once it figures out
that the third digit is not correct, it does not need to check the
other three.
On a similar tach, you could try to parse the string before you do your
compare. Setup a few more key fields. Have one called "CatClass :
left(LctLibID,3 )" and another called "CatLevel: [LctLibID]" LangBreak
your WHERE clauses up between these different key fields. One for each
logical level for your code.
Just a few thoughts....
Alex.
Stefan Kowalski wrote: I recently posted a question which was answered by Allen Browne and
gave me some tips to structure the tables. However, when it comes to
searching the database, performance is unacceptably slow and I am now thinking of
doing the unthinkable with my tables and wonder whether anyone has used (or
still uses) this sort of approach.
The database stores libraries and classifies the types of book they
keep. So I have the classic 3-table design: tblLibrary, tblCategory,
tblLibCat, which is the junction table showing LibID and CatCode. Additionally, the
CatCodes are masked so that
050000 = Languages
050100 = European Languages
050101 = English
050102 = French
050103 = German
This enables me to ask "who stocks books on any European language?"
as LIKE "0501??". This was going OK until I tried to find out who stocks
(maths and physics) or (computers and philosophy). This did not sound an
overly-complex question to ask but as you may be able to guess from
the SQL, my pc went on strike for the next ten minutes, protesting mainly over
the OR clause. There are, by the way, about 25,000 libraries with about
80,000 junction table records.
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"07????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"09????")) OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"12????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"19????"))
So what I did (shock/horror) was to create a field
tblLibrary.LibS ubjectList which contained a comma-separated list of all the categories stocked
e.g. ",070111,120100 ,120200,170602, " which is just the sort of thing you
don't normally do in a relational database, although I am keeping the
junction table as being the master list so I can always re-sync the subject
list. The query now becomes:
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,07????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,09????,* " ) OR
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,12????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,19????,* " )
and performance is lightning quick. In fact, I can't ask a question
about which books are held which is not answered almost immediately. There
are some drawbacks though:
1. The SubjectList is a 255-character indexed text field which means
the maximum number of subjects per library is 36. That is, 6 characters
per subject plus a trailing comma multiplied by 36 then add a comma to
the beginning of the list gives 253 characters. This limitation is
acceptable. 2. I cannot enforce referential integrity. Although I can always
re-sync the subject list with the junction table and the classifications
should stay virtually unchanged throughout the life of the database, it is still
something I need to be extremely cautious about. If the two lists
don't match, all the searching goes wrong.
3. I have never used this approach before, but no other seems to
give acceptable speed and I can't turn round and say (maths and physics)
or (computers and philosophy) is too difficult a question!
Any comments anyone?
"Alex" <al*********@ro cketmail.com> wrote in message
news:11******** **************@ f14g2000cwb.goo glegroups.com.. . I don't know if this would help at all, but you may try re-wording your
LIKE statement. Would it make a difference if you used "07*" instead
of "07????" ?
This may keep the SQL engine from having to perform operations on
fixed-length strings and that may speed things up. Once it figures out
that the third digit is not correct, it does not need to check the
other three.
On a similar tach, you could try to parse the string before you do your
compare. Setup a few more key fields. Have one called "CatClass :
left(LctLibID,3 )" and another called "CatLevel: [LctLibID]" LangBreak
your WHERE clauses up between these different key fields. One for each
logical level for your code.
Just a few thoughts....
Alex.
Hi Alex
Thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately they won't quite be enough to
make speed acceptable. Even if I do all the table indexing and even if I go
for an exact match (so no lengths to worry about), the OR clause just kills
it:
SELECT *
FROM tblLibrary
WHERE (LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="010 101"))
AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="010 102"))
OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="180 000"))
AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="190 000"))
Trying to run this query, then scroll to the bottom record takes 5 minutes
of locked pc, whereas the query using tblLibrary.Subj ect list is almost
instant. I think this is the approach I will take, but I wonder whether
anyone else currently uses this method. It is a problem which must occur in
other types of databases and although
http://www.mvps.org/access/queries/qry0016.htm uses a 'helper table' to find
all of X having required Y, it does not address the OR issue.
Perhaps someone has a database with a similar 3-table structure, eg people
and skills. So you ask who knows (Access and VBA) OR (VB and SQL Server)
Somebody out there must be solving these types of queries.
Stefan Kowalski wrote: I recently posted a question which was answered by Allen Browne and
gave me some tips to structure the tables. However, when it comes to
searching the database, performance is unacceptably slow and I am now thinking of
doing the unthinkable with my tables and wonder whether anyone has used (or
still uses) this sort of approach.
The database stores libraries and classifies the types of book they
keep. So I have the classic 3-table design: tblLibrary, tblCategory,
tblLibCat, which is the junction table showing LibID and CatCode. Additionally, the
CatCodes are masked so that
050000 = Languages
050100 = European Languages
050101 = English
050102 = French
050103 = German
This enables me to ask "who stocks books on any European language?"
as LIKE "0501??". This was going OK until I tried to find out who stocks
(maths and physics) or (computers and philosophy). This did not sound an
overly-complex question to ask but as you may be able to guess from
the SQL, my pc went on strike for the next ten minutes, protesting mainly over
the OR clause. There are, by the way, about 25,000 libraries with about
80,000 junction table records.
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"07????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"09????")) OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"12????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"19????"))
So what I did (shock/horror) was to create a field
tblLibrary.LibS ubjectList which contained a comma-separated list of all the categories stocked
e.g. ",070111,120100 ,120200,170602, " which is just the sort of thing you
don't normally do in a relational database, although I am keeping the
junction table as being the master list so I can always re-sync the subject
list. The query now becomes:
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,07????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,09????,* " ) OR
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,12????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,19????,* " )
and performance is lightning quick. In fact, I can't ask a question
about which books are held which is not answered almost immediately. There
are some drawbacks though:
1. The SubjectList is a 255-character indexed text field which means
the maximum number of subjects per library is 36. That is, 6 characters
per subject plus a trailing comma multiplied by 36 then add a comma to
the beginning of the list gives 253 characters. This limitation is
acceptable. 2. I cannot enforce referential integrity. Although I can always
re-sync the subject list with the junction table and the classifications
should stay virtually unchanged throughout the life of the database, it is still
something I need to be extremely cautious about. If the two lists
don't match, all the searching goes wrong.
3. I have never used this approach before, but no other seems to
give acceptable speed and I can't turn round and say (maths and physics)
or (computers and philosophy) is too difficult a question!
Any comments anyone?
Ok, so you have three tables. tblLibrary with key field LibID,
tblCategory with key field LctLatCode, and tblLibCat with no key field,
but multiple listings for LibID and LctLatCode. Why can't you just
join these in the normal manner and eliminate the sub-queries all
together?
Something like this (I probably don't have the field names correct,
though):
SELECT tblLibrary.*, tblLibCat.LctCa tCode
FROM (tblLibrary INNER JOIN tblLibCat ON tblLibrary.LibI D =
tblLibCat.LibID ) INNER JOIN tblCategory ON tblLibCat.LctCa tCode =
tblCategory.Lct CatCode
WHERE (((tblLibCat.Lc tCatCode)="*190 000")) OR
(((tblLibCat.Lc tCatCode)="*180 000")) OR
(((tblLibCat.Lc tCatCode)="*010 102")) OR
(((tblLibCat.Lc tCatCode)="*010 101"));
This eliminates the sub-queries and lets the joins take care of it. I
have never used a sub-query and don't really see the need to as long as
you can just join the tables together into a view.
I bet it is the sub-queries, not the OR statements that is slowing you
down. If you have 1000 records and you have subqueries, then you will
probably have 1000 * 1000 accesses to the database when you run the
query. The join should eliminate most of those at the fore-front.
Alex.
Stefan Kowalski wrote: "Alex" <al*********@ro cketmail.com> wrote in message
news:11******** **************@ f14g2000cwb.goo glegroups.com.. .I don't know if this would help at all, but you may try re-wording
your LIKE statement. Would it make a difference if you used "07*"
instead of "07????" ?
This may keep the SQL engine from having to perform operations on
fixed-length strings and that may speed things up. Once it figures
out that the third digit is not correct, it does not need to check the
other three.
On a similar tach, you could try to parse the string before you do
your compare. Setup a few more key fields. Have one called "CatClass :
left(LctLibID,3 )" and another called "CatLevel: [LctLibID]"
LangBreak your WHERE clauses up between these different key fields. One for
each logical level for your code.
Just a few thoughts....
Alex.
Hi Alex
Thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately they won't quite be
enough to make speed acceptable. Even if I do all the table indexing and even
if I go for an exact match (so no lengths to worry about), the OR clause just
kills it:
SELECT *
FROM tblLibrary
WHERE (LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode="010 101")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="010 102"))
OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="180 000"))
AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode="190 000"))
Trying to run this query, then scroll to the bottom record takes 5
minutes of locked pc, whereas the query using tblLibrary.Subj ect list is
almost instant. I think this is the approach I will take, but I wonder
whether anyone else currently uses this method. It is a problem which must
occur in other types of databases and although
http://www.mvps.org/access/queries/qry0016.htm uses a 'helper table'
to find all of X having required Y, it does not address the OR issue.
Perhaps someone has a database with a similar 3-table structure, eg
people and skills. So you ask who knows (Access and VBA) OR (VB and SQL
Server) Somebody out there must be solving these types of queries.
Stefan Kowalski wrote: I recently posted a question which was answered by Allen Browne
and gave me some tips to structure the tables. However, when it comes to
searching the database, performance is unacceptably slow and I am now thinking
of doing the unthinkable with my tables and wonder whether anyone has used
(or still uses) this sort of approach.
The database stores libraries and classifies the types of book
they keep. So I have the classic 3-table design: tblLibrary, tblCategory,
tblLibCat, which is the junction table showing LibID and CatCode. Additionally,
the CatCodes are masked so that
050000 = Languages
050100 = European Languages
050101 = English
050102 = French
050103 = German
This enables me to ask "who stocks books on any European
language?" as LIKE "0501??". This was going OK until I tried to find out who stocks
(maths and physics) or (computers and philosophy). This did not sound an
overly-complex question to ask but as you may be able to guess
from the SQL, my pc went on strike for the next ten minutes, protesting mainly
over the OR clause. There are, by the way, about 25,000 libraries with about
80,000 junction table records.
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"07????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"09????")) OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"12????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode LIKE
"19????"))
So what I did (shock/horror) was to create a field
tblLibrary.LibS ubjectList which contained a comma-separated list of all the categories
stocked e.g. ",070111,120100 ,120200,170602, " which is just the sort of thing
you don't normally do in a relational database, although I am keeping the
junction table as being the master list so I can always re-sync the subject
list. The query now becomes:
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,07????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,09????,* " ) OR
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,12????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,19????,* " )
and performance is lightning quick. In fact, I can't ask a
question about which books are held which is not answered almost immediately.
There are some drawbacks though:
1. The SubjectList is a 255-character indexed text field which
means the maximum number of subjects per library is 36. That is, 6
characters per subject plus a trailing comma multiplied by 36 then add a comma to
the beginning of the list gives 253 characters. This limitation is
acceptable. 2. I cannot enforce referential integrity. Although I can
always re-sync the subject list with the junction table and the classifications
should stay virtually unchanged throughout the life of the database, it is
still something I need to be extremely cautious about. If the two lists
don't match, all the searching goes wrong.
3. I have never used this approach before, but no other seems to
give acceptable speed and I can't turn round and say (maths and
physics) or (computers and philosophy) is too difficult a question!
Any comments anyone?
"Stefan Kowalski" <a@b.com> wrote in
news:ct******** **@sparta.btint ernet.com: Hi Alex
Thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately they won't quite
be enough to make speed acceptable. Even if I do all the
table indexing and even if I go for an exact match (so no
lengths to worry about), the OR clause just kills it:
SELECT *
FROM tblLibrary
WHERE (LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode="010 101")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode="010 102")) OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode="180 000")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode="190 000"))
I'm too tired to see if this will work, in that it involves
nesting IN statements, but
SELECT *
FROM tblLibrary
WHERE (LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE
LctCatCode IN ("010101","0101 02","180000","1 90000"))
might do.
Bob Q
Trying to run this query, then scroll to the bottom record
takes 5 minutes of locked pc, whereas the query using
tblLibrary.Subj ect list is almost instant. I think this is
the approach I will take, but I wonder whether anyone else
currently uses this method. It is a problem which must occur
in other types of databases and although
http://www.mvps.org/access/queries/qry0016.htm uses a 'helper
table' to find all of X having required Y, it does not address
the OR issue. Perhaps someone has a database with a similar
3-table structure, eg people and skills. So you ask who knows
(Access and VBA) OR (VB and SQL Server) Somebody out there
must be solving these types of queries.
Stefan Kowalski wrote: I recently posted a question which was answered by Allen
Browne and
gave me some tips to structure the tables. However, when it comes
to
searching the database, performance is unacceptably slow and I am now
thinking of
doing the unthinkable with my tables and wonder whether anyone has
used (or
still uses) this sort of approach.
The database stores libraries and classifies the types of
book they
keep. So I have the classic 3-table design: tblLibrary, tblCategory,
tblLibCat, which is the junction table showing LibID and CatCode.
Additionally, the
CatCodes are masked so that
050000 = Languages
050100 = European Languages
050101 = English
050102 = French
050103 = German
This enables me to ask "who stocks books on any European
language?"
as LIKE "0501??". This was going OK until I tried to find out who
stocks
(maths and physics) or (computers and philosophy). This did not sound
an overly-complex question to ask but as you may be able to
guess from
the SQL, my pc went on strike for the next ten minutes, protesting
mainly over
the OR clause. There are, by the way, about 25,000 libraries with
about
80,000 junction table records.
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode
LIKE
"07????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode
LIKE
"09????")) OR
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode
LIKE
"12????")) AND
(LibID IN (SELECT LctLibID FROM tblLibCat WHERE LctCatCode
LIKE
"19????"))
So what I did (shock/horror) was to create a field
tblLibrary.LibS ubjectList which contained a comma-separated list of all the categories
stocked
e.g. ",070111,120100 ,120200,170602, " which is just the sort of
thing you
don't normally do in a relational database, although I am keeping
the
junction table as being the master list so I can always re-sync the
subject
list. The query now becomes:
SELECT * FROM tblLibrary WHERE
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,07????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,09????,* " ) OR
(LibSubjectList LIKE "*,12????,* " AND LibSubjectList LIKE
"*,19????,* " )
and performance is lightning quick. In fact, I can't ask a
question
about which books are held which is not answered almost
immediately. There
are some drawbacks though:
1. The SubjectList is a 255-character indexed text field
which means
the maximum number of subjects per library is 36. That is, 6
characters
per subject plus a trailing comma multiplied by 36 then add a
comma to
the beginning of the list gives 253 characters. This limitation
is
acceptable. 2. I cannot enforce referential integrity. Although I can
always
re-sync the subject list with the junction table and the
classifications
should stay virtually unchanged throughout the life of the database, it
is still something I need to be extremely cautious about.
If the two lists
don't match, all the searching goes wrong.
3. I have never used this approach before, but no other
seems to
give acceptable speed and I can't turn round and say (maths and
physics)
or (computers and philosophy) is too difficult a question!
Any comments anyone?
--
Bob Quintal
PA is y I've altered my email address. This thread has been closed and replies have been disabled. Please start a new discussion. Similar topics | |
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by: isladogs |
last post by:
The next Access Europe User Group meeting will be on Wednesday 1 May 2024 starting at 18:00 UK time (6PM UTC+1) and finishing by 19:30 (7.30PM).
In this session, we are pleased to welcome a new presenter, Adolph Dupré who will be discussing some powerful techniques for using class modules.
He will explain when you may want to use classes instead of User Defined Types (UDT). For example, to manage the data in unbound forms.
Adolph will...
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by: adsilva |
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A Windows Forms form does not have the event Unload, like VB6. What one acts like?
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by: 6302768590 |
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Hai team
i want code for transfer the data from one system to another through IP address by using C# our system has to for every 5mins then we have to update the data what the data is updated we have to send another system
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by: muto222 |
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How can i add a mobile payment intergratation into php mysql website.
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by: bsmnconsultancy |
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In today's digital era, a well-designed website is crucial for businesses looking to succeed. Whether you're a small business owner or a large corporation in Toronto, having a strong online presence can significantly impact your brand's success. BSMN Consultancy, a leader in Website Development in Toronto offers valuable insights into creating effective websites that not only look great but also perform exceptionally well. In this comprehensive...
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