Hi!
Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
(I know that Python code itself is best at communication design ideas,
but there are some people which prefer to talk UML.)
(Have not found anything relevant with google)
Thanks!
Regards,
Roman Suzi
16  5358 
>> Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
As a utility class. More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
"On the fly" usually means "at runtime". I guess you mean if you
"change code" will my diagram stay in sync?. You will have to use round
trip tools. I don't know any tool supports round trip for Python code.
But if you just mean reverse engineering, lookup PyNSource, Boa
Constructor, PyReverse among others
(I know that Python code itself is best at communication design ideas,
but there are some people which prefer to talk UML.)
Actually no. Python is a good tool for "prototypin g" which is not the
same as "communicat ing design ideas". Diagrams are better for the later
and do not need to be executable. At least from what I know, except
Eiffel, no language makes that claim. UML is really the only contender
currently for design notation.
Roman Susi wrote: Hi!
Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
I would say that within a class diagram, you can't. In other UML
diagrams (such as sequence interaction), the function is simply used as
if it were a method belonging to an object. If you need to make it
clear where this function is located within the code, use a note on the
diagram.
Remember, UML is not able to accurately capture all implementation
details of a system; It's not meant to.
More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
Again, don't try to depict fine-grained implementation details. If the
dynamically generated class is important to the class diagram, include
it but don't include all of it's internals (methods etc.). Use a note
to exaplin how/when/why it is generated.
(I know that Python code itself is best at communication design ideas,
but there are some people which prefer to talk UML.)
(Have not found anything relevant with google)
Thanks!
Regards,
Roman Suzi
Rob C
Roman Susi wrote: Hi!
Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
I'm not up to par on the latest UML specs (or not too old) - but I don't
believe UML handles that: it is called a class diagram after all.
More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
You mean objects I think: by using a 0..n in you agregation ?
(I know that Python code itself is best at communication design ideas,
but there are some people which prefer to talk UML.)
(Have not found anything relevant with google)
Thanks!
Regards,
Roman Suzi
Regards,
Philippe
Ravi Teja wrote:
(snip) More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
"On the fly" usually means "at runtime". I guess you mean if you
"change code" will my diagram stay in sync?.
Nope, the OP really meant "on the fly", as in "at runtime". In python,
it is possible to create new classes at runtime. Remember,
everything-is-an-object implies that classes are objects too.
--
bruno desthuilliers
python -c "print '@'.join(['.'.join([w[::-1] for w in p.split('.')]) for
p in 'o****@xiludom. gro'.split('@')])"
Philippe Martin wrote: Roman Susi wrote:
(snip) More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
You mean objects I think:
Yes : class objects !-)
Python's classes *are* objects. And you can create new classes at runtime.
(snip)
--
bruno desthuilliers
python -c "print '@'.join(['.'.join([w[::-1] for w in p.split('.')]) for
p in 'o****@xiludom. gro'.split('@')])"
Ravi Teja wrote: Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
As a utility class.
So, function could be a utility class method. If there are no better ways.
More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
"On the fly" usually means "at runtime". I guess you mean if you
"change code" will my diagram stay in sync?. You will have to use round
trip tools. I don't know any tool supports round trip for Python code.
But if you just mean reverse engineering, lookup PyNSource, Boa
Constructor, PyReverse among others
No. I do not need it. I just want to know if UML is capable of doing it.
(I know that Python code itself is best at communication design ideas,
but there are some people which prefer to talk UML.)
Actually no. Python is a good tool for "prototypin g" which is not the
same as "communicat ing design ideas". Diagrams are better for the later
and do not need to be executable. At least from what I know, except
Eiffel, no language makes that claim. UML is really the only contender
currently for design notation.
Well, maybe SOL (Semantic Object Language) could also be quite
beneficial in some cases. At least, it depends with whom to communicate
design ideas and what level of formality to maintain.
Also, my argument that Python is quite good at communicating design
ideas is supported by the fact that Python developers do not use UML (or
other modelling tools/languages) as often as say Java programmers, nor
feel the need to. And probably Python is too dynamic for UML. That is
another reason rountrip tools aren't there.
--
Roman
But not in UML: a class diagram will represent classes while a sequence
diagram objects.
Philippe
bruno at modulix wrote: Philippe Martin wrote: Roman Susi wrote:
(snip)
More theoretical question is if I create classes on the fly, how UML can
reflect that?
You mean objects I think:
Yes : class objects !-)
Python's classes *are* objects. And you can create new classes at runtime.
(snip)
> So, function could be a utility class method. If there are no better ways.
What I mean is <<utility>> is the formal notation for a class in which
global functions are aggregated. It's not a hack.
Python is not alone here. Most OO languages aside Java and Smalltalk
have functions outside classes and UML accomodates though not
encourages free functions. Well, maybe SOL (Semantic Object Language) could also be quite
beneficial in some cases. At least, it depends with whom to communicate
design ideas and what level of formality to maintain.
I don't know what Semantic Object Language is. One important
requirement of choosing communication notations is that they should be
sufficiently popular that everyone understands. Kind of beats the
purpose if you are the only person who knows it. I got 146 hits on
Google for "Semantic Object Language" and UML. Too few for me to care.
If it is a deserving notation, hopefully that will change in the
future.
Also, my argument that Python is quite good at communicating design
ideas is supported by the fact that Python developers do not use UML
(or
other modelling tools/languages) as often as say Java programmers, nor
feel the need to.
I guess you and I mean VERY different things when we say "Design
Ideas". You seem to imply pseudo code. I mean overall archetecture. I
think Python devs will use UML tools if there are good ones available.
I know I would. I could really use a round trip class and package
diagram editor now.
And probably Python is too dynamic for UML. That is another reason rountrip tools aren't there.
As you probably already know, UML diagrams are structural and
behavioural (plus interactional with 2.0). Round trip tools only model
structural diagrams. Python is dynamic but only once the program starts
executing :-). Even though Python classes "can" change, they do so only
at runtime ( wouldn't it be scary if they decided to change as code
when you are not looking :-) ). So dynamism of Python should not be as
much of an issue. I think the reason we don't have good UML round trip
tools for Python is primarily a market issue rather than a language
issue. If Python gets the same market share as Java, it will surely get
all these tools and more.
In <ma************ *************** ************@py thon.org>, Roman Susi
wrote: Out of curiosity, how do I draw functions outside classes with UML? How
module could be drawn in this case?
I just create a (UML) class for modules. After all a Python module can be
seen as a class definition for a singleton which is instantiated at import
time.
Ciao,
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