Google ranking vs encryption

[Brian Murphy]

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

[Tim Van Wassenhove]

On 2004-01-04, Brian Murphy <ya******@yahoo.com> wrote:

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

What is wrong with a robots.txt file?

The google spider thingie also sends its own UserAgent name, so you
could filter on that 2

--
verum ipsum factum

[CountScubula]

"Brian Murphy" <ya******@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c3**************************@posting.google.c om...

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

look at my site, it has a feature to encypt your html output
http://gzen.myhq.info/encoder-p.php

This is not using the new engine yet, so just take portions of your html,
and put them in a text file,
then the output of file after compression can be used in an include()

--
Mike Bradley
http://gzen.myhq.info -- free online php tools

[Ian.H]

On Sat, 03 Jan 2004 19:58:55 -0800, Brian Murphy wrote:

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will for
sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt the
output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google spider
comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would need is
the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

Why not do it the sensible way?

robots.txt or .htaccess and deny access to the google netblock.

Regards,

Ian

--
Ian.H [Design & Development]
digiServ Network - Web solutions
www.digiserv.net | irc.digiserv.net | forum.digiserv.net
Programming, Web design, development & hosting.

[Filth]

Why not do it the sensible way?

robots.txt or .htaccess and deny access to the google netblock.

Because he doesnt want to block google

[Derek Scollon]

Filth wrote:

Why not do it the sensible way?

robots.txt or .htaccess and deny access to the google netblock.

Because he doesnt want to block google

Yes, that's the ay I read the OP too. He wants Google to get a plain
HTML version which it can index and he wants browsers to get an
encrypted HTML version.

Derek

[Ian.H]

On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 14:03:01 +0000, Derek Scollon wrote:

Filth wrote:

Why not do it the sensible way?

robots.txt or .htaccess and deny access to the google netblock.

Because he doesnt want to block google

Yes, that's the ay I read the OP too. He wants Google to get a plain HTML
version which it can index and he wants browsers to get an encrypted HTML
version.

Derek

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will for
sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt the
output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google spider
comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would need is
the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

This actually sounds contradictory.

Site to be _un_indexable by google (don't want it accessing it?)
Encrypt output to users not google (contradiction to above?)
Google comes from same ip == simple (block google netblock?)
This is what made me draw my conclusion for my reply.

If it's simply "encrypting" the HTML so that users can't read it.. forget
it.. waste of time and effort and 101% useless (regardless of what these
so called "professional companies" will have you believe on their sites)..
if it's something else.. other than the above of totally blocking
google from a site / dir / page then I've clearly missed the point?

Regards,

Ian

--
Ian.H [Design & Development]
digiServ Network - Web solutions
www.digiserv.net | irc.digiserv.net | forum.digiserv.net
Programming, Web design, development & hosting.

[Ian.H]

On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 15:35:20 +0000, Ian.H wrote:

> I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will for
sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt the
output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google spider
comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would need is
the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

Oops.. now the coffee's kicked in ;)

I read it the same now.. that encryption will _make_ the site unindexable
which isn't the objective but for users to not be able to read the HTML
src =)

Back to the point in my previous post then.. pointless.. useless.. waste
of time, energy and effort.. and doesn't work.. period =)

Regards,

Ian

--
Ian.H [Design & Development]
digiServ Network - Web solutions
www.digiserv.net | irc.digiserv.net | forum.digiserv.net
Programming, Web design, development & hosting.

[Derek Scollon]

Ian.H wrote:

Back to the point in my previous post then.. pointless.. useless.. waste
of time, energy and effort.. and doesn't work.. period =)

Yes, on this point I agree with you completely.

Derek

[Misha Gale]

"Tim Van Wassenhove" <eu**@pi.be> wrote in message
news:bt************@ID-188825.news.uni-berlin.de...

On 2004-01-04, Brian Murphy <ya******@yahoo.com> wrote:

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

What is wrong with a robots.txt file?

The google spider thingie also sends its own UserAgent name, so you
could filter on that 2

I don't recomend filtering by user agent, as it would be trivial for users
to spoof it, and masquerade as google, thus bypassing your encryption. I
suggest serving unencrypted pages only if the remote IP is owned by google.
However, since google caches all your pages, users can still get the
plaintext versions from Google.

[Phil Roberts]

With total disregard for any kind of safety measures
ya******@yahoo.com (Brian Murphy) leapt forth and uttered:

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That
will for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way
to encrypt the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose
that if Google spider comes always from the same server,It would
be easy: All I would need is the ip address(es) of that
server?Please help.

Whats the point of encrypting HTML? Not that you ARE doing any such
thing of course.

--
There is no signature.....

[Jim Dabell]

Brian Murphy wrote:

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.
That's not going to happen. If the client can't read the HTML, then it
can't render the page. If the client can read the HTML, it's already out
of your hands. Why do you want to encrypt the HTML in the first place?
HTML is simple; there's no great secret to it.

That will for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to
encrypt the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

Serving one thing to search engines and another thing to something else is
known as cloaking, and is liable to get you blacklisted from search
engines.

"Google may permanently ban from our index any sites or site authors that
engage in cloaking to distort their search rankings."

-- <URL:http://www.google.com/webmasters/faq.html#cloaking>

--
Jim Dabell

[CountScubula]

FYI,

Google will not cache the page it you set a meta-tag, (I forget which one)

--
Mike Bradley
http://gzen.myhq.info -- free online php tools

[Rob Ristroph]

>>>>> "Brian" == Brian Murphy <ya******@yahoo.com> writes:
Brian>
Brian> I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML
Brian> output.That will for sure make the site unindexable by
Brian> Google.Is there a way to encrypt the output to the users but
Brian> not to Google.I suppose that if Google spider comes always from
Brian> the same server,It would be easy: All I would need is the ip
Brian> address(es) of that server?Please help.

The consistent interpretation I made from this is that Brian wants his
users to browse his site using SSL (https) but that google should
still index it. Perhaps the purpose of the SSL is not to hide the
site (since after all it will be in google's cache) but simply to
authenticate via the certificates that you are not browsing a
different site due to a DNS hack. Maybe someone would want that for
some sort of financial information site.

I would first check the that the google bot won't go to an https site
-- I know when I do google searches I am sometimes lead directly to an
https page, so I think they might.

If not, just make the site available as both SSL and not SSL. If you
wish, you can make all USER_AGENTS other than Google's get re-directed
the https version of the same page. I would do that using apache
redirect configuration, not in php.

--Rob

[Chung Leong]

Why bother? Output encryption is always trivial to break. All I have to do
is type in something like the following into address bar to get everything:

javascript: a = document.createElement('TEXTAREA');
document.body.appendChild(a); a.value =
document.getElementsByTagName('HTML')[0].outerHTML; void(0);

Uzytkownik "Brian Murphy" <ya******@yahoo.com> napisal w wiadomosci
news:c3**************************@posting.google.c om...

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

[CountScubula]

Ok, lets just clarify a few items

Why do you want to do this, perhaps there is a solution.

--
Mike Bradley
http://www.gzentools.com -- free online php tools

[Jim]

Why ever do you want to stop Google indexing your site? Why not use a
meta-tag?

Jim

"Brian Murphy" <ya******@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:c3**************************@posting.google.c om...

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to encrypt
the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if Google
spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy: All I would
need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

[Juha Suni]

> "Brian Murphy" <ya******@yahoo.com> wrote in message

news:c3**************************@posting.google.c om...

I own a PHP-based website.I want to encrypt the HTML output.That will
for sure make the site unindexable by Google.Is there a way to
encrypt the output to the users but not to Google.I suppose that if
Google spider comes always from the same server,It would be easy:
All I would need is the ip address(es) of that server?Please help.

Jim wrote: Why ever do you want to stop Google indexing your site? Why not use a
meta-tag?

Jim

I think you got it wrong Jim. He seems to want to encrypt the HTML so
no-one can see it (giggle), but would still want Google to index it,
since it wouldn't do that (in his opinion) if the page was mystically
encrypted.

Ok Brian. This is a common (newbie) question that arises on all
HTML-related forums and newsgroups every once in a while. There is a
clear simple answer to your question that anyone who knows what they're
talking about will give you:

Dont.

There is nothing worth hiding in your HTML as such. There is nothing
worth hiding in anyones HTML. Besides you cant do it. Either you give
the HTML to the visitors so they can view the site, or you dont give it
to them, denying them access to the site. If they cant see the HTML,
they cant see the site. If they can see the HTML, the can save it, edit
it, and give it to the whole internet.

You can obfuscate, javascript-deform or otherwise make the code hard to
read, but anyone who really would want to see it could still do so with
some effort. There are no HTML secrets, its all standardized, documented
etc. All you end up doing is wasting a huge load of time.

Dont.

--
Suni

[Tim Van Wassenhove]

On 2004-01-09, Juha Suni <ju*******@ilmiantajat.fi> wrote:

There is nothing worth hiding in your HTML as such. There is nothing
worth hiding in anyones HTML. Besides you cant do it. Either you give
the HTML to the visitors so they can view the site, or you dont give it
to them, denying them access to the site. If they cant see the HTML,
they cant see the site. If they can see the HTML, the can save it, edit
it, and give it to the whole internet.

You can obfuscate, javascript-deform or otherwise make the code hard to
read, but anyone who really would want to see it could still do so with
some effort. There are no HTML secrets, its all standardized, documented
etc. All you end up doing is wasting a huge load of time.

Or hide it by playing with css ;)
--
http://home.mysth.be/~timvw