Exam 70-305

[Mr Newbie]

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple of
practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you have to
REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its like
looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the difference.
Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Karl Seguin]

I thought the exam was extremly easy. I finished in about 25 minutes and got
a high score. personally, it soured me on the entire experience, much too
easy and focusing on the wrong things.

Anyways, best way to study is to take a lot of sample tests..

Karl

--
MY ASP.Net tutorials
http://www.openmymind.net/
http://openmymind.net/redirector.aspx?documentId=51 - Learn about AJAX!

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you have
to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its like
looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the difference.
Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Gary Blakely]

I used the QUE book by Mike Gunderloy and the material from Trancenders. I
think the trancenders material was more tricky and harder than the real test
but worth the money. the Mike Gunderloy book was a great prep but more than
a prep - I still use it for reference because it touches on about
everything. My reaction to all that code was the same as yours and I
believe the practice tests taught me how to spot those differences quickly.

The prep experience and the test was very good for me because it forced me
to learn all areas where before I was really strong in about half of them.

--
Regards,
Gary Blakely
Dean Blakely & Associates
www.deanblakely.com

--
Regards,
Gary Blakely
Dean Blakely & Associates
www.deanblakely.com
"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you have
to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its like
looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the difference.
Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Mark Rae]

"Karl Seguin" <karl REMOVE @ REMOVE openmymind REMOVEMETOO . ANDME net>
wrote in message news:uL******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

I thought the exam was extremly easy. I finished in about 25 minutes and
got a high score. personally, it soured me on the entire experience, much
too easy and focusing on the wrong things.

It's my personal opinion that MCPs are a total and utter waste of time and
money. They don't teach you how to be a better developer; just to remember a
load of pointless facts that you never need to remember in your day-to-day
work.

I've always equated them to driving lessons - they don't teach you how to be
a good driver; they just teach you how to pass your driving test.

[Guadala Harry]

As a guy with each of these certifications: MCSD, MCDBA, MCSA, MCSE (with
MCSD.NET just around the corner);
I can tell you firsthand that any of the certifications or exams won't make
you a better programmer or even provide much of an indication of what you
actually know. One unfortunate side effect of having these certs is that
they pretty much increase people's expectations unrealistically for what you
know and what you can do. There is an absolutely HUGE amount of material
potentially covered by all those tests and I honestly cannot tell you want a
passing grade really means. For example I got 100% on the COM section of one
of the MCSD tests and I can tell you I don't know much beyond the absolute
basics of COM. On the other hand I barely passed other exams and they never
asked me anything about a whole bunch of stuff that I knew that was
relevant. So one thing I've concluded is that one's score on these exams
measures - in large part - the exam's ability to measure what you DO in fact
know. A low score may mean that the test failed to measure your knowledge
adequately. A high score may mean the exact same thing! The upshot of this:
You might do well to have some clear understanding of what a passing score
means - and means just for you. Personally, I just look at it as a way to
get *some* idea of how well I have covered some of the fundamentals in some
area of inquiry (and even then, just on Microsoft products). If I can't even
pass one of these tests, then I better hit the books! But that doesn't mean
that passing the test gives me any sense of [elevated status] in the
industry - after all, it's hard to really know what a passing score means.
Bottom line is that you really need to roll up your sleeves and get some
good old fashioned experience before you can really consider yourself as
achieving any level of *expertise* - even then it's only limited to the
domain in which you have such experience; certification or no certification.

-HTH

-GH
"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you have
to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its like
looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the difference.
Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Tina]

My experience is that developers who say these test mean nothing are afraid
to take them or maybe not up to the effort to study for them. Just because
you pass the bar does not mean you are an excellent lawyer but it is
evidence that you are not some dumb shit.

T :)

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you have
to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its like
looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the difference.
Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Guadala Harry]

Your post is confusing. I'm a developer who has passed 13 of these tests and
I'm sure you read my post explaining the lack of objective meaning... and
then you make your sweeping statement???

Also, please don't post profanity here. Unlike the SQL Programming NG and
others, this one is fairly civil. We'd like to keep it that way.

-GH

"Tina" <ti**********@n ospammeexcite.c om> wrote in message
news:ex******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

My experience is that developers who say these test mean nothing are
afraid to take them or maybe not up to the effort to study for them. Just
because you pass the bar does not mean you are an excellent lawyer but it
is evidence that you are not some dumb shit.

T :)

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you
have to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its
like looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the
difference. Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in
your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Guadala Harry]

For those interested, here is info on the next generation of Microsoft
certifications.

http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/newgen/

With these new certifications - particularly the Microsoft Certified
Architect - the *meaning* of the credential will be much more clear than
those offered today. I guess MS saw a need to revamp things - perhaps to add
some additional validity to the whole certification process.

-FWIW

"Guadala Harry" <GM**@BeansAndT acos.org> wrote in message
news:uc******** ******@tk2msftn gp13.phx.gbl...

As a guy with each of these certifications: MCSD, MCDBA, MCSA, MCSE (with
MCSD.NET just around the corner);
I can tell you firsthand that any of the certifications or exams won't
make you a better programmer or even provide much of an indication of what
you actually know. One unfortunate side effect of having these certs is
that they pretty much increase people's expectations unrealistically for
what you know and what you can do. There is an absolutely HUGE amount of
material potentially covered by all those tests and I honestly cannot tell
you want a passing grade really means. For example I got 100% on the COM
section of one of the MCSD tests and I can tell you I don't know much
beyond the absolute basics of COM. On the other hand I barely passed other
exams and they never asked me anything about a whole bunch of stuff that I
knew that was relevant. So one thing I've concluded is that one's score on
these exams measures - in large part - the exam's ability to measure what
you DO in fact know. A low score may mean that the test failed to measure
your knowledge adequately. A high score may mean the exact same thing! The
upshot of this: You might do well to have some clear understanding of what
a passing score means - and means just for you. Personally, I just look at
it as a way to get *some* idea of how well I have covered some of the
fundamentals in some area of inquiry (and even then, just on Microsoft
products). If I can't even pass one of these tests, then I better hit the
books! But that doesn't mean that passing the test gives me any sense of
[elevated status] in the industry - after all, it's hard to really know
what a passing score means. Bottom line is that you really need to roll up
your sleeves and get some good old fashioned experience before you can
really consider yourself as achieving any level of *expertise* - even then
it's only limited to the domain in which you have such experience;
certification or no certification.

-HTH

-GH
"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a couple
of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as you
have to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its
like looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the
difference. Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in
your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Mr Newbie]

I think that not withstanding the colourfull language used, she has a point
!

For someone who has had no real experience with the technology it would be
impossible to pass the exam cold. Therefore to at least work through the MS
or other preperation material has merit in terms of study time applied and
the will and focus to actually schedule and realize the exam iteself.

Therfore I beleive in the merit of this process, however I take your points
regarding the potential for the results to skew the underlying aptitude.

For someone who already knows the technology, of course the exams would
probably be fairly mechanical, especially for someone like yourself who is
obviously an experienced person in this field.

I hope that I do make the grade and go on to better things. I view it as a
stepping stone.

And thanks for all the replies to my post.

Thanks Again .. Mr Newbie
"Guadala Harry" <GM**@BeansAndT acos.org> wrote in message
news:Oz******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

Your post is confusing. I'm a developer who has passed 13 of these tests
and I'm sure you read my post explaining the lack of objective meaning...
and then you make your sweeping statement???

Also, please don't post profanity here. Unlike the SQL Programming NG and
others, this one is fairly civil. We'd like to keep it that way.

-GH

"Tina" <ti**********@n ospammeexcite.c om> wrote in message
news:ex******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

My experience is that developers who say these test mean nothing are
afraid to take them or maybe not up to the effort to study for them.
Just because you pass the bar does not mean you are an excellent lawyer
but it is evidence that you are not some dumb shit.

T :)

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...

Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a
couple of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much as
you have to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its
like looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the
difference. Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in
your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg Neural
Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads of help
provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to re-route all
emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin head off!!!!

:))

[Kevin Spencer]

Until now at least, the certification process has been meaningless. The
development world is hideously complex, and even knowing the answers to all
of the questions in an exam doesn't prepare one for the experience of
real-world development. Only the experience itself does. In other words,
using a carpenter as an analogy, there is a difference between knowing what
all of one's tools are, how they work, what they are used for, and how to
read a blueprint, and knowing how to build houses.

All development projects are different, and present different and unique
challenges to the developer. In my experiences, Murphy is a constant
companion. I am constantly barraged by new situations, requirements that
exceed my skill set, problems I have never encountered before, and I've been
programming for a dozen years.

A certification exam can measure certain things, and is useful for measuring
those things, and those things only. Among the most critical skills required
by any developer are problem-solving skill, logic, creative thinking, anal
attention to detail, a measure of healthy paranoia, and dogged persistence.
Until now, I have not seen certification exams which are able to measure
most of these things. I have not seen certification exams which do measure
the ones which can be measured (such as problem-solving and logic).

It is not very important to know a lot. After all, "a lot" is a non-specific
quantity. Without a frame of reference, it is meaningless. It is
*critically* important to be able to find out a lot, and to be able to do so
quickly. I'd love to see an exam which involved playing "20 questions." THAT
would be a good measurement criteria!

The best developers I have known and worked with most often had little or no
formal training, and either had not taken any certification exams, or had
taken them as a requirement of their job, and for no other reason.
Programming is a high-salary job. Many people are going to want to make the
kind of money that can be made doing it. Among them, only a select few are
"born programmers" or have the self-discipline and persistence to acquire
these skills and qualities.

Most people don't realize it, but it requires less work over a lifetime to
become a Doctor. While there is a period of some years during which an
aspiring Doctor has to work his/her proverbial butt off, after that, it is
fairly easy to keep up with the advances in the trade. Most Doctors are
specialists of one sort or another, and only need to keep up with a limited
set of knowledge. They have nurses and other lower-paid medical technicians
to do most of their work for them. And the human body isn't re-designed
every 5 or 10 years.

As for me, and others like me (you know who you are), I spend as much time
studying as I do developing. And I feel like I can never manage to keep up,
even though I do, by comparison, overall. Fortunately for me, I love to
learn. I love a challenge. I can endure almost any stress except for
boredom. Math, Logic, and Science are the greatest loves of my life, with
the (possible) exception of my wife. ;-)

But how many people who aspire to make the big bucks have similar traits?
Many aspiring developers are people who saw an ad for "Some Technical
Institute" on tv, and bought into the hype. They are in it for the money.
There are as many hack developers out there as there are hack car mechanics,
hack politicians, and hack lawyers. Some of these are very good at passing
certification exams.

I have never taken one. Why?

1. I have never needed to. I have always acquired work by virtue of my
accomplishments (A good portfolio is worth a thousand certificates).
2. I have never been required to by a job that I've held.
3. I have been too busy studying and performing to take the time for an
exam.
4. Taking the above into consideration, I have never wanted to take one "for
fun." Taking an exam is not my idea of fun. The real exam is my everyday
life.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm stickin' with it!

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
A watched clock never boils.

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:e2******** ******@tk2msftn gp13.phx.gbl...

I think that not withstanding the colourfull language used, she has a point
!

For someone who has had no real experience with the technology it would be
impossible to pass the exam cold. Therefore to at least work through the
MS or other preperation material has merit in terms of study time applied
and the will and focus to actually schedule and realize the exam iteself.

Therfore I beleive in the merit of this process, however I take your
points regarding the potential for the results to skew the underlying
aptitude.

For someone who already knows the technology, of course the exams would
probably be fairly mechanical, especially for someone like yourself who is
obviously an experienced person in this field.

I hope that I do make the grade and go on to better things. I view it as a
stepping stone.

And thanks for all the replies to my post.

Thanks Again .. Mr Newbie
"Guadala Harry" <GM**@BeansAndT acos.org> wrote in message
news:Oz******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

Your post is confusing. I'm a developer who has passed 13 of these tests
and I'm sure you read my post explaining the lack of objective meaning...
and then you make your sweeping statement???

Also, please don't post profanity here. Unlike the SQL Programming NG and
others, this one is fairly civil. We'd like to keep it that way.

-GH

"Tina" <ti**********@n ospammeexcite.c om> wrote in message
news:ex******** ******@TK2MSFTN GP12.phx.gbl...

My experience is that developers who say these test mean nothing are
afraid to take them or maybe not up to the effort to study for them.
Just because you pass the bar does not mean you are an excellent lawyer
but it is evidence that you are not some dumb shit.

T :)

"Mr Newbie" <he**@now.com > wrote in message
news:uU******** *****@TK2MSFTNG P10.phx.gbl...
Im going to be looking to do this exam fairly soon, but ive done a
couple of practice tests and found them to be a bit tricky in as much
as you have to REALLY READ the questions carefully else they trip you
up.

When you have four multi choice and each one has 8 lines of code, its
like looking at those damn near identicle picture and spotting the
difference. Its almost as if they expect you to have an on line help in
your head !!

How did others get on with it ?

Cheers Mr N

PS: Im going to hook up my positronic relay to a Sub Dermal Borg
Neural Node Interlink transmitter and connect to the billion tera quads
of help provided with VS2003, this should help. If not I'm going to
re-route all emergency power to my cebral cortex and blow my friggin
head off!!!!

:))