pronunciation on malloc thing

[Barry]

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard
to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'
strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

[int2str]

On Jul 31, 9:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard
to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

In C++, you pronounce malloc "new" ;)

strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

This tends to be pronounced std::string::operator=().
Though some people call it "overloaded constructor" :D

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

Sorry, as a non-native English speaker, I'll stay away from giving
actual pronunciation help.

Cheers,
Andre

[Victor Bazarov]

in*****@gmail.com wrote:

On Jul 31, 9:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:

>Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that
hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

In C++, you pronounce malloc "new" ;)

>strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

This tends to be pronounced std::string::operator=().
Though some people call it "overloaded constructor" :D

>Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

Sorry, as a non-native English speaker, I'll stay away from giving
actual pronunciation help.

Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written medium)
but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in the FAQ...

V
--
Please remove capital 'A's when replying by e-mail
I do not respond to top-posted replies, please don't ask

[Colander]

On Aug 1, 2:07 pm, "Victor Bazarov" <[e-mail]:

Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written medium)
but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in the FAQ...

As a Dutchman I second that, the std::deque killed me more then once.

[Andre Kostur]

These are all IMHO:
Barry <dh***@126.comwrote in news:f8**********@aioe.org:

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard
to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

Yep, malok.

strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

stir copy

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

And for operator(), I use "operator parens".

[Default User]

Andre Kostur wrote:

These are all IMHO:
Barry <dh***@126.comwrote in news:f8**********@aioe.org:

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English,
I found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like
that hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

Yep, malok.

Agree.

strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

stir copy

Disagree. I spell that out.

Brian

[Victor Bazarov]

Default User wrote:

Andre Kostur wrote:

>These are all IMHO:
Barry <dh***@126.comwrote in news:f8**********@aioe.org:

>>Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English,
I found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like
that hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

Yep, malok.

Agree.

You mean, "may lock" or "Mmm... Alloc.." (like "Mmm Donut...")?

>>strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

stir copy

Disagree. I spell that out.

I agree. I spell that out as well; the farther out, the better.
What spell do you use to out it? Or do you use a hex?

V
--
Please remove capital 'A's when replying by e-mail
I do not respond to top-posted replies, please don't ask

[Shadowman]

Victor Bazarov wrote:

in*****@gmail.com wrote:

>On Jul 31, 9:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:

>>Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that
hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

In C++, you pronounce malloc "new" ;)

>>strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

This tends to be pronounced std::string::operator=().
Though some people call it "overloaded constructor" :D

>>Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

Sorry, as a non-native English speaker, I'll stay away from giving
actual pronunciation help.

Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written medium)
but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in the FAQ...

Good idea!

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

Or char. As in char-broiled. Or 'care' as in character. Of course
these are all personal preference, I suppose.
--
SM
rot13 for email

[Default User]

Victor Bazarov wrote:

Default User wrote:

Andre Kostur wrote:

Yep, malok.

Agree.

You mean, "may lock" or "Mmm... Alloc.." (like "Mmm Donut...")?

*I* mean mal (rhymes with pal) ock (rhymes with tock). Actually, with
schlurring schwa sound, more like mal-uck. You can make an "uck" joke
if you like.


Brian

[Default User]

Shadowman wrote:

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

see-out
see-in
see-err (as in, to err is human).

Or char. As in char-broiled. Or 'care' as in character. Of course
these are all personal preference, I suppose.

I say "car". Which is perhaps odd, as it doesn't sound like it's
spelled or like an abreviation of the word I pronounce care-eckter.

Brian

[Victor Bazarov]

Shadowman wrote:

Victor Bazarov wrote:

>in*****@gmail.com wrote:

>>On Jul 31, 9:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:
Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English,
I found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like
that hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'
In C++, you pronounce malloc "new" ;)

strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'
This tends to be pronounced std::string::operator=().
Though some people call it "overloaded constructor" :D

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?
Sorry, as a non-native English speaker, I'll stay away from giving
actual pronunciation help.

Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written
medium) but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in
the FAQ...

Good idea!

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

Hmm.. Never heard of 'kowt' before. But maybe I just wasn't
recognizing it.

Or char. As in char-broiled. Or 'care' as in character.

I've never heard of "care". "Car", maybe, but "care"? And, yes,
'char' (as in char-broiled) is my personal choice.

Of course
these are all personal preference, I suppose.

The important thing is that those who are listenting would understand
what you try to tell them.

V
--
Please remove capital 'A's when replying by e-mail
I do not respond to top-posted replies, please don't ask

[BobR]

Andre Kostur <nn******@kostur.netwrote in message...

These are all IMHO:

Barry <dh***@126.comwrote in news:f8**********@aioe.org:

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard
to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

Yep, malok.

Oh! I thought it was a mall in Orange County. :-}

>

strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

stir copy

"zero(or null char)-terminated-char-array copy" (z(nc)tcacpy?)
[ With the 'nix influence, I wonder why it was not "sc". ]

>

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

And for operator(), I use "operator parens".

'function call operator'.

--
Bob R
POVrookie

[BobR]

Victor Bazarov <v.********@comAcast.netwrote in message...

Default User wrote:

Andre Kostur wrote:

These are all IMHO:

Barry <dh***@126.comwrote in news:f8**********@aioe.org:
Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English,
I found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like
that hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'

Yep, malok.

Agree.

You mean, "may lock" or "Mmm... Alloc.." (like "Mmm Donut...")?

That's it, NO more Simpsons for you!! <G>

--
Bob R
POVrookie

[Sherm Pendley]

Shadowman <fu**********@pbzpnfg.argwrites:

Victor Bazarov wrote:

>Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written medium)
but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in the FAQ...

Good idea!

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

I prounounce that "standard out". :-)

sherm--

--
Web Hosting by West Virginians, for West Virginians: http://wv-www.net
Cocoa programming in Perl: http://camelbones.sourceforge.net

[Default User]

Sherm Pendley wrote:

Shadowman <fu**********@pbzpnfg.argwrites:

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

I prounounce that "standard out". :-)

I would almost certainly reserve that for stdout.


Brian

[BobR]

Victor Bazarov <v.********@comAcast.netwrote in message
news:f8**********@news.datemas.de...

Shadowman wrote:

Victor Bazarov wrote:

Not that it comes up often (after all Usenet is mostly written
medium) but it can be beneficial to have a pronunciation guide in
the FAQ...

Good idea!

Then there's cout. I've heard it like "See-Out" or "Kowt."

Hmm.. Never heard of 'kowt' before. But maybe I just wasn't
recognizing it.

Or char. As in char-broiled. Or 'care' as in character.

I've never heard of "care". "Car", maybe, but "care"? And, yes,
'char' (as in char-broiled) is my personal choice.

Of course
these are all personal preference, I suppose.

The important thing is that those who are listenting would understand
what you try to tell them.

From:
Bjarne Stroustrup's C++ Style and Technique FAQ

How do you pronounce "cout"?
"cout" is pronounced "see-out". The "c" stands for "character" because
iostreams map values to and from byte (char) representations.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
How do you pronounce "char"?
"char" is usiually pronounced "tchar", not "kar". This may seem illogical
because "character" is pronounced "ka-rak-ter", but nobody ever accused
English pronounciation and spelling of being logical.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

--
Bob R
POVrookie

[Default User]

BobR wrote:

How do you pronounce "char"?
"char" is usiually pronounced "tchar", not "kar".

I don't understand what that means.
Brian

[Old Wolf]

On Aug 2, 9:45 am, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

BobR wrote:

How do you pronounce "char"?
"char" is usiually pronounced "tchar", not "kar".

I don't understand what that means.

It means the pronunciation is [tSa:] and
not [ka:] . For the meaning of symbols
within square brackets, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-SAMPA

The "t" in "tch" surprises some people who've
never thought about the sound. However if you
do think about it, you will realise that it is
the same as "sh" but with a [t] first.

In some languages that sound is in fact written
"tch", e.g. German, in which plain "ch" means [X]

[Old Wolf]

On Aug 1, 4:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard
to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'
strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

I say 'string copy' or 'stir kapee', which then
causes trouble when I have to say stpcpy!

Another odd one is 'wcstombs'.

[Victor Bazarov]

Old Wolf wrote:

On Aug 1, 4:25 pm, Barry <[e-mail]:

>Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I
found that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that
hard to express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'
strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

I say 'string copy' or 'stir kapee', which then
causes trouble when I have to say stpcpy!

Steepy kapee?

Another odd one is 'wcstombs'.

Weeks Tombs?

:-)

[James Kanze]

On Aug 2, 12:06 am, Old Wolf <[e-mail]:

On Aug 2, 9:45 am, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

BobR wrote:

How do you pronounce "char"?
"char" is usiually pronounced "tchar", not "kar".

I don't understand what that means.

It means the pronunciation is [tSa:] and
not [ka:] . For the meaning of symbols
within square brackets, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-SAMPA

I don't think that this is the usual convention, although many
of the sounds (including the ones here) do correspond. See
http://alt-usage-english.org/ipa/asc...combined.shtml, for
example, or (more complete and more complex)
www.kirshenbaum.net/IPA/ascii-ipa.pdf. (The latter is, I think,
the most widespread convention, and I believe that the
alt-usage-english conventions are based on it.)

The "t" in "tch" surprises some people who've
never thought about the sound. However if you
do think about it, you will realise that it is
the same as "sh" but with a [t] first.

In some languages that sound is in fact written
"tch", e.g. German, in which plain "ch" means [X]

In German, the sound would be written tsch (where sch means
[S]). And the German plain ch can be either [X] or [C],
according to context.

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:ja*********@gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, [phone]

[Default User]

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 2, 12:06 am, Old Wolf <[e-mail]:

On Aug 2, 9:45 am, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

BobR wrote:
How do you pronounce "char"?
"char" is usiually pronounced "tchar", not "kar".

I don't understand what that means.

It means the pronunciation is [tSa:] and
not [ka:] . For the meaning of symbols
within square brackets, see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X-SAMPA

I don't think that this is the usual convention, although many
of the sounds (including the ones here) do correspond.

I found that more confusing than helpful. Probably just me.

See
http://alt-usage-english.org/ipa/asc...combined.shtml, for
example, or (more complete and more complex)
www.kirshenbaum.net/IPA/ascii-ipa.pdf. (The latter is, I think,
the most widespread convention, and I believe that the
alt-usage-english conventions are based on it.)

I generally don't care for the way they do it on aue either. I prefer
to give rhymes when relatively unambiguous, or spell out the syllables.
That doubtlessly lacks precision, but I find it more accessible.

The "t" in "tch" surprises some people who've
never thought about the sound. However if you
do think about it, you will realise that it is
the same as "sh" but with a [t] first.

In some languages that sound is in fact written
"tch", e.g. German, in which plain "ch" means [X]

In German, the sound would be written tsch (where sch means
[S]). And the German plain ch can be either [X] or [C],
according to context.

I gather the upshot was that "char" should be pronounced as in
"charcoal". I'll have to say that in my experience among the software
people here that's probably the least common. I find "car" or "care" to
be much more popular. And of course, "car" is the "right" way, because
that's how I do it.


Brian

[James Kanze]

On Aug 2, 7:49 pm, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

James Kanze wrote:

[...]

See
http://alt-usage-english.org/ipa/asc...combined.shtml, for
example, or (more complete and more complex)
www.kirshenbaum.net/IPA/ascii-ipa.pdf. (The latter is, I think,
the most widespread convention, and I believe that the
alt-usage-english conventions are based on it.)

I generally don't care for the way they do it on aue either. I
prefer to give rhymes when relatively unambiguous, or spell
out the syllables. That doubtlessly lacks precision, but I
find it more accessible.

Question of intended audience, probably. IPA is the
"scientific" way (and an international standard). It's also
widely used in dictionaries, and when teaching a foreign
language (where rhymes are hopeless if the sound doesn't exist
in your own language).

[...]

I gather the upshot was that "char" should be pronounced as in
"charcoal". I'll have to say that in my experience among the software
people here that's probably the least common. I find "car" or "care" to
be much more popular. And of course, "car" is the "right" way, because
that's how I do it.

I've never heard "care". Or "char", for that matter. But I'm
not sure my experience could be considered a reference; I've
never worked in a place where English was the native language.

My gut feeling is that "char" is a contraction of "character",
so it's pronunciation should also be a contraction.
(Etymologically, the ch in "char" can ultimately be traced back
to a Greek chi, which means that it would normally be pronunced
[k]. But of course, language doesn't always to the "normal"
thing.)

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:ja*********@gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, [phone]

[joe]

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how 'car'
gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything. Personally, I have used both 'char' and 'care', but
probably 'char' more often (because it is a word and they wouldn't
have spelled it like that if they didn't want that connection,
right? :) ).

joe

[Victor Bazarov]

joe wrote:

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how 'car'
gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

Depends on how you pronounce 'car' :-)

[..]

V
--
Please remove capital 'A's when replying by e-mail
I do not respond to top-posted replies, please don't ask

[Default User]

joe wrote:

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how 'car'
gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

I have no idea, but I do it and many others do as well.

I'll point out that "char" in C-derived languages is NOT the word
"char", and is completely unrelated to it. There's no particular reason
it should be pronounced that way. I think there's a better argument for
"care", but I don't like it.

So I'll probably say "car" as long as it's an issue for me.


Brian

[Default User]

Victor Bazarov wrote:

joe wrote:

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how
'car' gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

Depends on how you pronounce 'car' :-)

Rhymes with "bar". Let's go.


Brian

[BobR]

Default User <de***********@yahoo.comwrote in message...

Victor Bazarov wrote:

Depends on how you pronounce 'car' :-)

Rhymes with "bar". Let's go.

You buying?

--
Bob R
POVrookie

[Jim Langston]

"Barry" <dh***@126.comwrote in message news:f8**********@aioe.org...

Recently, I have to communicate C++ technical problems in English, I found
that `malloc', `strcpy', `operator()' and something like that hard to
express,

malloc =[malok] or `memory allocate'
strcpy =`S T R C P Y' or `string copy'

Is there any recommendation on the pronunciation for them?

I've always used and heard "mal-uk". I use "string copy" for strcpy,
"string en copy" for strncpy.
char -char-acter "care"
std -"standard"
int -int-iger "int"
bool -bool-ean "bool"
alloc -"al-uk"
cout -"see-out"
cin -"see-in"
cerr -"see-err"
iostream -"eye-oh-stream"
fopen -"ef-open"
etc..

[James Kanze]

On Aug 3, 4:11 pm, joe <[e-mail]:

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how 'car'
gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

It's how the first four letters in character are pronunced.
Very roughly, of course. (I'd say that the a in character was
somewhat more anterior than that in char. But it's certainly
not the [E:j] of care.)

Personally, I have used both 'char' and 'care', but probably
'char' more often (because it is a word and they wouldn't have
spelled it like that if they didn't want that connection,
right? :) ).

They spelled it like that for the same reason they spelled
integer int. If you've ever heard the sound of a listing being
output to a teletype, you'll understand why they want as few
characters as possible. Knowing that it's a contraction for
character, I pronunce it as I do the first sylable of
character. Which is closer to car than to the word char or
care.

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:james.kanze:gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, [phone]

[Victor Bazarov]

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 3, 4:11 pm, joe <[e-mail]:

>I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how
'car' gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

It's how the first four letters in character are pronunced.
Very roughly, of course. (I'd say that the a in character was
somewhat more anterior than that in char. But it's certainly
not the [E:j] of care.)

It's not [E:j], it's "er" in the US.

And, however strange it might sound, the word "character" has two
pronunciations and the pronunciation of 'care' is the beginning of
one of them. It can be specific to American English, though.

[..]

V
--
Please remove capital 'A's when replying by e-mail
I do not respond to top-posted replies, please don't ask

[Default User]

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 3, 4:11 pm, joe <[e-mail]:

Personally, I have used both 'char' and 'care', but probably
'char' more often (because it is a word and they wouldn't have
spelled it like that if they didn't want that connection,
right? :) ).

They spelled it like that for the same reason they spelled
integer int. If you've ever heard the sound of a listing being
output to a teletype, you'll understand why they want as few
characters as possible. Knowing that it's a contraction for
character, I pronunce it as I do the first sylable of
character. Which is closer to car than to the word char or
care.

That may be true in your area, but here the first syllable of
"character" is the same as "care". Are you in an area where
Mary/merry/marry are not the same, perhaps?

Brian

[James Kanze]

On Aug 5, 4:50 am, "Victor Bazarov" <[e-mail]:

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 3, 4:11 pm, joe <[e-mail]:

I think the problem is that 'char' is a word (meaning to scortch or
partially burn) and some recognize it as that and use that
pronunciation whereas others use the "It's the first four letters of
character" rationale. I can't for the life of me figure out how
'car' gets into the mix as a pronunciation as that isn't related to
anything.

It's how the first four letters in character are pronunced.
Very roughly, of course. (I'd say that the a in character was
somewhat more anterior than that in char. But it's certainly
not the [E:j] of care.)

It's not [E:j], it's "er" in the US.

"Care" is pronounced with a dipthong in pretty much every
English dialect: it's [keIr]. (I would have expected the length
to be indicated, whence the : in my transcription. I also would
have expected the semivowel to have been represented by a [j],
and not [i], but I'm probably wrong there.)

And, however strange it might sound, the word "character" has two
pronunciations and the pronunciation of 'care' is the beginning of
one of them. It can be specific to American English, though.

It must be an innovation in the last 30 or so years, then,
because it certainly wasn't the case when I was growing up in
America. The online American Heritage Dictionary doesn't seem
to know about it either. The word "care" is pronounced either
[keIr] (American) or [ke:@] (British). The word "character" is
pronounced ['k&r@ktR] (American) or ['k&r@kt@] (British). At
least according to the dictionaries I have access to, and from
my own experience (growing up in the United States, working with
many British people).

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:james.kanze:gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, [phone]

[James Kanze]

On Aug 5, 7:30 am, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 3, 4:11 pm, joe <[e-mail]:

Personally, I have used both 'char' and 'care', but probably
'char' more often (because it is a word and they wouldn't have
spelled it like that if they didn't want that connection,
right? :) ).

They spelled it like that for the same reason they spelled
integer int. If you've ever heard the sound of a listing being
output to a teletype, you'll understand why they want as few
characters as possible. Knowing that it's a contraction for
character, I pronunce it as I do the first sylable of
character. Which is closer to car than to the word char or
care.

That may be true in your area, but here the first syllable of
"character" is the same as "care". Are you in an area where
Mary/merry/marry are not the same, perhaps?

Where is your area? I grew up north of Chicago. My mother is
from Atlanta. Both regions use a very open short a (IPA &) in
character, and this is the only sound given in all of the
dictionaries I have access to. (And yes, I've always
distinguished between Mary/merry/marry. And of course, the
dictionaries give "standard" pronounciation, which also
distinguishes between the three.)

--
James Kanze (GABI Software) email:james.kanze:gmail.com
Conseils en informatique orientée objet/
Beratung in objektorientierter Datenverarbeitung
9 place Sémard, 78210 St.-Cyr-l'École, France, [phone]

[Default User]

James Kanze wrote:

On Aug 5, 7:30 am, "Default User" <[e-mail]:

That may be true in your area, but here the first syllable of
"character" is the same as "care". Are you in an area where
Mary/merry/marry are not the same, perhaps?

Where is your area?

I'm in St. Louis, which is a "Mary is merry is marry" region.

I grew up north of Chicago. My mother is
from Atlanta. Both regions use a very open short a (IPA &) in
character, and this is the only sound given in all of the
dictionaries I have access to. (And yes, I've always
distinguished between Mary/merry/marry. And of course, the
dictionaries give "standard" pronounciation, which also
distinguishes between the three.)

You are incorrect about the dictionaries. Merriam-Webster gives
multiple pronunciations for the trio, including one common one, "mer-E".

Similarly, it lists the similar sounding versions of "care" and
"character", 'ker and 'ker-ik-t&r respectively.

That also shows that "care" and "merry/marry/mary" have the same vowel
sound, which is what you find in this area.


Brian

[Jerry Coffin]

In article <11**********************@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups. com>,
ja*********@gmail.com says...

[ ... ]

Interesting. Now I'm really curious. You wouldn't happen to
know of a site which had more information about this.
Particularly concerning the history of this evolution; as I
said, I don't recall having heard about it when I was living in
America.

It's light on detail, but you might find this interesting:

http://pandora.cii.wwu.edu/vajda/lin...ericanDialects
..htm

--
Later,
Jerry.

The universe is a figment of its own imagination.