Porting VB apps to Python for Window / Linux use

[Dotan Cohen]

I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps. Are there any Python experts who I can reference them to for
porting? I have nothing on hand at the moment, but I see this as a
need without an obvious answer.

--
Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
×�-ב-×’-ד-×”-ו-×–-×—-ט-×™-ך-×›-ל-×�-מ-ן-×*-ס-×¢-×£-פ-×¥-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü

[Lawrence D'Oliveiro]

In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>, Dotan
Cohen wrote:

I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps.

Probably best to leave those legacy VB apps alone and develop new
replacements in a more open, cross-platform language, like Python.

[Dotan Cohen]

2008/10/19 Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ld*@geek-central.gen.new_zealand>:

In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>, Dotan
Cohen wrote:

>I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps.

Probably best to leave those legacy VB apps alone and develop new
replacements in a more open, cross-platform language, like Python.

That is quite the reason why I asked here, so that I could find
someone who can port these things to Python.

--
Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
×�-ב-×’-ד-×”-ו-×–-×—-ט-×™-ך-×›-ל-×�-מ-ן-×*-ס-×¢-×£-פ-×¥-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü

[Stef Mientki]

Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>, Dotan
Cohen wrote:

>I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps.

Probably best to leave those legacy VB apps alone and develop new
replacements in a more open, cross-platform language, like Python.

Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)
Stef

[Dotan Cohen]

2008/10/19 Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.com>:

Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)
Stef

Really, even with the cross-platform Qt bindings?

Can you recommend a better language? (not java no please not java)

--
Dotan Cohen

http://what-is-what.com
http://gibberish.co.il
×�-ב-×’-ד-×”-ו-×–-×—-ט-×™-ך-×›-ל-×�-מ-ן-×*-ס-×¢-×£-פ-×¥-צ-ק-ר-ש-ת

ä-ö-ü-ß-Ä-Ö-Ü

[Stef Mientki]

Dotan Cohen wrote:

2008/10/19 Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.com>:

>Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)
Stef

Really, even with the cross-platform Qt bindings?

I skipped Qt because of the weird license
(I make both commercial and free-open software)

Can you recommend a better language? (not java no please not java)

As said VB or even much better Delphi !

But to be honest,
wanting the same language for commercial and open software,
I'm very satisfied with Python, and must say it's much more beautiful
language than Delphi, seen over the full width of programming.
Although both languages are Object Oriented,
for some (unknown) reason it's 10 times easier to maintain and extend
libraries in Python than in Delphi.
I WOULD BE MUCH OBLIGED, IF SOMEONE CAN EXPLAIN THAT DIFFERENCE !
And with wxPython and some tools I made, I almost have the same
environment as Delphi.
cheers,
Stef

[Francesco Bochicchio]

Il Sun, 19 Oct 2008 10:34:23 +0200, Stef Mientki ha scritto:

....

I'm very

satisfied with Python, and must say it's much more beautiful language
than Delphi, seen over the full width of programming. Although both
languages are Object Oriented, for some (unknown) reason it's 10 times
easier to maintain and extend libraries in Python than in Delphi.
I WOULD BE MUCH OBLIGED, IF SOMEONE CAN EXPLAIN THAT DIFFERENCE ! And
with wxPython and some tools I made, I almost have the same environment
as Delphi.

IMO:
- dynamic typing
- powerful built-in types like lists, sets and dictionaries
- very rich function definition syntax, with multiple returns,
yield, values passed by position and by name, automatic
grouping of parameters in list/dictionaries
- rich standard library, which becomes impressive if you accound for all
the non standard modules that you find in internet. And, unlike another
language wich shall remain unnamed (starts with J), most of python
library modules have the same pratical approach of C standard
library.

Never used seriously delphi, but played a little with it: IIRC, under the
nice IDE and GUI toolkit, the language itself is a kind of object-pascal.
This would place it more or less at the same level of abstraction of
Java, way below languages like python and ruby,
Ciao
-----
FB

[Stef Mientki]

Dotan Cohen wrote:

2008/10/19 Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.com>:

>Dotan Cohen wrote:

>>2008/10/19 Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.com>:
Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)
Stef
Really, even with the cross-platform Qt bindings?

I skipped Qt because of the weird license
(I make both commercial and free-open software)

>>Can you recommend a better language? (not java no please not java)

As said VB or even much better Delphi !

But to be honest,
wanting the same language for commercial and open software,
I'm very satisfied with Python, and must say it's much more beautiful
language than Delphi, seen over the full width of programming.
Although both languages are Object Oriented,
for some (unknown) reason it's 10 times easier to maintain and extend
libraries in Python than in Delphi.
I WOULD BE MUCH OBLIGED, IF SOMEONE CAN EXPLAIN THAT DIFFERENCE !
And with wxPython and some tools I made, I almost have the same environment
as Delphi.

Really, you recommend that VB apps destined for migration be recoded
in Delphi, as opposed to Python?

Certainly not.
Delphi is windows only and as Francesco said,
it's just Object Pascal , which is inferior to Python.

Stef

I will look further into that
language.

[Stef Mientki]

Francesco Bochicchio wrote:

Il Sun, 19 Oct 2008 10:34:23 +0200, Stef Mientki ha scritto:

...

I'm very

>satisfied with Python, and must say it's much more beautiful language
than Delphi, seen over the full width of programming. Although both
languages are Object Oriented, for some (unknown) reason it's 10 times
easier to maintain and extend libraries in Python than in Delphi.
I WOULD BE MUCH OBLIGED, IF SOMEONE CAN EXPLAIN THAT DIFFERENCE ! And
with wxPython and some tools I made, I almost have the same environment
as Delphi.

IMO:
- dynamic typing
- powerful built-in types like lists, sets and dictionaries
- very rich function definition syntax, with multiple returns,
yield, values passed by position and by name, automatic
grouping of parameters in list/dictionaries
- rich standard library, which becomes impressive if you accound for all
the non standard modules that you find in internet. And, unlike another
language wich shall remain unnamed (starts with J), most of python
library modules have the same pratical approach of C standard
library.

Never used seriously delphi, but played a little with it: IIRC, under the
nice IDE and GUI toolkit, the language itself is a kind of object-pascal.
This would place it more or less at the same level of abstraction of
Java, way below languages like python and ruby,

Thanks Francesco,
for these features and indeed the Object Pascal language is indeed
inferior to Python.
Some of Python features that I find an enormous improvement over Delphi:
- extending functions and classes with keyword arguments, without
affecting the previous use of these declarations
- array slicing
- having 1 procedure that can handle every type, opposed to the Delphi
overload method

Some minor points of Python, compared to Delphi
- rich standard library is less than in Delphi. It might be just as
large, but using it is a crime (Delphi libs always work because they are
upwards compatible)
- GUI design
- deploying an application

cheers,
Stef

>
Ciao
-----
FB

--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

[infixum]

On Oct 19, 12:51*am, Stef Mientki <[e-mail]:

Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

In message <[e-mail]>, Dotan
Cohen wrote:

I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps.

Probably best to leave those legacy VB apps alone and develop new
replacements in a more open, cross-platform language, like Python.

Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)
Stef

Some folks below mention wxPython, which (I think) works pretty
decently.

Another option is IronPython, the dot net based version of Python.
Much of it runs under Mono on Linux. The dot Net Windows and controls
look decent in both environments (Windows and Linux), and aren't that
difficult to code.

IronPython has a mailing list; you might want to cross-post there.

[bearophileHUGS]

Stef Mientki:

it's just Object Pascal , which is inferior to Python.

They are quite different languages, you can't compare them in a simple
way.
Delphi is statically typed, and compiles very quickly producing
"small" exes; "algorithmic" code can run a hundred times faster than
Python code. There are lot of people still that think that a
statically typed language is safer.
Delphi is kinda old, so today there are better languages than Delphi
(like D), but when Delphi 2-3 was out, there weren't many other
languages with IDEs at its level, especially for programs with a nice
GUIs plus interfaces with DBMSs. Today you can write programs with
FreePascal, that is free. Bashing other languages doesn't make Python
any better.

Bye,
bearophile

[david.lyon]

Quoting be************@lycos.com:

Stef Mientki:

>it's just Object Pascal , which is inferior to Python.

They are quite different languages, you can't compare them in a simple
way.
Delphi is kinda old, so today there are better languages than Delphi
(like D), but when Delphi 2-3 was out, there weren't many other
languages with IDEs at its level, especially for programs with a nice
GUIs plus interfaces with DBMSs.

I have programmed Delphi for years.. and was pretty much forced to
move to python for different reasons.

I would go along best with the description of delphi being "old". It
was great in its time... and had many advancements over others. Still
has some things that I would dearly love in python... like "skinned"
gui applications.

As for porting... don't.

Just rewrite them....

Shouldn't be so hard...

David

[Stef Mientki]

Bruno Desthuilliers wrote:

Stef Mientki a écrit :

>Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

>>In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>, Dotan
Cohen wrote:
I often see mention of SMBs that either want to upgrade their Windows
installations, or move to Linux, but cannot because of inhouse VB
apps.
Probably best to leave those legacy VB apps alone and develop new
replacements in a more open, cross-platform language, like Python.

Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)

Time to show the "don't feed the troll" sign, I guess.

Even without the smiley, I'm convinced of my statement.
cheers,
Stef

--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

[Ville M. Vainio]

Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.comwrites:

Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)

Time to show the "don't feed the troll" sign, I guess.

Even without the smiley, I'm convinced of my statement.
cheers,

I don't think I'm feeding the troll, but - ever took a look at PyQt?

[Stef Mientki]

Ville M. Vainio wrote:

Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.comwrites:

>>>Sorry but for GUI design, Python is pre-historic ;-)

Time to show the "don't feed the troll" sign, I guess.

Even without the smiley, I'm convinced of my statement.
cheers,

I don't think I'm feeding the troll, but - ever took a look at PyQt?

I wanted to go from Delphi to a free / open source environment,
for both open source and commercial applications.
So the Qt license stopped me from looking any further.

cheers,
stef

--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list

[Lawrence D'Oliveiro]

In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>,
da********@preisshare.net wrote:

Still has some things that I would dearly love in python... like "skinned"
gui applications.

That's a function of the GUI toolkit, not of the language. Python doesn't
make you use any GUI toolkit, nor does it prevent you from using any GUI
toolkit. It concentrates on the stuff a language should do, nothing more,
nothing less.

[Grant Edwards]

On 2008-10-20, Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.comwrote:

>I don't think I'm feeding the troll, but - ever took a look at
PyQt?

I wanted to go from Delphi to a free / open source
environment, for both open source and commercial applications.

So the Qt license stopped me from looking any further.

The Qt license is still free/open-source for commercial
applications as long as you license your app under the GPL.

Did you mean to say for both open source and closed source
applications?

--
Grant

[Stef Mientki]

Grant Edwards wrote:

On 2008-10-20, Stef Mientki <st**********@gmail.comwrote:

>>I don't think I'm feeding the troll, but - ever took a look at
PyQt?

I wanted to go from Delphi to a free / open source
environment, for both open source and commercial applications.

So the Qt license stopped me from looking any further.

The Qt license is still free/open-source for commercial
applications as long as you license your app under the GPL.

Did you mean to say for both open source and closed source
applications?

Yes,
although I realize closed source is not completely possibly in Python,
but that's no problem if the program is large/complex enough compared to
it's market value ;-)

cheers,
Stef

[Lawrence D'Oliveiro]

In message <ma**************************************@python.o rg>, Stef
Mientki wrote:

... although I realize closed source is not completely possibly in Python,
but that's no problem if the program is large/complex enough compared to
it's market value ;-)

Software has no market value. Business models that try to assign it one are
doomed to fight an uphill battle against market forces.

[Ben Finney]

Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ld*@geek-central.gen.new_zealandwrites:

Software has no market value. Business models that try to assign it
one are doomed to fight an uphill battle against market forces.

+1 QOTW.

--
\ “Yesterday I told a chicken to cross the road. It said, ‘What |
`\ for?’� —Steven Wright |
_o__) |
Ben Finney