wing ide vs. komodo?

[John Salerno]

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

[hg]

John Salerno wrote:

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

I'm testing them both now ... Wing IDE is in front (but I'm testing the
pro version).
hg

[Theerasak Photha]

On 10/13/06, John Salerno <jo******@nospamgmail.comwrote:

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

But that's really a good thing.

-- Theerasak

[John Salerno]

Theerasak Photha wrote:

On 10/13/06, John Salerno <jo******@nospamgmail.comwrote:

>Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

But that's really a good thing.

-- Theerasak

Yeah, features are more important, and probably you can customize the
look of the IDE anyway, so either one can look as full or as bare as you
want (I assume). Perhaps I'll give the trials a try myself, just to see,
although I know for sure I won't be buying the Pro version of Wing.

[hg]

Theerasak Photha wrote:

On 10/13/06, John Salerno <jo******@nospamgmail.comwrote:

>Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

But that's really a good thing.

-- Theerasak

I'm really interested: my *small* company is ready to spend the ~300$ in
the process, but Komodo looks _very_ sparse.

How do you go about it? ... I have resources to look at it for one or
two days.

hg

[Theerasak Photha]

On 10/13/06, hg <[e-mail]:

I'm really interested: my *small* company is ready to spend the ~300$ in
the process, but Komodo looks _very_ sparse.

How do you go about it? ... I have resources to look at it for one or
two days.

It's entirely possible you could use a free IDE as well. (Just
throwing it out there.)

-- Theerasak

[hg]

Theerasak Photha wrote:

On 10/13/06, hg <[e-mail]:

>I'm really interested: my *small* company is ready to spend the ~300$ in
the process, but Komodo looks _very_ sparse.

How do you go about it? ... I have resources to look at it for one or
two days.

It's entirely possible you could use a free IDE as well. (Just
throwing it out there.)

-- Theerasak

I have spend the past two years with eclipse/pydev ... a few issue are
still troublesome to me (speed, search for definitions ... being a few
of them) ... and until two days ago I had not even looked at Wing as I
wrongly thought it was on Windoze-based. But I must must admit I am
impressed - yet I feel it would be stupid to not look carefully at
Komodo ... hence my questions.

hg

[Theerasak Photha]

On 10/13/06, hg <[e-mail]:

I have spend the past two years with eclipse/pydev ... a few issue are
still troublesome to me (speed, search for definitions ... being a few
of them) ... and until two days ago I had not even looked at Wing as I
wrongly thought it was on Windoze-based. But I must must admit I am
impressed - yet I feel it would be stupid to not look carefully at
Komodo ... hence my questions.

I haven't used Komodo personally. I like Emacs. However:

1) *Appearing* sparse doesn't mean much---Emacs 22's GTK interface
'looks' sparse as well, and sparse is the last word that comes to mind
when I think of Emacs
2) I've *heard* good things about Komodo before from others---it might
just be awesome

Perhaps you could try the Eric IDE? I hear SPE is not in active
dev.--- a pity to be sure, but I have used Eric before and found it
pretty easy to use and featureful.

-- Theerasak

[John Salerno]

Theerasak Photha wrote:

On 10/13/06, hg <[e-mail]:

>I have spend the past two years with eclipse/pydev ... a few issue are
still troublesome to me (speed, search for definitions ... being a few
of them) ... and until two days ago I had not even looked at Wing as I
wrongly thought it was on Windoze-based. But I must must admit I am
impressed - yet I feel it would be stupid to not look carefully at
Komodo ... hence my questions.

I haven't used Komodo personally. I like Emacs. However:

1) *Appearing* sparse doesn't mean much---Emacs 22's GTK interface
'looks' sparse as well, and sparse is the last word that comes to mind
when I think of Emacs
2) I've *heard* good things about Komodo before from others---it might
just be awesome

Perhaps you could try the Eric IDE? I hear SPE is not in active
dev.--- a pity to be sure, but I have used Eric before and found it
pretty easy to use and featureful.

-- Theerasak

Is Eric available for Windows? I have found the install files before,
but they looked like it was for Linux.

[hg]

Theerasak Photha wrote:

On 10/13/06, hg <[e-mail]:

>I have spend the past two years with eclipse/pydev ... a few issue are
still troublesome to me (speed, search for definitions ... being a few
of them) ... and until two days ago I had not even looked at Wing as I
wrongly thought it was on Windoze-based. But I must must admit I am
impressed - yet I feel it would be stupid to not look carefully at
Komodo ... hence my questions.

I haven't used Komodo personally. I like Emacs. However:

1) *Appearing* sparse doesn't mean much---Emacs 22's GTK interface
'looks' sparse as well, and sparse is the last word that comes to mind
when I think of Emacs
2) I've *heard* good things about Komodo before from others---it might
just be awesome

Perhaps you could try the Eric IDE? I hear SPE is not in active
dev.--- a pity to be sure, but I have used Eric before and found it
pretty easy to use and featureful.

-- Theerasak

Eric3 is very nice and moving forward ... I believe it is based on the
QT library which free ... yet not so free under windows (i have yet to
understand the business model).
Emacs I use for very small project (my finger talk emacs ;-) ) ... but
CTAGS is a bit cumbersome for large projects and as my architectures
have much need for improvements, I need powerful tools to find my way
around.

PS: I also was taken aback by the fact that the PyDev license was
"per-year" ... it's like buying Word for a year only ... isn't it ?
hg

[Theerasak Photha]

On 10/13/06, John Salerno <jo******@nospamgmail.comwrote:

Is Eric available for Windows? I have found the install files before,
but they looked like it was for Linux.

You need QScintilla IIRC, but:

http://www.die-offenbachs.de/detlev/...timonials.html

"Eric is becoming an integral part of our Python development here at
Fluent. It's ability to set and trigger breakpoints in any thread is
unlike any other Python debugger we have tried. Through Eric's easy to
use interface and tight integration with PyQt, it has helped reduce
our debugging time, particularly on Windows platforms where it is used
heavily."

--- Andrew Bushnell, Fluent Inc.

So yeah. Good luck w/ it then, whatever your choice.

-- Theerasak

[Todd Whiteman]

Check the following links, somebody has already done the hard work for
you :)

http://wiki.python.org/moin/Integrat...ntEnvironments
http://spyced.blogspot.com/2006/02/p...de-review.html
http://spyced.blogspot.com/2005/09/r...thon-ides.html
http://www.straw-dogs.co.uk/blog/python-ide-review

Cheers,
Todd

John Salerno wrote:

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

[John Salerno]

Todd Whiteman wrote:

Check the following links, somebody has already done the hard work for
you :)

http://wiki.python.org/moin/Integrat...ntEnvironments
http://spyced.blogspot.com/2006/02/p...de-review.html
http://spyced.blogspot.com/2005/09/r...thon-ides.html
http://www.straw-dogs.co.uk/blog/python-ide-review

Cheers,
Todd

John Salerno wrote:

>Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

Nice, thanks!

[Paul Boddie]

hg wrote:

>
Eric3 is very nice and moving forward ... I believe it is based on the
QT library which free ... yet not so free under windows (i have yet to
understand the business model).

There are snapshots of Eric4 available, apparently. See here for more:

http://www.riverbankcomputing.co.uk/
http://www.die-offenbachs.de/detlev/eric4.html

[...]

PS: I also was taken aback by the fact that the PyDev license was
"per-year" ... it's like buying Word for a year only ... isn't it ?

Flashbacks to the age of shareware seem to be commonplace in the realm
of Eclipse, or that's how the scene seems to me.

Paul

[Sandra-24]

John Salerno wrote:

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Well I don't know about the personal edition, but I've used Komodo and
Wing, and I must say that I chose Wing in the end because it's debugger
is so much more robust than komodo. I tried remote debugging mod_python
using komodo, and it just choked. I spent a week trying to get it to
work. Wing, on the other hand, just worked. I have only the highest
praise for the Wing IDE Debugger, once you get to know it, it's so much
more powerful than Komodo's. The time saved over Komodo was well worth
the money for the professional edition.

-Sandra

[John Salerno]

John Salerno wrote:

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Komodo, on the other hand, seems to have more of the features that the
personal version of Wing IDE lacks (call tips, class browser, etc.) but
the look of it seems very sparse for some reason.

Well, I've tested out both for a little bit, and my first impression is
that Wing is very slow and laggy (Personal Edition, at least) compared
to Komodo. When you drag windows around, they leave huge trails, and the
autocomplete really slows down the text. Komodo didn't seem to have
these issues. But Wing's autocomplete definitely is more complete than
Komodo's.

[Heikki Toivonen]

"Eric is becoming an integral part of our Python development here at

Fluent. It's ability to set and trigger breakpoints in any thread is
unlike any other Python debugger we have tried. Through Eric's easy to
use interface and tight integration with PyQt, it has helped reduce
our debugging time, particularly on Windows platforms where it is used
heavily."

--- Andrew Bushnell, Fluent Inc.

I have found that both Komodo and Pydev can do this.

Wing IDE does not (although you can debug any single thread). They are
open to suggestions though, so if there is demand I am sure they would
add it.

Personally I have used Wing IDE, Komodo and Pydev. I think Wing IDE has
the best debugging experience (for single threaded apps), and is the
fastest. I really like the regex tool in Komodo, but eventually I more
or less stopped using it. I am currently a Pydev user. I like Pydev
because it is open source, cross platform, supports multi-threaded
debugging, and simply because Eclipse provides so much stuff (although
it is a pretty steep learning curve and it has its own annoyances).

--
Heikki Toivonen

[Heikki Toivonen]

"Eric is becoming an integral part of our Python development here at

Fluent. It's ability to set and trigger breakpoints in any thread is
unlike any other Python debugger we have tried. Through Eric's easy to
use interface and tight integration with PyQt, it has helped reduce
our debugging time, particularly on Windows platforms where it is used
heavily."

--- Andrew Bushnell, Fluent Inc.

I have found that both Komodo and Pydev can do this.

Wing IDE does not (although you can debug any single thread). They are
open to suggestions though, so if there is demand I am sure they would
add it.

Personally I have used Wing IDE, Komodo and Pydev. I think Wing IDE has
the best debugging experience (for single threaded apps), and is the
fastest. I really like the regex tool in Komodo, but eventually I more
or less stopped using it. I am currently a Pydev user. I like Pydev
because it is open source, cross platform, supports multi-threaded
debugging, and simply because Eclipse provides so much stuff (although
it is a pretty steep learning curve and it has its own annoyances).

--
Heikki Toivonen

[Heikki Toivonen]

Paul Boddie wrote:

hg wrote:

>PS: I also was taken aback by the fact that the PyDev license was
"per-year" ... it's like buying Word for a year only ... isn't it ?

Flashbacks to the age of shareware seem to be commonplace in the realm
of Eclipse, or that's how the scene seems to me.

You are confusing Pydev and Pydev Extensions. The former is free, the
latter costs money and has some advanced features. The Pydev maintainer
launched Pydev Extensions to get some extra cash and let him spend more
time on Pydev development.

--
Heikki Toivonen

[Paul Boddie]

Heikki Toivonen wrote:

Paul Boddie wrote:

hg wrote:

PS: I also was taken aback by the fact that the PyDev license was
"per-year" ... it's like buying Word for a year only ... isn't it ?

Flashbacks to the age of shareware seem to be commonplace in the realm
of Eclipse, or that's how the scene seems to me.

You are confusing Pydev and Pydev Extensions. The former is free, the
latter costs money and has some advanced features. The Pydev maintainer
launched Pydev Extensions to get some extra cash and let him spend more
time on Pydev development.

I think hg was confusing the two; I was merely making general remarks
about the Eclipse scene, and in particular certain J2EE-related
products which seem to add little value yet come with a price tag.

Paul

[jUrner]

Paul Boddie wrote:

hg wrote:

Eric3 is very nice and moving forward ... I believe it is based on the
QT library which free ... yet not so free under windows (i have yet to
understand the business model).

There are snapshots of Eric4 available, apparently. See here for more:

http://www.riverbankcomputing.co.uk/
http://www.die-offenbachs.de/detlev/eric4.html

[...]

Eric is in the state of being ported to Qt4 with Qt4 being available
commercial
licenced or gpl'ed on windows. Currently first Eric4 snapshots are
availabe,
more or less only waiting for QScintilla2 to arrive.

See the mailing list if interested
http://www.riverbankcomputing.com/mailman/listinfo/eric
or
http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.ide.eric

Jürgen

[Theerasak Photha]

On 13 Oct 2006 17:07:56 -0700, Sandra-24 <sa***********@yahoo.comwrote:

John Salerno wrote:

Just curious what users of the two big commercial IDEs think of them
compared to one another (if you've used both).

Wing IDE looks a lot nicer and fuller featured in the screenshots, but a
glance at the feature list shows that the "personal" version doesn't
even support code folding! That's a little ridiculous and makes me have
doubts about it.

Well I don't know about the personal edition, but I've used Komodo and
Wing, and I must say that I chose Wing in the end because it's debugger
is so much more robust than komodo. I tried remote debugging mod_python
using komodo, and it just choked. I spent a week trying to get it to
work. Wing, on the other hand, just worked. I have only the highest
praise for the Wing IDE Debugger, once you get to know it, it's so much
more powerful than Komodo's. The time saved over Komodo was well worth
the money for the professional edition.

Well, the beauty of Python is that even seasoned programmers have told
me that they've only used pdb several times /in their lives/.

-- Theerasak

[gblais]

I have both, but the IDE I use every day is SPE, which is shareware. I'm
not savvy enough to enumerate a feature comparison, but I do find SPE
extremely friendly and intuitive.

Gerry

[vj]

I've tried both and find WingIDE much faster than Komodo and the layout
is very well thought out. I love the way you can collapse all the
differnet panes with a few keystrokes. I also like their autocomplete
functionality.

Wing is developed by a small company, focussed on python development,
while komodo supports all the major scripting languages.

VJ

[Fuzzyman]

vj wrote:

I've tried both and find WingIDE much faster than Komodo and the layout
is very well thought out. I love the way you can collapse all the
differnet panes with a few keystrokes. I also like their autocomplete
functionality.

+1

I use Wing and enjoy its auto-completion.

Fuzzyman
http://www.voidspace.org.uk

Wing is developed by a small company, focussed on python development,
while komodo supports all the major scripting languages.

VJ

[vj]

Forgot to mention WING's file search and replace is pretty cool and
powerful. It keeps checking changes in a different thread. If you want
to change yyy in say 100 files you would:

1. specify yyy in the search window
2. A list of files get displayed with matching yyy
3. As you fix replace yyy in the files the list of files with matching
yyy reduces automatically. This is very cool and very useful.

Another thing I like about WING is that it warns you if you have tabs
ans spaces mixed in a file.

The embedded python shell is also a useful feature.

VJ

[Karlo Lozovina]

"vj" <vi******@gmail.comwrote in news:1162708898.962171.161120
@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com:

The embedded python shell is also a useful feature.

Yes, but Debug Probe and Stack Data absolutely rock! Can't live without
them anymore. Just set a breakpoint, run your code end then you can
inspect all of the structures via Stack Data, and you can play with those
structures using Debug Probe. Huge productivity boost...

--
_______ Karlo Lozovina - Mosor
| | |.-----.-----. web: http://www.mosor.net || ICQ#: 10667163
| || _ | _ | Parce mihi domine quia Dalmata sum.
|__|_|__||_____|_____|

[sjdevnull]

Karlo Lozovina wrote:

"vj" <vi******@gmail.comwrote in news:1162708898.962171.161120
@e3g2000cwe.googlegroups.com:

The embedded python shell is also a useful feature.

Yes, but Debug Probe and Stack Data absolutely rock! Can't live without
them anymore. Just set a breakpoint, run your code end then you can
inspect all of the structures via Stack Data, and you can play with those
structures using Debug Probe. Huge productivity boost...

Those are pretty basic features that any environment supporting a
symbolic python debugger should have, they're not a distinguishing
feature for one particular IDE--I wouldn't expect any environment that
didn't allow that to even be in the discussion.

[SPE - Stani's Python Editor]

gb****@cox.net schreef:

I have both, but the IDE I use every day is SPE, which is shareware. I'm
not savvy enough to enumerate a feature comparison, but I do find SPE
extremely friendly and intuitive.

Gerry

SPE is not shareware. It is open-source, gpl-licensed freeware.
Donations however never hurt.

Stani

--
http://pythonide.stani.be

[John Henry]

"cool" is in the eyes of the beholder.

While I agree that this can be useful in some situations, I find it
very annoying when all I want (and need) to do is a simple dumber
search and yet it tells me tons of useless searches that I don't care
for.

The inability to debug multi-threaded applications is pretty annoying
too. It's unacceptable that a "professional" level debugger can't
handle multithreaded code.

But then again, I depend on Wing everyday. I just have to build my
code with lots of "if debugging, don't thread else thread" type of
constructs...

vj wrote:

Forgot to mention WING's file search and replace is pretty cool and
powerful. It keeps checking changes in a different thread. If you want
to change yyy in say 100 files you would:

1. specify yyy in the search window
2. A list of files get displayed with matching yyy
3. As you fix replace yyy in the files the list of files with matching
yyy reduces automatically. This is very cool and very useful.

Another thing I like about WING is that it warns you if you have tabs
ans spaces mixed in a file.

The embedded python shell is also a useful feature.

VJ