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Recomended FS

Hi

I'm upgrading the DB sever hardware and also the Linux OS.

My Questions are:

1. What is the preferred FS to go with ? EXT3, Reiseref, JFS, XFS ? ( speed,
efficiency )
2. What is the most importent part in the Hardware ? fast HD, alot of mem,
or maybe strong cpu ?

Thanks in Advance

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Nov 12 '05
55 5186
On Mon, Oct 20, 2003 at 08:09:34AM -0400 I heard the voice of
Jeff, and lo! it spake thus:

insured shipping. But yeah, new scsi is quite expensive, but it can be
worth it... IMHO scsi is to be used in a raid, not alone. No one disk
can saturate the bw offered. (both ide and scsi).


The difference is that IDE *HAS* to be able to saturate the bus (which it
can't, of course; show me an IDE drive that pushes even 66MB/sec off the
platter) for the bus speed to matter, since IDE doesn't support
disconnection. Multiple SCSI drives can be stuffing data over the SCSI
channel all at once. They don't have to be RAID'd, they can be different
filesystems accessed in parallel.
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Nov 12 '05 #21
Some sort of ATA Raid is probably worth considering -

e.g. I am experimenting with a system using 2 ATA-66 Seagates + 1
Promise TX2000

The disks themselves give fairly poor performance when attached to the
std IDE channels :

sequential write 15Mb/s
sequential read 20Mb/s

But attached to the Promise card using RAID 0 do considerably better:

sequential write 52Mb/s
sequential read 52MB/s

Now you would probably not use RAID 0 for a "real" system (unless you
had good backups), but the difference is interesting

Note that even including the card, this is a very cheap setup.

(I have not gotten around to testing random read and writes, but if
anybody is interested I can test this and supply figures)

regards

Mark
Steve Crawford wrote:


Talk about timing...this article posted today seems quite apropos
(spoiler: SCSI beats IDE):

http://hardware.devchannel.org/hardw...&tid=38&tid=49

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Nov 12 '05 #22
On Tuesday 21 October 2003 11:26, Mark Kirkwood wrote:
(I have not gotten around to testing random read and writes, but if
anybody is interested I can test this and supply figures)


Can you compare ogbench results for the RAID and single IDE disks? It would be
great if you could turn off write caching of individual drives in RAID and
test it as well.

I think for lot of databases IDE RAID could be a good compramise. Just
remember its not the best out there. So use it when you have good
backups..:-)

Shridhar
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Nov 12 '05 #23
On Tue, Oct 21, 2003 at 06:56:52PM +1300, Mark Kirkwood wrote:
Some sort of ATA Raid is probably worth considering -

e.g. I am experimenting with a system using 2 ATA-66 Seagates + 1
Promise TX2000


We had some reasonably good luck with RAID on a 2-way Promise card,
but multi-disk ATA RAID has been a great disappointment. If I were
doing it again, I'd buy 2 or 3 ATA controllers and do the RAID in
software.

That said, even the 2-way RAID became almost uselessly slow when
multiple queries were running -- indeed, dramatically slower than a
plain single IDE drive. This is not at all the experience we have
with SCSI, so either the IDE RAID people haven't worked it all out,
or (more likely IMHO) there are limitations in IDE which make it
ill-suited to the access patterns of a database under multiple
simultaneous (divergent) queries.

A

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Nov 12 '05 #24
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Hash: SHA1

On Tue, 21 Oct 2003 18:56:52 +1300, Mark Kirkwood wrote:

Note that even including the card, this is a very cheap setup.

Yes, this is the single advantage of IDE vs SCSI. If the price of the storage system
is the *only* consideration, IDE is the way to go.
SCSI has a long history of providing sustained throughput for server systems.
IDE has a short history of providing very cheap storage for desktops.
- --
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pgp/gpg public key: http://www.keyserver.net/en/
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Nov 12 '05 #25
On Tue, 21 Oct 2003, Mark Kirkwood wrote:
Some sort of ATA Raid is probably worth considering -

e.g. I am experimenting with a system using 2 ATA-66 Seagates + 1
Promise TX2000

The disks themselves give fairly poor performance when attached to the
std IDE channels :

sequential write 15Mb/s
sequential read 20Mb/s

But attached to the Promise card using RAID 0 do considerably better:

sequential write 52Mb/s
sequential read 52MB/s

Now you would probably not use RAID 0 for a "real" system (unless you
had good backups), but the difference is interesting

Note that even including the card, this is a very cheap setup.

(I have not gotten around to testing random read and writes, but if
anybody is interested I can test this and supply figures)


OK, but here's the real test. As the postgres user, run 'pgbench -i',
then after that runs, run 'pgbench -c 50 -t 1000000'. While it's running
and settled (pg aux|grep postgres|wc -l should show a number of ~54 or
so.) pull the plug. Wait for the hard drives to spin down, then plug it
back in and power it one. With SCSI you will still have a coherent
database.

If you want a coherent database on IDE drives under postgresql you will
need to issue this command: 'hdparm -W0 /dev/hdx' where x is the letter of
the drives under the RAID array to turn off write caching. This will slow
them to a crawl on writes.

And there's plenty of uses for RAID 0 in real systems, just not generally
in real 24/7 systems. But for high speed batchs that might take a week to
run on a RAID5 but run in an hour on RAID0, that would be an acceptable
risk. Think of machines that read in all their data off of a NAS, crunch
it, and dump it back out in flat files when they're done.

For things like that IDE drives and RAID 0 make a nice fit. But don't put
the payroll on them. :-)
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Nov 12 '05 #26
On Tue, Oct 21, 2003 at 06:56:52PM +1300, Mark Kirkwood wrote:
Some sort of ATA Raid is probably worth considering -

e.g. I am experimenting with a system using 2 ATA-66 Seagates + 1
Promise TX2000
...
But attached to the Promise card using RAID 0 do considerably
better:

sequential write 52Mb/s
sequential read 52MB/s
...
Note that even including the card, this is a very cheap setup.


You may also want to consider the 3Ware IDE raid cards
(www.3ware.com). Unlike the Promise card, they are full hardware
RAID with onboard CPU's to handle all the RAID work and offload that
from your main CPU in your PC. They are a bit more expensive than
the Promise offerings, but when you consider than the larger cards do
RAID0/1/5 totally in hardware on the card, the price difference is
not so great afterall.

Some of their (3Ware's) larger cards allow you to attach up to 12 IDE
disks to the card as well as giving you hot swap capability.
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Nov 12 '05 #27
Hello,

Actually if you were to get off that Promise controller and on to a
3Ware or other "real" hardware RAID... you would probably
see even better performance.

Sincerely,

Joshua Drake
Mark Kirkwood wrote:
Some sort of ATA Raid is probably worth considering -

e.g. I am experimenting with a system using 2 ATA-66 Seagates + 1
Promise TX2000

The disks themselves give fairly poor performance when attached to the
std IDE channels :

sequential write 15Mb/s
sequential read 20Mb/s

But attached to the Promise card using RAID 0 do considerably better:

sequential write 52Mb/s
sequential read 52MB/s

Now you would probably not use RAID 0 for a "real" system (unless you
had good backups), but the difference is interesting

Note that even including the card, this is a very cheap setup.

(I have not gotten around to testing random read and writes, but if
anybody is interested I can test this and supply figures)

regards

Mark
Steve Crawford wrote:


Talk about timing...this article posted today seems quite apropos
(spoiler: SCSI beats IDE):

http://hardware.devchannel.org/hardw...&tid=38&tid=49


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Nov 12 '05 #28
re*****@yahoo.c om (Richard Ellis) wrote:
Some of their (3Ware's) larger cards allow you to attach up to 12 IDE
disks to the card as well as giving you hot swap capability.


This is all well and good, but may not sufficiently cover over the
Vital Problem with IDE drives, namely that they are likely to cache
writes and not tell the 3Ware controller about that.

It would doubtless be a slick thing to have an IDE RAID controller
with cache (that might well overcome some of the traditional problems
with IDE), but that only forcibly helps if you can turn off write
cacheing on the drives.
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Nov 12 '05 #29
Yes indeed - have come to that conclusion too (see other email)

Joshua D. Drake wrote:
Hello,

Actually if you were to get off that Promise controller and on to a
3Ware or other "real" hardware RAID... you would probably
see even better performance.

Sincerely,

Joshua Drake

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Nov 12 '05 #30

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