|OT?| Zend PHP Framework

[R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah]

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration>

<quote src="http://www.loudthinking.com/arc/000544.html">
PHP is a dead language.
</quote>

Is there anyone here to comment on that?

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

[Erwin Moller]

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration>
Well, let them create a framework.
Personally I always feel too tightly bound in a framework, so I tend to walk
away from them whenever possible.
I have seen a few in Java and Phyton, but it is just not my thing.
If you have coded for a longer time you tend to accumulate your own
classes/functions you can easily recycle when needed.

Nah, no framework for me please. :-)

<quote src="http://www.loudthinking.com/arc/000544.html">
PHP is a dead language.
</quote>
The one who wrote that is an idiot or very poorly informed.
What else can I say?
I see popularity of PHP growing.
I see more and more people around me embracing it, coming from different
diciplines (Design, ASP/VBscript, Java, Flash).
PHP dead? Lol, I wonder how I make a living using a dead language.

Is there anyone here to comment on that?
Yes, he/she is an idiot.

Regards,
Erwin Moller

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

[Justin Koivisto]

Erwin Moller wrote:

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration>
Well, let them create a framework.
Personally I always feel too tightly bound in a framework, so I tend to walk
away from them whenever possible.
I have seen a few in Java and Phyton, but it is just not my thing.
If you have coded for a longer time you tend to accumulate your own
classes/functions you can easily recycle when needed.

Nah, no framework for me please. :-)

I haven't used a real "framework" yet, but I may give one a try at some
point when I'm not so darn busy. Of course, in the last 12 months I
think there was about 3 weeks where I could have had the time to do
that... ;)

<quote src="http://www.loudthinking.com/arc/000544.html">
PHP is a dead language.
</quote>

The one who wrote that is an idiot or very poorly informed.

PHP dead? Lol, I wonder how I make a living using a dead language.

Same here... (see above)

--
Justin Koivisto, ZCE - ju****@koivi.com
http://koivi.com

[A. Timurhan Cevik]

I dont understand the hassle.
The paragraph

They're looking for that "extreme simplicity" that comes from a
good review process, tons of testing, the inclusion of modues/features
that most people use, and providing good, easy-to-use documentation for
the entire project.

is not even descriptive, its too generic. How can one comment upon this
? I believe Zend havenot decided or does not want to publish the
framework's design, so its too early to talk about the framework.

I agree with some posts on the blog, a lot of frameworks are lying
around but neither of them has gained advantage upon the other. Maybe
some good software developers can create a fascinating framework.

And about working with frameworks, you may not use them yes, but
understanding the internals is essential, if you are going to build
your own, to see the strengths and weaknesses. Not using any framework,
including yours ? Then you are wasting time, doing things you have done
over and over again.

I look forward to that framework.

[Chung Leong]

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration>

<quote src="http://www.loudthinking.com/arc/000544.html">
PHP is a dead language.
</quote>

Is there anyone here to comment on that?

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

I hope it fails. If this framework gains any traction, it won't be long
'til its use would--de facto--be mandatory.

I wish Ruby on Rail all the best. As histroy has shown, the promised
next-best-thing would never turn out to be the next-best-thing. Those
attracted to a technology because of hype instead of usefulness will
ultimately destroy it. PHP doesn't need to be more popular--it needs to
be more useful.

[R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah]

A. Timurhan Cevik wrote:

I dont understand the hassle.
The paragraph

They're looking for that "extreme simplicity" that comes from a
good review process, tons of testing, the inclusion of modues/features
that most people use, and providing good, easy-to-use documentation for
the entire project.

is not even descriptive, its too generic. How can one comment upon this
? I believe Zend havenot decided or does not want to publish the
framework's design, so its too early to talk about the framework.

<snip>

There is a presentation on Zend framework
<http://www.phparch.com/webcasts/player/Main_content.php?p=L3RyYWluaW5nL3NsaWRlcy9aRkNBU1Q vcmVjb3JkaW5ncy9yZWNvcmQuZmx2>
But, it's all look like that they're worried by the hype on Ruby Rails
and might affect their business.

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

[R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah]

Chung Leong wrote:

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration> <snip> Is there anyone here to comment on that?

I hope it fails. If this framework gains any traction, it won't be long
'til its use would--de facto--be mandatory.

I wish Ruby on Rail all the best. As histroy has shown, the promised
next-best-thing would never turn out to be the next-best-thing. Those
attracted to a technology because of hype instead of usefulness will
ultimately destroy it. PHP doesn't need to be more popular--it needs to
be more useful.

You may be right; but, I guess Ruby on Rails would kill PHP if
they didn't take any steps such as Zend PHP Framework. Think, why
they've to divert their business from core PHP to Framework. I'm sure,
such a framework "create your website in just 10mins" will attract more
than a hard core language. I also think that there will be a better
framework coming. Would be better if there is a Visual PHP or something
like that in which we manage the abstractions, etc and that in turn to
create a tight code.

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

[R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah]

Erwin Moller wrote:

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

There are some criticism and speculations about Zend PHP Framework
<http://www.zend.com/collaboration>

Well, let them create a framework.
Personally I always feel too tightly bound in a framework, so I tend to walk
away from them whenever possible.

<snip>

True, but being bound to some framework lightens the work. Say, for
example, we have lot of frameworks in PHP and to debug a PHP code, one
has to do take lot of efforts as there are more than one way to do
things. But, I too agree that PHP has to be something like Assembler of
Web programming--which is capable of doing things at ease.

<quote src="http://www.loudthinking.com/arc/000544.html">
PHP is a dead language.
</quote>

The one who wrote that is an idiot or very poorly informed.

<snip>

True, but I think, there is also some point. Think about a new
guy who doesn't know anything about web programming but wants to
program, which would he prefer *today*?

--
<?php echo 'Just another PHP saint'; ?>
Email: rrjanbiah-at-Y!com Blog: http://rajeshanbiah.blogspot.com/

[Chung Leong]

R. Rajesh Jeba Anbiah wrote:

You may be right; but, I guess Ruby on Rails would kill PHP if
they didn't take any steps such as Zend PHP Framework. Think, why
they've to divert their business from core PHP to Framework. I'm sure,
such a framework "create your website in just 10mins" will attract more
than a hard core language. I also think that there will be a better
framework coming. Would be better if there is a Visual PHP or something
like that in which we manage the abstractions, etc and that in turn to
create a tight code.

By "killed" I figure you mean denied the spotlight. Regardless of the
popularity of Rail, PHP will be as useful as it has been. Long time
programmers won't suddenly abandon a trusted tool just because there's
something talked about. I mean just look at C. People have been
predicting the death of that language for years. Meanwhile, most
important softwares are still written in C.

[william.clarke]

As a web programming semi-newbie (only a few years in the trade) I've
found PHP to be my preference out of the available development options.
I've written sites in ASP and done some other light stuff in ASP.NET
and I'd still recommend PHP to anyone except the most die-hard
Microsoftie. The range of good libraries and support make it easy to
learn and the majority of the language is fairly intuitive to people
with a programming background.

I guess if PHP was your first foray into programming of any sort you
may have difficulty but I would have thought the same could be said for
ASP and ASP.NET.

PHP a dead language...I don't think so.