(from http://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html )
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously.
Posted by Declan McCullagh
The Recording Industry Association of America has found a new legal target
for a copyright lawsuit: Usenet.
In a lawsuit filed on October 12, the RIAA says that Usenet newsgroups
contain "millions of copyrighted sound recordings" in violation of federal
law.
Only Usenet.com is named as a defendant for now, but the same logic would
let the RIAA sue hundreds of universities, Internet service providers, and
other newsgroup archives. AT&T offers Usenet, as does Verizon, Stanford
University and other companies including Giganews.
That's what makes this lawsuit important. If the RIAA can win against
Usenet.com, other Usenet providers are at legal risk, too.
For those of you who are relative newcomers to the Internet, Usenet was a
wildly popular way to distribute conversations and binary files long before
the Web or peer-to-peer networks existed. It's divided up into tens of
thousands of "newsgroups"--discussion areas arranged hierarchically and
sporting names like sci.med.aids, rec.motorcycles, and comp.os.linux.admin.
A handful are moderated; most are not. For efficiency's sake, recent posts
to newsgroups are stored on the Usenet provider's server (as opposed to
saved on a subscriber's computer as mailing lists are).
Some newsgroups, like alt.binaries.pictures, are devoted to the distribution
of binary files. Of particular relevance to the RIAA lawsuit is that there
are around 652 newsgroups with the phrase "MP3" in their names. (For storage
space reasons, not all Usenet providers offer binary newsgroups. Google's
Web-based interface to Usenet doesn't, for instance.)
The RIAA sued Usenet.com, which is based in Fargo, N.D., in the southern
district of New York. The lawsuit claims Usenet.com encourages its customers
to pay up to $19 a month by enticing them with copyrighted music, and asks
for a permanent injunction barring the company from "aiding, encouraging,
enabling, inducing, causing, materially contributing to, or otherwise
facilitating" copyright infringement.
There are some differences between Usenet.com and some of the other
newsgroup providers that will help the RIAA. Usenet.com boasts that signing
up for an account "gives you access to millions of MP3 files and also
enables you to post your own files the same way and share them with the
whole world."
Clearly they didn't run that language by their lawyers first.
So will the RIAA win? Thanks to improvident boasts like that, they stand a
good chance. One reason the U.S. Supreme Court ruled against Grokster is
that the justices believed that StreamCast's executives had tried to lure
pirates into using the Morpheus application. The justices also said that
neither company filtered copyrighted material and "the business models
employed by Grokster and StreamCast confirm that their principal object was
use of their software to download copyrighted works."
What the RIAA's doing here is a classic litigation strategy: sue someone who
a judge is likely to say is a clear offender, and then invoke that decision
when targeting someone who's a more marginal case. Usenet.com may be first,
in other words, but newsgroup providers like AT&T, Verizon, and Stanford may
well be next. 19  1670 
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 07:03:19 -0400, Leythos wrote:
In article <Q8****************@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, ji*@home.net
says...
>(from http://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html )
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously.
Posted by Declan McCullagh
The Recording Industry Association of America has found a new legal target
for a copyright lawsuit: Usenet.
In a lawsuit filed on October 12, the RIAA says that Usenet newsgroups
contain "millions of copyrighted sound recordings" in violation of federal
law.
Only Usenet.com is named as a defendant for now, but the same logic would
let the RIAA sue hundreds of universities, Internet service providers, and
other newsgroup archives. AT&T offers Usenet, as does Verizon, Stanford
University and other companies including Giganews.
That's what makes this lawsuit important. If the RIAA can win against
Usenet.com, other Usenet providers are at legal risk, too.
For those of you who are relative newcomers to the Internet, Usenet was a
wildly popular way to distribute conversations and binary files long before
the Web or peer-to-peer networks existed. It's divided up into tens of
thousands of "newsgroups"--discussion areas arranged hierarchically and
sporting names like sci.med.aids, rec.motorcycles, and comp.os.linux.admin.
A handful are moderated; most are not. For efficiency's sake, recent posts
to newsgroups are stored on the Usenet provider's server (as opposed to
saved on a subscriber's computer as mailing lists are).
I think it will be a great day, like the early days of Usenet, when they
stop allowing mime encoded attachments to messages. If usenet went back
to non-binaries it would be a great place again, and ISP's would not
have to outsource their service to larger companies that specialize in
Usenet service.
I agree with that, there shouldn't be a need to pass binaries in news
groups. At one time if the news group needed extra content you would just
run a web site for the extra parts.
Forums and other private groups are probably much beeter for that. In the
forums I use we do pass script and source code around, it has a size limit
of about 2M but rarely comes close to that as much of it is samples of
single functions/classes. Sometimes a jokey video has been passed, but now
this sort of thing tends to be embedded with a link to the source.
I do like to have some markup language in the forums, for hilights and
such, I don't think there is as much need for pure text news groups as
there once was. The problem there is if you allow a bit of markup, people
will always ask for more, until you get close to a full html.
odf may be better, because readers can simply filter out those bits the
user opts out of, or will miss out any section it doesn't understand. So
it should satisfy those that want to use a simple reader/editor as well as
those who want it pretty, without the loss of text.
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 15:21:17 +0100, BearItAll wrote:
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 07:03:19 -0400, Leythos wrote:
>In article <Q8****************@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, ji*@home.net
says...
>>(from http://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html )
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously. Posted by Declan
McCullagh
The Recording Industry Association of America has found a new legal
target for a copyright lawsuit: Usenet.
In a lawsuit filed on October 12, the RIAA says that Usenet newsgroups
contain "millions of copyrighted sound recordings" in violation of
federal law.
Only Usenet.com is named as a defendant for now, but the same logic
would let the RIAA sue hundreds of universities, Internet service
providers, and other newsgroup archives. AT&T offers Usenet, as does
Verizon, Stanford University and other companies including Giganews.
That's what makes this lawsuit important. If the RIAA can win against
Usenet.com, other Usenet providers are at legal risk, too.
For those of you who are relative newcomers to the Internet, Usenet
was a wildly popular way to distribute conversations and binary files
long before the Web or peer-to-peer networks existed. It's divided up
into tens of thousands of "newsgroups"--discussion areas arranged
hierarchically and sporting names like sci.med.aids, rec.motorcycles,
and comp.os.linux.admin. A handful are moderated; most are not. For
efficiency's sake, recent posts to newsgroups are stored on the Usenet
provider's server (as opposed to saved on a subscriber's computer as
mailing lists are).
I think it will be a great day, like the early days of Usenet, when
they stop allowing mime encoded attachments to messages. If usenet went
back to non-binaries it would be a great place again, and ISP's would
not have to outsource their service to larger companies that specialize
in Usenet service.
I agree with that, there shouldn't be a need to pass binaries in news
groups. At one time if the news group needed extra content you would
just run a web site for the extra parts.
Why shouldn't there be a need?
Just because you don't have the need, why can't someone else have it?
If you don't want binaries or don't need binaries then don't go to binary
groups. It's really simple.
--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6
君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
君のこと忘れたときがないから
BearItAll wrote:
>
I agree with that, there shouldn't be a need to pass binaries in news
groups. At one time if the news group needed extra content you would
just run a web site for the extra parts.
We run into this conflict all the time, as in "No one NEEDS an assault
rifle!"
"Need" is not the operative word; "Want" is.
"Mick Murphy" <Mi********@discussions.microsoft.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@microsof t.com...
Yawn!!!!
Who cares!!!!
It is nice to know where to find a copy of an os that works in case Bill
Gates decides to pull the plug everytime he thinks somebody is a criminal.
Hopefully, if Vista stops working we can go to usenet to get a working copy
to get OUR data back. Of course, now a days some people think it is a crime
to take back your own property that you paid for.
Floyd
--
Mostly Free Phones dot com has many free smart phones
Unlocked phones with no contract also
batteries and accessories
survivaldealer dot com
witchwellenergy dot com
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 17:39:57 -0400, Leythos <vo**@nowhere.lanwrote:
>As far as idiots, you seem to be a member in good standing of that
club. Usenet was formed with one purpose in mind. NO RULES.
Bull crap - only an idiot would believe that.
>I know. I
was there from the beginning.
I was posting to Usenet in 84, I don't believe you were using it then,
you certainly don't have the technical skills to have used a computer
that long.
Seeing some the slop you've posted what you believe and reality rarely
meet. You fanboy wannabe types are quite funny to read when you get
your underwear all bunched up like yours obviously are right now. If
you first started posting in 1984, you came to the party very late. It
began quite innocently in late 1979.
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 10:19:37 -0600, Free Phones wrote:
"Mick Murphy" <Mi********@discussions.microsoft.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@microsof t.com...
>Yawn!!!!
Who cares!!!!
It is nice to know where to find a copy of an os that works in case Bill
Gates decides to pull the plug everytime he thinks somebody is a
criminal. Hopefully, if Vista stops working we can go to usenet to get a
working copy to get OUR data back. Of course, now a days some people
think it is a crime to take back your own property that you paid for.
It's almost getting to the point where it's becoming a crime to simply
use the data you paid money for....
--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6
君のこと思い出す日なんてないのは
君のこと忘れたときがないから
Leythos <vo**@nowhere.lanwrote in
news:MP************************@adfree.Usenet.com:
Almost 1TB per day is associated with binaries on busy servers.
Actually Leythos....the latest estimates are upwards of 3 TB/day.
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 19:14:43 -0400, Leythos <vo**@nowhere.lanwrote:
>In article <mu********************************@4ax.com>, AA@ABC.net
says...
>On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 17:39:57 -0400, Leythos <vo**@nowhere.lanwrote:
>As far as idiots, you seem to be a member in good standing of that
club. Usenet was formed with one purpose in mind. NO RULES.
Bull crap - only an idiot would believe that.
I know. I
was there from the beginning.
I was posting to Usenet in 84, I don't believe you were using it then,
you certainly don't have the technical skills to have used a computer
that long.
Seeing some the slop you've posted what you believe and reality rarely
meet. You fanboy wannabe types are quite funny to read when you get
your underwear all bunched up like yours obviously are right now. If
you first started posting in 1984, you came to the party very late. It
began quite innocently in late 1979.
And you were not there then and not there until, well, you're not all
here now either.
>So, you've proven my point again sonny.
How would you know? You're just another self-important idiot like
Frank. Thanks for proving whatever you say comes out of thin air or
your ass. Tell us Which.
On Oct 17, 3:50 am, "jim" <j...@home.netwrote:
(fromhttp://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html)
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously.
So what's the over-under (in years or months) that the RIAA will
officially declare Linux to be a tool for piracy.
Darth Chaos wrote:
On Oct 17, 3:50 am, "jim" <j...@home.netwrote:
>(fromhttp://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html)
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously.
So what's the over-under (in years or months) that the RIAA will
officially declare Linux to be a tool for piracy.
Rather depends on when Steve Ballmer thinks of it (Looks at watch)
What Bill Gates SHOULD do is withdraw Windows of all types from the European
Union. My, how they will scream. And there is NOTHING they could do about
it.
"Free Phones" <fl***@mostlyfreephones.comwrote in message
news:OJ**************@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
"Mick Murphy" <Mi********@discussions.microsoft.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@microsof t.com...
>Yawn!!!!
Who cares!!!!
It is nice to know where to find a copy of an os that works in case Bill
Gates decides to pull the plug everytime he thinks somebody is a criminal.
Hopefully, if Vista stops working we can go to usenet to get a working
copy to get OUR data back. Of course, now a days some people think it is
a crime to take back your own property that you paid for.
Floyd
--
Mostly Free Phones dot com has many free smart phones
Unlocked phones with no contract also
batteries and accessories
survivaldealer dot com
witchwellenergy dot com
____/ Darth Chaos on Thursday 18 October 2007 03:22 : \____
On Oct 17, 3:50 am, "jim" <j...@home.netwrote:
>(fromhttp://www.news.com/8301-13578_3-9798715-38.html)
October 16, 2007 5:56 PM PDT
RIAA tries to pull plug on Usenet. Seriously.
So what's the over-under (in years or months) that the RIAA will
officially declare Linux to be a tool for piracy.
No, leave that to eBay.
--
~~ Best of wishes
Roy S. Schestowitz | Open syntax, Open API's, Open Source http://Schestowitz.com | Open Prospects | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
Tasks: 124 total, 1 running, 121 sleeping, 0 stopped, 2 zombie http://iuron.com - knowledge engine, not a search engine
On 18/10/2007 in message <u8**************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gblTelstar
wrote:
>What Bill Gates SHOULD do is withdraw Windows of all types from the
European Union. My, how they will scream. And there is NOTHING they
could do about it.
There is already a large movement to open source software in the EU, it
would just accelerate that. It seems to me that the key difference here is
that we are not in thrall to industry, we expect them to act responsibly,
and we are willing to stand up to bullying.
--
Jeff Gaines
On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:14:27 -0500, Adam Albright wrote:
>
As far as idiots, you seem to be a member in good standing of that
club. Usenet was formed with one purpose in mind. NO RULES.
That is completely wrong.
Usenet was formed on the back of bulletin boards. It was innitially just
an easier way to find groups or boards, before then you had to wait until
someone invited you, the groups were to talk about things you are
interested in.
Obviously there were many UNIX bulletin boards, because bulletin
boards started on UNIX. But you also got many other groups as things
picked up speed.
The only reason rules started to come into play was because of the
spoilers, those who would set up a script to pour gunge into the boards.
Then later spam and adverts.
The news groups are full of spoiled groups, some ran their course and died
naturally, others were attempting to be free of control and were simply
destroyed with spam.
I know. I
was there from the beginning. Yet there are always bozos like you that
always attempt to impose and enforce rules you think would fit your
distorted view of what others may enjoy.
There are two sorts of rules, those that try to limit what the posters can
say, I am fully against those. I don't like the little hitlers banning
people from groups or filtering posts, because it always ends up with them
filtering out any post that disagrees with their own stance, what ever the
subject.
The other rules are those that try to protect the users so that they can
say what they want to say. These have limited success.
As fot the binaries though, you have to remember that not everyone is on
broadband and not everyone likes to boot into a gui. A huge block of mime
can tie up a farmers PC for ages. For those on text only readers it is
just a huge block of crap.
Binaries are much better out of the news group, just a link to another
place.
I would be interested to know why you were so insulting to lythos. I
thought his comments were reasonable.
And yes, I too was there at the start, so don't try to use the 'I was on
the first BB' argument with me because those days are long gone and it
just don't wash as a modern argument, the people are different, not
better and not worse, just different. We were all 100% techies/geeks in
those days and many of the groups were pretty much the same thing, mates
talking pewters, arranging the next beer fest, oops I mean UNIX show and
sharing bits and bobs.
If the modern news groups were pure geek as they were then, no one would
join them, including myself. Such things have a limited life.
Telstar wrote:
What Bill Gates SHOULD do is withdraw Windows of all types from the European
Union. My, how they will scream. And there is NOTHING they could do about
it.
That would just speed up their already progressive move to linux.
>
"Free Phones" <fl***@mostlyfreephones.comwrote in message
news:OJ**************@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>"Mick Murphy" <Mi********@discussions.microsoft.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@microso ft.com...
>>Yawn!!!!
Who cares!!!!
It is nice to know where to find a copy of an os that works in case Bill
Gates decides to pull the plug everytime he thinks somebody is a criminal.
Hopefully, if Vista stops working we can go to usenet to get a working
copy to get OUR data back. Of course, now a days some people think it is
a crime to take back your own property that you paid for.
Floyd
--
Mostly Free Phones dot com has many free smart phones
Unlocked phones with no contract also
batteries and accessories
survivaldealer dot com
witchwellenergy dot com
--
Priceless quotes in m.p.w.vista.general group: http://protectfreedom.tripod.com/kick.html
"Fair use is not merely a nice concept--it is a federal law based on
free speech rights under the First Amendment and is a cornerstone of the
creativity and innovation that is a hallmark of this country. Consumer
rights in the digital age are not frivolous."
- Maura Corbett
"The poster formerly known as 'The Poster Formerly Known as Nina DiBoy'"
<no**@none.notwrote in message news:ff**********@aioe.org...
Telstar wrote:
>What Bill Gates SHOULD do is withdraw Windows of all types from the
European Union. My, how they will scream. And there is NOTHING they
could do about it.
That would just speed up their already progressive move to linux.
The greatest thing that would speed the movement to more progressive
platforms, more choice and more economic growth would be the simple act of
passing Open Data Format legislation.
But, its evidentally too simple a task for most to grasp.
jim
"The poster formerly known as 'The Poster Formerly Known as Nina DiBoy'"
<no**@none.notwrote in message news:ff**********@aioe.org...
Telstar wrote:
>What Bill Gates SHOULD do is withdraw Windows of all types from the
European Union. My, how they will scream. And there is NOTHING they
could do about it.
That would just speed up their already progressive move to linux.
I'd take that bet. They would fail. The EU is a complete disaster of an
organization. Progressive? The most regressive concept in political
history, unable to do a thing.
On 2007-10-17, Leythos <vo**@nowhere.lanwrote:
In article <Z6******************************@giganews.com>,
no**********@screwspammers.com says...
I agree with that, there shouldn't be a need to pass binaries in news
groups. At one time if the news group needed extra content you would
just run a web site for the extra parts.
Why shouldn't there be a need?
Just because you don't have the need, why can't someone else have it?
If you don't want binaries or don't need binaries then don't go to binary
groups. It's really simple.
My guess is that you didn't know about Usenet until after your first MS
PC, and MS was late getting into the Usenet world.
Usenet was setup to allow groups to share information on related topics.
In the early days you could not pass files (mime attachments), but when
it was updated to also work over SMTP it had to follow the email
standards which included attachments.
MIME? Are you kidding?
Did you just fall off the turnip truck yesterday?
[deletia]
Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
---------------------------------------------------------- http://www.usenet.com This thread has been closed and replies have been disabled. Please start a new discussion. Similar topics
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