.NET Framework occurence/spread

[truetype]

Greetings!

I consider to create an application using .NET Framework. It would be used
by any kind user, mostly those who do not know anyting about programming and
..NET Framework.

But have some hesitations about .NET Framework occurence on computers of
such users. Is there any statistics regarding this problem? I'm intrested
mostly in statistics for USA and European Union.

I'm from East Europe and we've got not a good Internet connection. So my
hesitations are also due to whether a user from USA (EU) could download .NET
Framework in order to use my software (surely it he would think it's worth
it!)...

Any kind of info would be useful.

Thanks

[Cor Ligthert]

Hi TrueType,

You make me curious more than 100 kilometers west from Asia?

:-)

In my opinion there are not even *good* statics about what OS user computers
have.

How do you want to measure that. So asking how many have installed the as
freeware installable Net framework is for me the same as asking how many
small fishes are there in the Balticsea..

Some links to try your next question.

Redistrubutable Net 1.1
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
Net 1.1 sp1
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
I hope this helps,

Cor

[truetype]

Hi, Con

Thanks for your reply.

First of all, I do not ask about exact statistics. But I'm sure Microsoft
has more or less precise info. It can be calculated roughly by counting
number of .NET Framework downloads from microsoft.com (it will be lower
estimation).

The second, it's more important for me the quality of Internet connection?
If you have cheap high speed broadband, it's not a big deal to download and
install .NET Framework in order to run the application that needs it.

I do not (and did not) ask about statisitcs or official info on quality of
connection. I just want to hear opinions about it, regarding the ability to
download and install .NET Framework.

-=truetype=-

[Cor Ligthert]

TreuType

The second, it's more important for me the quality of Internet connection?
If you have cheap high speed broadband, it's not a big deal to download
and
install .NET Framework in order to run the application that needs it.

Therefore I asked to be more precise what is for you Eastern Europe

And because of the fact that every area in Europe has its own language
should that be easily to find on Google with a qeustion in that language

Cor

[Morten Wennevik]

Hi truetype,

Your question is a bit odd, so correct me if I have misread it.

If the target audience hasn't used a .Net Framework application before
chances are they won't have .Net Framework installed. Installing it is a
simple matter using Windows Update or the Framework redistributable.

Any kind of .Net Framework (of the same version) can run any .Net
Framework application written for that version regardless of what language
the Framework is installed with. A person in USA with an English version
of .Net can run your application just fine.

--
Happy Coding!
Morten Wennevik [C# MVP]

[truetype]

Hi, Morthen

Thank you for reply.

I mean the following: .NET Framework is a competitive platfrom against, for
example, J2EE. Surely, Microsoft wants .NET Framework to be used by
developers and, in the end, users who run applications written by developers.
..NET Framework is a patch you should install. But users mostly don't like to
bother downloading additional packages to run some application, they would
probably choose another application, which can be installed in easier way.

So, Microsoft has to convince users and developers in any way that .NET
Framework has many powerful features and that they should install it and use
as a developing tool. Such convincing needs money, which Microsoft has to
invest. Investing this money they should inform shareholders, comminities,
societies about return on how many users and developers (in percentage, bars,
diagrams or any other) install .NET Framework.

This information can exist in some articles, news, press releases and so on.
The question is: does anyone know this info or know where can I read it? I've
searched many articles and found some useful/intresting info about
development of .NET Framework and forecasts about its use. But I need more.

The second question is: does user (from USA or EU) have in average so cheap
and good quality internet connection that he can allow to himself/herself to
download ~24 MB of .NET Framework? What's your personal opinion?

By the way, does Windows Update install .NET Framework? Is .NET Framework
included into WinXP SP2?

Thanks,

-=truetype=-

[Cor Ligthert]

TrueType,

I thought that this was your question. It comes every 3 days in this
newsgroup. Gets long trolling threads.

That is why Morten probably and I for sure first answered you seriously.

I would say, search this newsgroup, you find tons of messages.

In Western Europe have most *serious* users broadband or ADSL, it is a goal
for the EU administration to get that everywhere.

Cor

[truetype]

Con,

I'm from Moscow, Russian Federation. But my question about Internet
Connection is concerned with USA & EU (Western Europe to be more precise).

Using Google I will only find information of providers stating about "their
best quality internet connection". I want user's opinion.

Thanks

-=truetype=-

[Morten Wennevik]

Hi,

..Net Framework is optional and won't be installed through Windows Update
unless you actively choose to do it. To install through Windows Update you
need to select it from the optional updates. Nor is it installed with XP
Service Pack 2. It is however installed by default in Windows 2003 and
most likely any version after that.

As for the average connection in USA, I don't know (I'm in Norway myself,
which isn't in EU either :P). I believe a 24mb download through modem/isdn
is in the upper limit of what people might be prepared to download, and
that quite a few people probably won't do it.

Then again, people who download your program over the internet is probably
more likely to accept the download time .Net Framework would require than
the average person.

As for marketing strategies. There are plenty of seminars related to
..Net, and at least in Norway there is a TV ad campaign that more or less
is related to .Net and its ability to "help anyone do whatever they want",
although it doesn't mention the word .Net. There is also the MVP program
and plenty other +++

You can find information about .Net here:

http://www.microsoft.com/net/
PS! Java isn't installed by default either so .Net wouldn't be at much of
an disadvantage here.

--
Happy Coding!
Morten Wennevik [C# MVP]

[truetype]

Con

Can you help me find it? I'm a newbie to MSDN discussions.

Thanks

-=truetype=-

[Cor Ligthert]

Here some figurs from June 2004 (this are of course world wide collected
statistic, it will be figers from much earlier), it is raising very quick
where I readed that in by instance Belgium it was in februari 2005 66% while
that is in this statistic still 16,7

http://www.winter.pl/internet/w0557.html

I hope that this gives some ideas for this never ending trolling questions
in this newsgroup.

Cor

[Cor Ligthert]

I hope you can read some Polish in my opinion is that not so different. I
have given a page bellow.

I'm from Moscow, Russian Federation. But my question about Internet
Connection is concerned with USA & EU (Western Europe to be more precise).

However as you will see in that is it that quick growing that collected
figures are more or less irrelevant.

Reading in this newsgroup will mostly give you opinions from people who use
it as an argument that Net will not be used. It ends mostly that they want
to know it for freeware and than even on MS-DOS computers. It wont work on
MS-Dos computers.

Cor

[truetype]

Morten,

As for the average connection in USA, I don't know (I'm in Norway myself,
which isn't in EU either :P). I believe a 24mb download through modem/isdn
is in the upper limit of what people might be prepared to download, and
that quite a few people probably won't do it.
It's not quite clear for me. You mean "a few people won't download .NET
Framework"? Please, clarify.

Then again, people who download your program over the internet is probably
more likely to accept the download time .Net Framework would require than
the average person.
Or choose to download a program that does not require downloading ~24 MB of
something weird :)

PS! Java isn't installed by default either so .Net wouldn't be at much of
an disadvantage here.

Well, Java is my bad example. It's also about fighting with MFC, WinAPI,
etc.. :)

Thanks

-=truetype=-

[truetype]

Thanks, Con

-=truetype=-

[Morten Wennevik]

> It's not quite clear for me. You mean "a few people won't download .NET

Framework"? Please, clarify.
I mean some people with modem/isdn may accept a download size of 1-2 mb
but won't download something that would take two hours to download
Well, Java is my bad example. It's also about fighting with MFC, WinAPI,
etc.. :)

You are at a disadvantage with .Net since you can't assume the client
having all the necessary files. If someone downloads your application
over the internet, supplying information on how to obtain/install .Net
should be sufficient. If you ship on CD, simply ship the Framework
redistributable along with it, much like DirectX is shipped with most
games.

--
Happy Coding!
Morten Wennevik [C# MVP]

[truetype]

Thanks a lot

-=truetype=-

[private]

I'm curious why .NET penetration is (or should be) such a mystery. Here is
an excerpt from a report I get daily from my company Web server logs:

Number of clients with .NET Framework installed at our client base
24hrs ending 04/08 3am: <absolute numbers omitted> unique IPs: 41.9%
Note: this is a count of only those with 200 server status to our site

It's actually based on the number of IE browsers sending ".NET CLR" as part
of the User-Agent header. Not 100% representative or accurate, but pretty
close I think.

[private]

This is another source of relevant info:
http://blogs.msdn.com/scottwil/archi...09/391199.aspx

"private" <undisclosed> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...

I'm curious why .NET penetration is (or should be) such a mystery. Here is
an excerpt from a report I get daily from my company Web server logs:

Number of clients with .NET Framework installed at our client base
24hrs ending 04/08 3am: <absolute numbers omitted> unique IPs: 41.9%
Note: this is a count of only those with 200 server status to our site

It's actually based on the number of IE browsers sending ".NET CLR" as part of the User-Agent header. Not 100% representative or accurate, but pretty
close I think.

[truetype]

Thanks a lot. This was very helpful.

-=truetype=-

[Cor Ligthert]

Private,

Thanks for this good information,

Cor

http://blogs.msdn.com/scottwil/archi...09/391199.aspx

[Arthur M.]

Heh, here is a solution - track web browser statistical web sites - .net adds
".net" string to web browser's HTTP_AGENT string :)

"Cor Ligthert" wrote:

Hi TrueType,

You make me curious more than 100 kilometers west from Asia?

:-)

In my opinion there are not even *good* statics about what OS user computers
have.

How do you want to measure that. So asking how many have installed the as
freeware installable Net framework is for me the same as asking how many
small fishes are there in the Balticsea..

Some links to try your next question.

Redistrubutable Net 1.1
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
Net 1.1 sp1
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en
I hope this helps,

Cor