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Please help to limit number of selections in multiple select list box

P: n/a
Hi,

I'd like to limit the number of selections a user can make in a
multiple select listbox. I have a note on the interface to say that
only x no. of items should be selected and I check the number server
side but I'd like to implement some javascript to do the same on the
client side. Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and
Netscape6+.

Thanks,

Paul
Jul 20 '05 #1
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29 Replies


P: n/a
On 22 Jan 2004 09:39:20 -0800, Paul <pa********@hotmail.com> wrote:
I'd like to limit the number of selections a user can make in a
multiple select listbox. I have a note on the interface to say that
only x no. of items should be selected and I check the number server
side but I'd like to implement some javascript to do the same on the
client side.
You'll need to provide some more information, namely, what should happen
when a user selects a extra option? Should the user simply be alerted?
Should some form of intelligent algorithm be applied to keep the number of
selections within the prescribed limits?
Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.


Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.

Mike

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #2

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.


Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.


Don't forget Safari. :)
I hear it's getting very popular with Mac users...

I myself use Mozilla or Netscape 7, depending on which computer I'm on.

/glad I code for intranet apps these days

--
--
~kaeli~
A midget fortune teller who escapes from prison is a small
medium at large.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #3

P: n/a
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 12:24:40 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
> Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.
Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.


Don't forget Safari. :)


I didn't. :P

"...every other one in use, too."
I hear it's getting very popular with Mac users...
Really? Wonder why...
I myself use Mozilla or Netscape 7, depending on which computer I'm on.


I personally can't stand the interface. There's something about it that
just seems ugly to me. Other than that, their fine applications.

Mike

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #4

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 12:24:40 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...

> Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.

Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.
Don't forget Safari. :)


I didn't. :P


Oh, I know, I was referring to the OP.

Sorry.
I myself use Mozilla or Netscape 7, depending on which computer I'm on.


I personally can't stand the interface. There's something about it that
just seems ugly to me. Other than that, their fine applications.


Oh, they ARE ugly.
I use themes, specifically a really pretty blue one called Sky Pilot
Classic. :)
I tried Opera a while back and tons of sites didn't work with it (it had
crappy CSS and DHTML support), but I loved the tabbed browsing and lack
of popups. So, I got into Mozilla and liked it a lot. I haven't tried
Opera again, but I think it's gotten way better since I last tried it,
around V5.
At work, only IE and NN are available. So, I use NN7 here.

--
--
~kaeli~
A man needs a mistress... just to break the monogamy.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #5

P: n/a
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 13:46:28 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
I personally can't stand the interface. There's something about it that
just seems ugly to me. Other than that, their fine applications.
^^^^^
D'oh. That, of course, should have been "they're".
Oh, they ARE ugly.
I use themes, specifically a really pretty blue one called Sky Pilot
Classic. :)
Glad I'm not the only one with that opinion. I'll be giving Mozilla
another go once I re-install Linux. I didn't know you could skin it
(didn't keep it around long enough to find out).
I tried Opera a while back and tons of sites didn't work with it (it had
crappy CSS and DHTML support), but I loved the tabbed browsing and lack
of popups. So, I got into Mozilla and liked it a lot. I haven't tried
Opera again, but I think it's gotten way better since I last tried it,
around V5.


Opera's support for virtually everything is pretty good now. There are
some sites that break with it though, but that's more than likely the
short-sightedness of the web developer, not the browser[1].

There are some things that need improving, such as XHTML support (scripts
don't work in XHTML mode), but the list of items not implemented is quite
small[2]. Certainly, everything in common use has been supported. If you
want to take a look at the list, the address is
http://www.opera.com/docs/specs/

Mike
[1] I usually have problems with these same sites using IE 5.5, so draw
your own conclusions.
[2] OK, it's not exactly 'small', but the bits missing are rather
insignificant.

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #6

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
Oh, they ARE ugly.
I use themes, specifically a really pretty blue one called Sky Pilot
Classic. :)
Glad I'm not the only one with that opinion. I'll be giving Mozilla
another go once I re-install Linux. I didn't know you could skin it
(didn't keep it around long enough to find out).


Well, there's not a whole hell of a lot out there, but there's a decent
number over at the Mozilla site.

Note for any NN users reading this - I just got NN7. I tried to skin it
with the stuff from NN's site and got errors because all their links
still point to NN6 and NN7 won't use the themes from NN6. Go over to
Mozilla's theme site instead of Netscape's theme park and you won't have
that problem.
http://themes.mozdev.org/

Opera's support for virtually everything is pretty good now. There are
some sites that break with it though, but that's more than likely the
short-sightedness of the web developer, not the browser[1].


Good to know.
My main problem with it was a lack of .style support even though it
supported getElementById. Almost no one checks for .style - they assume
if a browser supports getElementById, it supports both. Also, there are
way too many sites that still use browser detection instead of object
detection, so they try to do IE-only things with Opera if I have it set
to spoof IE, but do nothing if I leave it as Opera.
Do you have that problem with the new version?

--
--
~kaeli~
With her marriage, she got a new name and a dress.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #7

P: n/a
"Michael Winter" <M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid> wrote in message
news:op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk...
<snip>
... (scripts don't work in XHTML mode), ...

<snip>

That isn't strictly true. Opera 7 doesn't recognise script elements but
it does recognise and execute intrinsic events. With a bit of work you
can get quite a lot of code into an event handling attribute string (I
think it is something like 64Kb).

Combining the code in the onclick attributes of 4 <input type="button">
elements (which I had to click in the correct order to properly
initialise the script) I was able to get one of my DOM scanning scripts
running on an XHTML page[1] in Opera 7, allowing me to verify that they
have implemented more of the HTML DOM in their XHTML DOM implementation
than Mozilla has.

Richard.

[1] A valid XHTML page served as application/xhtml+xml rather than
text/html (which results in a normal HTML DOM).
Jul 20 '05 #8

P: n/a
kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> writes:

{Opera support of stuff]
My main problem with it was a lack of .style support even though it
supported getElementById. Almost no one checks for .style - they assume
if a browser supports getElementById, it supports both.
What version of Opera was that? Or are you referring to Opera 6's limited
DHTML capability (can't change display property etc.)? Because I can see
style properties back to Opera 4 at least (document.body.style exists).

Opera 7's CSS 2 support is almost perfect (on the same level as
Mozilla's - only minor details are not absolutely correct).
Also, there are way too many sites that still use browser detection
instead of object detection, so they try to do IE-only things with
Opera if I have it set to spoof IE, but do nothing if I leave it as
Opera. Do you have that problem with the new version?


They are rare, and usually say something like "We only support IE v4
and Netscape v4 or better, click here to upgrade your browser" (which
I mentally translate to "I am a clueless moron, please kick me").
That is, they are easily identifiable.

/L
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lr*@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleDOM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'
Jul 20 '05 #9

P: n/a
On Thu, 22 Jan 2004 14:21:43 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...

Opera's support for virtually everything is pretty good now. There are
some sites that break with it though, but that's more than likely the
short-sightedness of the web developer, not the browser[1].


Good to know.
My main problem with it was a lack of .style support even though it
supported getElementById. Almost no one checks for .style - they assume
if a browser supports getElementById, it supports both. Also, there are
way too many sites that still use browser detection instead of object
detection, so they try to do IE-only things with Opera if I have it set
to spoof IE, but do nothing if I leave it as Opera.
Do you have that problem with the new version?


I never spoof as IE and I've only had two sites that flat-out refuse to
work:

1) Mr. Morgenstern's ISKEET site (posted to this group - now been fixed)
2) A site recommended by Netscape for DOM tutorials,
http://www.getelementbyid.com/ [1]

As for .style, Opera seems to support it quite nicely. Of course, if it
didn't, I'm not likely to notice but a few sites have performed dynamic
background colour changes on mouse movement, and the like.

Mike
[1] Obviously, if a site states, "Sorry, this site is optimized for
Internet Explorer 5 and Netscape 6!!!" and it is supposed to teach how to
script sites, it's not very good, and not worth my time. We'll see what
Netscape thinks of such a practice: I asked them to remove the site from
their list.

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #10

P: n/a
Hi Mike,

Thanks for the response. All I'm looking for is a simple alert when
the form is submitted.

Thanks,

Paul

Michael Winter <M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid> wrote in message news:<op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>...
On 22 Jan 2004 09:39:20 -0800, Paul <pa********@hotmail.com> wrote:
I'd like to limit the number of selections a user can make in a
multiple select listbox. I have a note on the interface to say that
only x no. of items should be selected and I check the number server
side but I'd like to implement some javascript to do the same on the
client side.


You'll need to provide some more information, namely, what should happen
when a user selects a extra option? Should the user simply be alerted?
Should some form of intelligent algorithm be applied to keep the number of
selections within the prescribed limits?
Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.


Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.

Mike

Jul 20 '05 #11

P: n/a
kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message news:<MP************************@nntp.lucent.com>. ..
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
Ideally I'd like the javascript to work in IE5+ and Netscape6+.


Unless this is an Intranet application, I would hope you want it to work
on my browser (Opera) and every other one in use, too. Move beyond the
outdated 'two browser' world.


Don't forget Safari. :)
I hear it's getting very popular with Mac users...

I myself use Mozilla or Netscape 7, depending on which computer I'm on.

/glad I code for intranet apps these days

--

Hi
U can do it by calling a javascript function on client side also
u just use this javascript function. call "limitOptions" function
"onchange" event of the list box. like this
onChange="javascript:limitOptions(this,5)". here 5 is the max number
of selection u want to allow
all the best

function limitOptions(oSel, howmany)
{
var opt, i = 0, msg = '', thismany = howmany, toomany = new Array();
while (opt = oSel.options[i++])
{
if (opt.selected) --howmany;
{
if (howmany < 0)
{
toomany[toomany.length] = opt;
}
}
}
if (howmany < 0)
{
msg += 'The maximum number of selections allowed in this list is ' +
thismany + '.';
msg += '\n\nPlease observe this limit.\n\n';
alert(msg);
i = 0;
while (opt = toomany[i++]) opt.selected = false;
return false;
}
}
Padam
Jul 20 '05 #12

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...

As for .style, Opera seems to support it quite nicely. Of course, if it
didn't, I'm not likely to notice but a few sites have performed dynamic
background colour changes on mouse movement, and the like.

It didn't when I tried it. Maybe I need to check it out again...
I'm curious if my work apps would function in it now. heh

[1] Obviously, if a site states, "Sorry, this site is optimized for
Internet Explorer 5 and Netscape 6!!!" and it is supposed to teach how to
script sites, it's not very good, and not worth my time. We'll see what
Netscape thinks of such a practice: I asked them to remove the site from
their list.


Well, I get your point, but there are some things that just can't be
done in some browsers. I don't do those things for my internet stuff,
but I do for my intranet apps. So, to me, scripts that only work in IE5
+/NN7+ are just fine (and sometimes great) for some of my applications.
I know the banking site I use requires IE5+ to work well. I've used it
with Mozilla and it does fine, but I know it would crash the old Opera.
The thing is, most bank customers use IE and they want all this dynamic
stuff, so the bank tries to comply and they end up breaking the site for
other browsers.

In a perfect world, all the browsers would have a real standard that
they all supported so we didn't drive ourselves crazy trying to code for
them. I know we're getting there, but you can't ask that all sites still
support archaic browsers, like NN4 and Opera 5, when the majority of the
customers want the bells and whistles available in the newer browsers.
Sure, anyone can learn to not *crash* old browsers by using object
detection, but some things simply can't be done in them (one of my DB
apps at work can't be done in NN4 for example, as the browser crashed
repeatedly with the large amount of buffering that was required for
large queries).
/MHO only YMMV
--
--
~kaeli~
When you choke a smurf, what color does it turn?
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #13

P: n/a
In article <65**********@hotpop.com>, lr*@hotpop.com enlightened us
with...

What version of Opera was that? Or are you referring to Opera 6's limited
DHTML capability (can't change display property etc.)? Because I can see
style properties back to Opera 4 at least (document.body.style exists).

The former, and it was O5.
A simple color change with .style failed in it.
Opera 7's CSS 2 support is almost perfect (on the same level as
Mozilla's - only minor details are not absolutely correct).


Neat. After the comments here, I think I need to look at it again.
Also, there are way too many sites that still use browser detection
instead of object detection, so they try to do IE-only things with
Opera if I have it set to spoof IE, but do nothing if I leave it as
Opera. Do you have that problem with the new version?


They are rare, and usually say something like "We only support IE v4
and Netscape v4 or better, click here to upgrade your browser" (which
I mentally translate to "I am a clueless moron, please kick me").


ROFL!!!
I still see quite a few of those kinds of posts here, though, and even
still see it in a few tutorial sites (probably not updated in ages, but
how's a newbie to know that?).
--
--
~kaeli~
If a book about failures doesn't sell, is it a success?
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #14

P: n/a
On 23 Jan 2004 01:46:35 -0800, Paul <pa********@hotmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for the response. All I'm looking for is a simple alert when
the form is submitted.


This function will check that the given SELECT element contains fewer than
'maximum' selected options.

function checkLimits( list, maximum ) {
var options = list.options;
var size = options.length;
var numSelected = 0;

for( var i = 0; i < size; ++i ) {
if( options[ i ].selected ) ++numSelected;
}
if( numSelected > maximum ) {
alert( 'You have selected more than ' + maximum + ' options.\n' +
'Please deselect ' + ( numSelected - maximum ) + ' option(s) then
try again.' );
return false;
}
return true;
}

To call it directly from a form's onsubmit event, you could do:

<select ... onsubmit="return checkLimits(this.listName, 2)">

Mike

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #15

P: n/a
"kaeli" <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:MP************************@nntp.lucent.com...
What version of Opera was that? ...
<snip>
The former, and it was O5.
A simple color change with .style failed in it.

<snip>

Opera 5 did (does?) have a style object, it only had about 20 properties
(and those included the non-standard IE pixelTop/Left/Width/Height) so
there was never much you could do even when the browser allowed it. But
as I recall, for example, setting style.background to a color did change
the background color of elements while setting style.backgroundColor did
not.

Richard.
Jul 20 '05 #16

P: n/a
"kaeli" <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:MP************************@nntp.lucent.com...
<snip>
... , most bank customers use IE and they want all this dynamic
stuff, so the bank tries to comply and they end up breaking the
site for other browsers.

<snip>

Do the customers really want all this dynamic stuff? I would have
thought that from the customer's point of view a safe, secure, reliable
system that allowed them to transact the business that need to transact
as quickly and easily as possible is the requirement. And that is easily
done cross-browser (and without JavaScript).

The client-side dynamic stuff can be layered on top, as an optional
extra, as there is no need for it and probably little real demand. Who
goes to their back when they are looking for entertainment, or would
trust that bank with their money if they fond it upon arrival?

Richard.
Jul 20 '05 #17

P: n/a
In article <bu*******************@news.demon.co.uk>,
Ri*****@litotes.demon.co.uk enlightened us with...
"kaeli" <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:MP************************@nntp.lucent.com...
<snip>
... , most bank customers use IE and they want all this dynamic
stuff, so the bank tries to comply and they end up breaking the
site for other browsers.

<snip>

Do the customers really want all this dynamic stuff?


I would assume so, since the notice when they upgraded stated so and
apologized for any inconvenience.
*shrugs*

I personally think the changes were great, but I use NN7 or Mozilla 1.4
or IE6, so I don't have too many problems with most sites. I suspect if
I was a Mac user with Safari, I might be a bit more disappointed (I'm
not sure how that browser stacks up). I do know they do a lot of
createElement type stuff that wouldn't work on old browsers and it
wouldn't work (at least nearly as well) without javascript.
I love it, though. I think the site is MUCH easier to navigate and more
pleasant to use now.

A small example from my own (intranet) experience - a form to ask for
help. The form is created on the fly, with elements created based on
previous choices. This saves my users a lot of typing and saves me
having to ask them narrowing-down questions in mail replies or having
the application submit to page after page depending on answers. I never
did get it to work nicely in NN4 (tried document.write to layers, but it
sure wasn't pretty). When we upgraded to NN6 here, I could do a lot more
with my stuff and my users unilaterally loved it all. Another small
example would be the ability to sort tables client-side. That was
something I couldn't do until now, either. It used to be done with
another request to the server. My users ADORE this addition.

--
--
~kaeli~
Those who get too big for their britches will be exposed in
the end.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #18

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...

I never spoof as IE and I've only had two sites that flat-out refuse to
work:


[opera]

Here's another one.
The DHTML menu I use.
I have no idea what it doesn't like, but it obviously has something to
do with one of the changes I put in to make it work in NN7.0, since the
original works fine.

Is there a debugger for it, like "javascript:" in NN?
--
--
~kaeli~
Hey, if you got it flaunt it! If you don't stare at someone
who does. Just don't lick the TV screen, it leaves streaks.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #19

P: n/a
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 11:59:51 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
Here's another one.
The DHTML menu I use.
I have no idea what it doesn't like, but it obviously has something to
do with one of the changes I put in to make it work in NN7.0, since the
original works fine.

Is there a debugger for it [Opera], like "javascript:" in NN?


The built-in JavaScript console can trace errors, identifing where the
error originated (an onclick event, for example) and traverse up through
the call stack to the statement that contains the error. It will describe
the error, and show exceptions, too.

If it doesn't pop up automatically[1], you can open it from Window >
Special > JavaScript console.

Be aware that the 'Clear' button only temporarily clears the window. If
you close the console and re-open it, all previous errors will appear.
Only closing the browser will permanently remove all entries. If you
intend to use it to debug, open the console, clear it, then test. Also
notice that it appears on the Taskbar, not as a tab.

Mike
[1] Set by File > Preferences > Multimedia > JavaScript options > Open
JavaScript console on error

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #20

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...

Is there a debugger for it [Opera], like "javascript:" in NN?


The built-in JavaScript console can trace errors, identifing where the
error originated (an onclick event, for example) and traverse up through
the call stack to the statement that contains the error. It will describe
the error, and show exceptions, too.

If it doesn't pop up automatically[1], you can open it from Window >
Special > JavaScript console.


I found a neat thing: opera.postError("string");
Very cool.

However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
I looked in the preferences, but found only the way to keep scripts from
playing with it.

The error was that I was using an old version of the menu script from
2001 that intentionally left out Opera. I forgot about that. Bad me. It
works now.

Thanks!

--
--
~kaeli~
Support your local medical examiner: die strangely!
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #21

P: n/a
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 12:47:12 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
I found a neat thing: opera.postError("string");
Very cool.
Didn't know about that, and you're right: it is funky. :D
However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
I looked in the preferences, but found only the way to keep scripts from
playing with it.


Look at the submenus in the first separator group of the View menu. You
can set all of the ***bar preferences there, including the status bar.

Mike

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #22

P: n/a
kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> writes:
I found a neat thing: opera.postError("string");
Neat. Didn't know that.
However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
Design :)
I looked in the preferences, but found only the way to keep scripts from
playing with it.
The progress bar is only shown while there is progress to show.
However, if you want to see the information from it, you can put its
fields into another, permanent, toolbar.

Right click on a tool bar and select "Customize toolbars". In the
"Fields" pane, you can find "Images", "Total", "Speed", "Elapsed" and
"Progress status". You can drag these onto, e.g., the status bar.

That is for Opera 7.23. In the next version (currently only a technology
preview has been released, and it is not to be considered bug free) the
interface will be even more customizable. I didn't think it possible :)
The error was that I was using an old version of the menu script from
2001 that intentionally left out Opera.


A lesson in leaving out browsers: Only ever leave out the versions that
exist now, and that you have tested and knows won't work. Don't leave
out the entire family, and let them be damned to seven generations for
the sins of the father.

/L
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lr*@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleDOM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'
Jul 20 '05 #23

P: n/a
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 19:11:26 GMT, Michael Winter
<M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 12:47:12 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
I looked in the preferences, but found only the way to keep scripts from
playing with it.


Look at the submenus in the first separator group of the View menu. You
can set all of the ***bar preferences there, including the status bar.


Forgot to mention: what you are actually referring to is not the status
bar, it's the progress bar. They are two separate things. However, I think
the status bar is disabled by default, so you'll still have to check its
setting.

Mike

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #24

P: n/a
In article <op**************@news-text.blueyonder.co.uk>,
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid enlightened us with...
However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
I looked in the preferences, but found only the way to keep scripts from
playing with it.


Look at the submenus in the first separator group of the View menu. You
can set all of the ***bar preferences there, including the status bar.


Forgot to mention: what you are actually referring to is not the status
bar, it's the progress bar. They are two separate things. However, I think
the status bar is disabled by default, so you'll still have to check its
setting.


Oh, well, I meant the status bar. :)
Like, when I put my mouse over links, I really want to see where it's
going.

I think I just found a new favorite browser. Lookit all the skins!!
*heh*
And I didn't have to set up all the mime types and plugins like I did
for Mozilla (which I still can't get to download some stuff). Yay.

One more thing - even though I set the cache to everything I could think
of, including off, it still caches my .js files, so when I'm changing
them around, it doesn't reload the new version right away (I had to load
up the .js separate, then hit control+reload). This is only problematic
when I'm testing stuff, so it's no huge deal (my stuff isn't even
required to work with it, but hey), but do you know why? Figured I'd
ask, JIC.
I have this problem on and off with NN7 with external pages because of
our proxy server's cache, but this is an internal site, so that's not
the issue (no proxy for internal sites)...

I know what I'm downloading when I get home.

--
--
~kaeli~
A chicken crossing the road is poultry in motion.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #25

P: n/a
On Fri, 23 Jan 2004 13:52:17 -0600, kaeli <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net>
wrote:
Oh, well, I meant the status bar. :)
Like, when I put my mouse over links, I really want to see where it's
going.
You can also hover and get a tool-tip with the information (which can't be
faked).
I think I just found a new favorite browser. Lookit all the skins!!
*heh*
Just a couple, eh?
And I didn't have to set up all the mime types and plugins like I did
for Mozilla (which I still can't get to download some stuff). Yay.
You'll probably want to change the source viewer, though (Preferences >
Programs and paths). I think it defaults to Window's Write.
One more thing - even though I set the cache to everything I could think
of, including off, it still caches my .js files, so when I'm changing
them around, it doesn't reload the new version right away (I had to load
up the .js separate, then hit control+reload). This is only problematic
when I'm testing stuff, so it's no huge deal (my stuff isn't even
required to work with it, but hey), but do you know why? Figured I'd
ask, JIC.
I have this problem on and off with NN7 with external pages because of
our proxy server's cache, but this is an internal site, so that's not
the issue (no proxy for internal sites)...
Can't say that I've had any trouble with caching. You might try changing
the checking frequency to 'Always'. The (unfortunately outdated)
documentation does state that even with caching disabled, it may still
store files temporarily.

If it is an issue, you could raise it on the Opera newsgroups. Opera
Software have their own news server at news.opera.com.

By the way, Ctrl+F5 doesn't force a refresh, just pressing F5 or Ctrl+R
will do that. Ctrl+F5 reloads all open pages[1].
I know what I'm downloading when I get home.


Enjoy your new browser. :)

Mike
[1] These are the default keys. All keystrokes can be redefined.

--
Michael Winter
M.******@blueyonder.co.invalid (replace ".invalid" with ".uk" to reply)
Jul 20 '05 #26

P: n/a
In article <y8**********@hotpop.com>, lr*@hotpop.com enlightened us
with...
However, I miss my status bar. Why does it go away after the page loads?
Design :)


I found it. :)
In the View menu.
The error was that I was using an old version of the menu script from
2001 that intentionally left out Opera.


A lesson in leaving out browsers: Only ever leave out the versions that
exist now, and that you have tested and knows won't work. Don't leave
out the entire family, and let them be damned to seven generations for
the sins of the father.


I don't - it was a downloaded script from a free script site.
I do object detection. However, I do remember than in O5 (the version
that was out when I downloaded the script in 2001, IIRC), testing for
..style came back true, but trying to set .style.backgroundColor failed.
I have never heard of that issue in other browsers except that one and I
think some bugs in Mac IE.

--
--
~kaeli~
He had a photographic memory that was never developed.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace

Jul 20 '05 #27

P: n/a
"kaeli" <ti******@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:MP************************@nntp.lucent.com...
<snip>
Do the customers really want all this dynamic stuff?
I would assume so, since the notice when they upgraded
stated so and apologized for any inconvenience.
*shrugs*


That sounds like the bank telling the customers what they want. It
doesn't necessarily mean that the customers do want it, and they are
still unlikely to change banks if it was not there so long as they can
successfully do their banking business. While a requirement that they
wait half an hour to download the latest version of some browsers prior
to doing what they had previously been able to do instantly may
encourage people to change banks (assuming the market include at least
one that has employed developers who know how to implement the bells and
whistles as optional extras)

The benefit for the bank of online banking seems to be that it enables
them to do an increasing proportion of their business in a way that does
not require that they employ large numbers of people to sit behind desks
in branches handling transactions in person. To that end maximising the
potential user base for their online services would seem like the best
approach to maximising their return.

<snip>A small example from my own (intranet) experience - a form
to ask for help. The form is created on the fly, with elements
created based on previous choices. ...

<snip>

The users like it because it works. But it only works because you know
enough about the Intranet users, there set-ups and browsers to know that
what needs to be done to ensure that it works.

On the Internet things will never be that simple. I particularly like
the way that MSDN is authored so that when I visit it with IE it assumes
that it can run ActiveX, but it can't because I don't allow scripting of
ActiveX over the internet (by anyone). It demonstrates that even
Microsoft cannot cope with the configurability of their own browser and
makes the site more usable with Mozilla (where at least they recognise
that they cannot expect to be able to run ActiveX).

In all cases, if the developers understood their jobs they could provide
a functional base of HTML and server-side scripts that would work for
everyone and still have the DHTML enhancements for those that could take
advantage of them (even when that would require a default configuration
of the latest versions of maybe two browsers).

Richard.
Jul 20 '05 #28

P: n/a
Thanks Padam
Jul 20 '05 #29

P: n/a
Thanks Mike
Jul 20 '05 #30

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