How to debug Javascript in IE (inside JSP files)

[Jeff Papineau]

http://www.mandala.com/javascript/debug_javascript.html

I've written up a page explaining how to use the MS Script Editor for
Javascript debugging in IE. It's a great debugging environment and has
allowed my group to do much more with Javascript in IE with JSP files
than we would have attempted without it.

Please pass this around, as I think JSP developers especially need
this tool if they are using IE for development with complex
Javascript.

Cheers,
Jeff Papineau
San Jose, CA

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Jeff Papineau wrote:

[url]
I've written up a page explaining how to use the MS Script Editor for
Javascript debugging in IE. It's a great debugging environment and has
allowed my group to do much more with Javascript in IE with JSP files
than we would have attempted without it.

Please pass this around, as I think JSP developers especially need
this tool if they are using IE for development with complex
Javascript.

Why should anyone trust you as a reliable source of information about a
script editor (you mean the -- compared to Venkman -- rather bad script
*debugger* which can be downloaded for free from the MSDN website
without having to pay for and to install OfficeXP, do you not?)? You
are not even able to tell JavaScript from Java(Server Pages; you
possibly meant M$ Active Server Pages [ASP] where JScript can be used
as script language) nor do you know that IE interprets client-side
JScript (M$'s ECMAScript implementation), not JavaScript (for the most
part Netscape's ECMAScript implementation).

M$ must be very frightened if start employing people for spamming public
newsgroups in order to promote OfficeXP. That is what one could think
as the home page of the Web site referred to is 404 compatible.
PointedEars

[Guru Singh]

You Sir, Are a Moron...

but thanks for pointing out the problem with the home page; we got that
back up in a jiffy; looks like some files got deleted; not that it
matters; we don't use the home page, the site is entirely behind
firewalls.

NO, it's NOT THE MS SCRIPT DEBUGGER, which if you had taken any length
of time to read the link posted, would have been very obvious to you.
No, the MS SCRIPT DEBUGGER is a giant piece of kaka, but the MS script
editor (part of Office 2000 and XP) is another thing altogther! Use this
link to see a screen shot of it.

http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_J...R_DEBUGGER.JPG

Furthermore, don't take my word for it, try it yourself. I have 10 years
of industry experience in Javascript (what you refere to as Jscript is
just a flavor of what we all recognize as ECMA script which is also
called Javascript).
And of course, if you READ, you might find that you don't actually have
to have Office installed, just get the script editor files one way or
another, ahem..

AND NO, I MEAN JSP you Freeking Moron. JSP, being a very fancy version
of Java servlets; being much nicer to program using Tomcat, JBoss and
Apache. JSP developers need support on IE, as we are all usually
required to support it, and MS does everything they can to push their
sorry a## ASP.

The entire reason I posted, is because if you are developing vertical
intranet oriented applications, usually far more sophisticated than
anything you will encounter outside of a firewall, using JSP (NO NOT
ASP) then you will find your life is hell on IE unless you have a fully
featured JS debugger. Fully featured as in:

Step In
Step Out
Step Over
Expression Watch
Expression Evaluate
DOM Object Heirarchy Inspector

Yes, using this tool, you can walk thru the DOM heirarchy tree and
inspect each object in the DOM for ID, Name, Tag Type, FirstChild,
Parent, etc.

Venkman does not help me in this case. I use JScript extentions because
the browser supports them quite nicely, thank you very much. But it's
still Javascript dude, as in:
script language=javascript, right?

Please take your pointed ears somewhere else, since we are all full up
of BS around here...

G'day Mate,

Guru


*** Sent via Devdex http://www.devdex.com ***
Don't just participate in USENET...get rewarded for it!

[Lasse Reichstein Nielsen]

Guru Singh <yo**@mandala.com> writes:

While I agree with everything else you say, I just *had* to nitpick on
this:

But it's still Javascript dude, as in:
script language=javascript, right?

Bad example :) It's Javascript as in
<script type="text/javascript">
(type attribute is required in HTML 4 and always sufficient).

/L :P
--
Lasse Reichstein Nielsen - lr*@hotpop.com
DHTML Death Colors: <URL:http://www.infimum.dk/HTML/rasterTriangleDOM.html>
'Faith without judgement merely degrades the spirit divine.'

[Matt Kruse]

Guru Singh wrote:

Use this link to see a screen shot of it.
http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_J...R_DEBUGGER.JPG

I don't know whose code is being debugged in that screenshot, but I wouldn't
use it as an example. The code is horribly written, from what we can see of
it :)

--
Matt Kruse
Javascript Toolbox: http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Guru Singh wrote:

[...]
http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_J...R_DEBUGGER.JPG

Your wording aside, what has this to do with JSP? As you well know,
JSP is a server-side technique. The client gets only the HTML and
JScript generated from it, and does not know about the server-side
source code, so the server-side technique used should not matter
and *any* good debugger that supports client-side JScript (and IE
integration) should suffice.

BTW: If find it interesting that you have changed your name and
stopped crossposting to the Java group for this particular posting.
Maybe you can explain that.
PointedEars

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Guru Singh wrote:

NO, it's NOT THE MS SCRIPT DEBUGGER, [...] Use this
link to see a screen shot of it.

http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_J...R_DEBUGGER.JPG
I do hope for you that you have not written the code which screenshot
you present here. The author of it should be considered incompetent
at best. For example eval() is evil as the bracket property accessor
exist and suffices.
Furthermore, don't take my word for it, try it yourself. I have 10 years
of industry experience in Javascript
I doubt that very much because of your next statement, too:
(what you refere to as Jscript is just a flavor of what we all recognize
as ECMA script which is also called Javascript).
You clearly do not know what you are talking about. Java != JavaScript.
JavaScript != ECMAScript. JScript != ECMAScript and, of course,
JavaScript != JScript. JavaScript is (for the most part) Netscape's
implementation of ECMAScript, JScript is Microsoft's implementation of
ECMAScript (as you can read in the FAQ of this newsgroup). Neither one
is a "flavor" of anything at all.
And of course, if you READ, [...]
I think I have read what you posted and what you have written on the Web
site thoroughly enough to say that you are mixing up a few things here,
at best.
AND NO, I MEAN JSP [...] JSP, being a very fancy version
of Java servlets; being much nicer to program using Tomcat, JBoss and
Apache. JSP developers need support on IE, as we are all usually
required to support it, and MS does everything they can to push their
sorry a## ASP.

The entire reason I posted, is because if you are developing vertical
intranet oriented applications, usually far more sophisticated than
anything you will encounter outside of a firewall, using JSP (NO NOT
ASP) then you will find your life is hell on IE unless you have a fully
featured JS debugger.
Your wording aside, what has this to do with JSP? As you well know,
JSP is a server-side technique. The client gets only the HTML and
JScript generated from it, and does not know about the server-side
source code, so the server-side technique used should not matter
and *any* good debugger that supports client-side JScript (and IE
integration) should suffice.

BTW: If find it interesting that you have not only changed your name
and stopped crossposting to the Java group for this particular posting
but changed from Google Groups (which take Netiquette violations quite
seriously) to the more loose devdex.com Web forums. Maybe you can
explain that, too.
Yes, using this tool, you can walk thru the DOM heirarchy tree and
inspect each object in the DOM for ID, Name, Tag Type, FirstChild,
Parent, etc.
Fine.
Venkman does not help me in this case. I use JScript extentions because
the browser supports them quite nicely, thank you very much. But it's
still Javascript dude, as in:
script language=javascript, right?

Wrong. It's type="text/javascript" and should be type="text/jscript",
since what IE understands is a different script language.
PointedEars

[Ivan Marsh]

On Fri, 02 Jul 2004 17:40:01 +0200, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:

Guru Singh wrote:

Furthermore, don't take my word for it, try it yourself. I have 10
years of industry experience in Javascript

Not possible unless you worked for Netscape and worked with LiveScript.

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/java...s_history.html

I doubt that very much because of your next statement, too:

(what you refere to as Jscript is just a flavor of what we all
recognize as ECMA script which is also called Javascript).

You clearly do not know what you are talking about. Java != JavaScript.
JavaScript != ECMAScript. JScript != ECMAScript and, of course,
JavaScript != JScript. JavaScript is (for the most part) Netscape's
implementation of ECMAScript, JScript is Microsoft's implementation of
ECMAScript (as you can read in the FAQ of this newsgroup). Neither one
is a "flavor" of anything at all.

ECMAScript is an attempt at standardizing JavaScript.

--
i.m.
The USA Patriot Act is the most unpatriotic act in American history.

[Light My A$$ On Fire]

What a bunch of dorks...

*** Sent via Devdex http://www.devdex.com ***
Don't just participate in USENET...get rewarded for it!

[Richard Cornford]

Matt Kruse wrote:

Guru Singh wrote:

Use this link to see a screen shot of it.
http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_J...R_DEBUGGER.JPG

I don't know whose code is being debugged in that screenshot, but I
wouldn't use it as an example. The code is horribly written, from
what we can see of it :)

Yes. The only completely visible function is:-

<quote cite="http://www.mandala.com/debugger/MS_JS_EDITOR_DEBUGGER.JPG">

function ButtonOut(sBtnName) {
// Called By OnMouseOut
var oButton; // Reference to button
// Tired of different object models yet?
if (navigator.userAgent.indexOf("IE") == "-1") {
oButton = eval('document.' + sBtnName + '.document.' + sBtnName + 'Btn');
} else {
oButton = eval(sBtnName + 'Btn');
}
oButton.src = sPrevButtonImg; //Restore the image Path we saved in onMouseOver
bPrevImageSet = false; //Restore permission to set onMouseOver image
}

</quote>

- (The two partly obscured functions are very similar to this one to the
extent that they are visible.)

Which makes me wonder how many clueless actions could be accommodated in
just 8 lines of code. I particularly enjoyed the comparison of the value
returned from - indexOf - with the string "-1".

It seems that the quest for a good debugger might not have been so
necessary if it had been preceded by a quest for someone who knew
how to code javascript.

Richard.

[Light My A$$ On Fire]

Save your breath, it's a MS example file of how to add GUI to Windows
Media Player embedded in a page. Take it up with them...

On another note, how does it feel to know you will never reproduce or
kiss a real girl?

*** Sent via Devdex http://www.devdex.com ***
Don't just participate in USENET...get rewarded for it!

[Richard Cornford]

Light My A$$ On Fire wrote:

Save your breath, it's a MS example file of how to add GUI to
Windows Media Player embedded in a page. Take it up with them...
Assuming that it true (and if there is one common theme in Microsoft
example scripts it is that they don't even attempt to be cross-browser)
you still chose that script. You couldn't find one example from your own
work that was better? I may not have "10 years of industry experience in
Javascript" but at least I know when a script is so bad that deleting it
is the only sensible thing to do with it.
On another note, how does it feel to know you will never
reproduce or kiss a real girl?

Well at least you were eventually so embarrassed by that script that you
realised that personal abuse was your only possible come-back.

Richard.

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Ivan Marsh wrote:

On Fri, 02 Jul 2004 17:40:01 +0200, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:

Guru Singh wrote:

Furthermore, don't take my word for it, try it yourself. I have 10
years of industry experience in Javascript
Not possible unless you worked for Netscape and worked with LiveScript.

http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/java...s_history.html

*g* Thanks for pointing this out.
[...]

(what you refere to as Jscript is just a flavor of what we all
recognize as ECMA script which is also called Javascript).

You clearly do not know what you are talking about. Java != JavaScript.
JavaScript != ECMAScript. JScript != ECMAScript and, of course,
JavaScript != JScript. JavaScript is (for the most part) Netscape's
implementation of ECMAScript, JScript is Microsoft's implementation of
ECMAScript (as you can read in the FAQ of this newsgroup). Neither one
is a "flavor" of anything at all.

ECMAScript is an attempt at standardizing JavaScript.

That was true, in the old days, before Microsoft discovered the Web.
Now ECMAScript is rather considered a language standard used to
implement scripting languages, namely JavaScript and JScript. Since
the Netscape browser division has been closed by AOHell/TW (and,
consequently, Netscape is no longer a member of ECMA) and mozilla.org
took over, it seems that they are developing both languages. However,
it is to be doubted if ECMA will standardize a version of the language
not coming from one of its members.
PointedEars

[Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn]

Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:

[...] Since the Netscape browser division has been closed by
AOHell/TW (and, consequently, Netscape is no longer a member of ECMA)
and mozilla.org took over, it seems that they are developing both
languages.

JavaScript and _ECMAScript_ are meant, of course. But waldemar seems
not to have worked on JavaScript 2.0 for a year and two days now [1]
(which was exactly about the time the Netscape browser division was
[temporarily] closed and all developers fired), I wonder if it will be
ever attempted to standardize it. Hopefully, work will continue with
new Netscape developers and hopefully, Netscape will rejoin ECMA[2]...

Hah! Having a look at their Web site[3], I found out that mozilla.org
has joined ECMA as NFP member three days before. Let's hope things
are moving again.
PointedEars
___________
[1] <http://www.mozilla.org/js/language/js20/>
[2] <http://www.holgermetzger.de/Netscape_History.html>
[3] <http://www.ecma-international.org/>

[Matt Kruse]

Light My A$$ On Fire wrote:

On another note, how does it feel to know you will never reproduce or
kiss a real girl?

Dr John Stockton wasn't even posting in this thread - there's no reason to
bring him into the discussion!

(heh, sorry Johnny, blame it on stupid americans' sense of humor)

--
Matt Kruse
Javascript Toolbox: http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/