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Google Groups v Usenet

P: n/a

Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news? I used to
use groups.google but that's become more and more corrupt with Google-only
and Corporate-posting-only Groups over the past few years.

Do a search on "no.flash websites" for example. The first 6+ hits are
from Adobe's corporate macromedia "discussion" groups and all appear to
be moderated to insure that no flash-critical post goes unchallenged.
I'd be surprised if Google didn't receive a fat check from Adobe for
ranking this topic in such a corporation-friendly way.

I still need an unbiased source to do research. Any recommendations?

MHawley
Feb 14 '07 #1
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21 Replies


P: n/a
no**********@smyonic.net wrote:
Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news? I used to
use groups.google but that's become more and more corrupt with Google-only
and Corporate-posting-only Groups over the past few years.

Do a search on "no.flash websites" for example. The first 6+ hits are
from Adobe's corporate macromedia "discussion" groups and all appear to
be moderated to insure that no flash-critical post goes unchallenged.
I'd be surprised if Google didn't receive a fat check from Adobe for
ranking this topic in such a corporation-friendly way.

I still need an unbiased source to do research. Any recommendations?

MHawley
I am sure there are many people out there who would be willing and
able to create such a thing. Just identify them, send along a Google
sized budget and allow a few years for development.

--
Phil Nelson
Feb 14 '07 #2

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Phil Nelson wrote:

I am sure there are many people out there who would be willing and
able to create such a thing. Just identify them, send along a Google
sized budget and allow a few years for development.
That's hilarious, Phil. You've gotten straight to the point!

I have a smaller size USENET archive (in the sig) for a few years now and
I can tell that it requires enormous amount of upkeep with all the junk
that gets tossed into Usenet daily.

As far as the OP's desire to get an unbiased search is concerned: you can
go ahead and search my archive if you want but please don't expect
Google's reach and retention. For that you need those small things
mentioned in Phil's post!

--
Cheers,
Dmitri
See Site Sig Below
--
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Follow comp.infosystems.http://www.authoring.html,ba.interne....players.flash threads |
| with your Firefox Live Bookmarks! Set it up at |
| http://www.1-script.com/forums/ |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Feb 15 '07 #3

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In ba.internet www.1-script.com <in**********************@foo.comwrote:
>Phil Nelson wrote:
>I am sure there are many people out there who would be willing and
able to create such a thing. Just identify them, send along a Google
sized budget and allow a few years for development.

go ahead and search my archive if you want but please don't expect
Google's reach and retention. For that you need those small things
mentioned in Phil's post!
Evidently I should also budget some Microsoft/Google sized bucks for
astroturfing.

MHawley
Feb 15 '07 #4

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Gazing into my crystal ball I observed <no**********@smyonic.net>
writing in news:45***********************@news.sonic.net:
>
Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news? I used to
use groups.google but that's become more and more corrupt with
Google-only and Corporate-posting-only Groups over the past few years.

Do a search on "no.flash websites" for example. The first 6+ hits are
from Adobe's corporate macromedia "discussion" groups and all appear
to be moderated to insure that no flash-critical post goes
unchallenged. I'd be surprised if Google didn't receive a fat check
from Adobe for ranking this topic in such a corporation-friendly way.

I still need an unbiased source to do research. Any recommendations?

MHawley
I still use Google Groups at work because I don't have nntp access at
work. The groups I frequent are on the list that I can access once I am
signed in. If I am looking for a particular group, then I drill down to
the group I want.

Then there's always nntp through a newsreader, or some other Usenet
providers, Supernews and Easynews come to mind.

--
Adrienne Boswell at Home
Arbpen Web Site Design Services
http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info
Please respond to the group so others can share

Feb 15 '07 #5

P: n/a
Scripsit no**********@smyonic.net:
Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news?
By sending to three groups where the question is grossly off-topic and by
using a probably forged email address, you indicate disrespect for Usenet
conduct, so it would be immoral to try to help you before you learn to
behave.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Feb 15 '07 #6

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On 14 Feb 2007 21:29:32 GMT, <no**********@smyonic.netwrote in
<45***********************@news.sonic.net>:
>Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news? I used to
use groups.google but that's become more and more corrupt with Google-only
and Corporate-posting-only Groups over the past few years.

Do a search on "no.flash websites" for example. The first 6+ hits are
from Adobe's corporate macromedia "discussion" groups and all appear to
be moderated to insure that no flash-critical post goes unchallenged.
I'd be surprised if Google didn't receive a fat check from Adobe for
ranking this topic in such a corporation-friendly way.

I still need an unbiased source to do research. Any recommendations?
Use Advanced Search in Google Groups, and specify the relevant Usenet
newsgroups.

--
Best regards,
John Navas
Feb 15 '07 #7

P: n/a
Thu, 15 Feb 2007 02:13:16 GMT from Adrienne Boswell
<ar****@yahoo.com>:
I still use Google Groups at work because I don't have nntp access at
work.
That must be why I see so few of your articles.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/200..._wont_help_you
Feb 16 '07 #8

P: n/a
Troll alert. And some more garbage dumped, over and over- you are the
scurge of of your own complaining. How many times will you write this
tripe b.s? Get a life.

Consider this a prompt for your top post rant! Enjoy yet another
chance to spam the world with your sig...

On Feb 14, 10:24 pm, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorp...@cs.tut.fiwrote:
Scripsit nomailple...@smyonic.net:
Does anyone know of a good place to search for Usenet news?

By sending to three groups where the question is grossly off-topic and by
using a probably forged email address, you indicate disrespect for Usenet
conduct, so it would be immoral to try to help you before you learn to
behave.

--
Jukka K. Korpela ("Yucca")http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Feb 16 '07 #9

P: n/a

"Stan Brown" <th************@fastmail.fmwrote in message
news:MP************************@news.individual.ne t...
Thu, 15 Feb 2007 02:13:16 GMT from Adrienne Boswell
<ar****@yahoo.com>:
>I still use Google Groups at work because I don't have nntp access at
work.

That must be why I see so few of your articles.
I apparently missed the memo: Now if you post on Google Groups the post is
only on Google Groups, and doesn't flow to USENET and to sonic and
supernews, etc?
Feb 22 '07 #10

P: n/a
In article <12*************@news.supernews.com>,
Bob Mgr <ki******@spammenotAOL.comwrote:
>I apparently missed the memo: Now if you post on Google Groups the post is
only on Google Groups, and doesn't flow to USENET and to sonic and
supernews, etc?
God do I wish. That would sure cut down on the spam.
Sadly, they're still polluting Usenet proper.

-Patti
--
Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA |
pattib~pattib.org |
http://www.pattib.org/ | http://www.urbanscapephoto.com
Or just yell, "Hey Patti!" |
Feb 22 '07 #11

P: n/a
Wed, 21 Feb 2007 16:32:14 -0800 from Bob Mgr
<ki******@spammenotAOL.com>:
>
"Stan Brown" <th************@fastmail.fmwrote in message
news:MP************************@news.individual.ne t...
Thu, 15 Feb 2007 02:13:16 GMT from Adrienne Boswell
<ar****@yahoo.com>:
I still use Google Groups at work because I don't have nntp access at
work.
That must be why I see so few of your articles.

I apparently missed the memo: Now if you post on Google Groups the post is
only on Google Groups, and doesn't flow to USENET and to sonic and
supernews, etc?
No, unfortunately. But many folks have decided that the signal/noise
ratio from Google Groups posters is so low that in self defense we
killfile everything from that source. Yes, we miss the occasional
article from someone worth reading; but if we let Google Groups
through we'd be so swamped that we'd probably miss it anyway.

See http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/200..._wont_help_you
Feb 22 '07 #12

P: n/a
On 2007-02-22, Stan Brown wrote:
....
No, unfortunately. But many folks have decided that the signal/noise
ratio from Google Groups posters is so low that in self defense we
killfile everything from that source. Yes, we miss the occasional
article from someone worth reading; but if we let Google Groups
through we'd be so swamped that we'd probably miss it anyway.
I don't killfile posts from GG, and I don't see anything
approaching being "swamped". The problem is nothing like what it
was a couple of years ago.

--
Chris F.A. Johnson <http://cfaj.freeshell.org>
================================================== =================
Author:
Shell Scripting Recipes: A Problem-Solution Approach (2005, Apress)
Feb 22 '07 #13

P: n/a
Stan Brown <th************@fastmail.fmwrote:
>No, unfortunately. But many folks have decided that the signal/noise
ratio from Google Groups posters is so low that in self defense we
killfile everything from that source.
To also cut the second hand noise one can also bin direct follow ups to
GG posters with an extra filter rule if the news client supports regular
expressions:

?-1 Header "Organization: http://groups.google.com"
?-2 References {.googlegroups.com>$}
>Yes, we miss the occasional
article from someone worth reading
Not many ISP's offer a nntp server anymore, regrettably some of the
knowledgable regulars are now also using GG. news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work) for only E10 per annum which is now payable via bank
transfer which should incur no extra costs for people in Euro zone
countries.

An occasional glance at GG should allow unfiltering the people worth
reading who use GG with a few extra filter rules:

?+1 From "Foobar"

--
Spartanicus
Feb 22 '07 #14

P: n/a
Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:46:25 +0000 from Spartanicus
<in*****@invalid.invalid>:
Not many ISP's offer a nntp server anymore, regrettably some of the
knowledgable regulars are now also using GG.
It is indeed regrettable, and unnecessary. As you point out,
news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work) for only E10 per annum which is now payable via bank
transfer which should incur no extra costs for people in Euro zone
countries.
There is a charge for those of us in the US. But n.i.n allow
prepaying. Last April I sent payment for three years in advance, $39
and change.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/200..._wont_help_you
Feb 23 '07 #15

P: n/a
On 22 Feb, 07:46, Spartanicus <inva...@invalid.invalidwrote:
news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work)
Even if port 119 is firewalled?

Feb 23 '07 #16

P: n/a
On 2007-02-23, Andy Dingley <di*****@codesmiths.comwrote:
On 22 Feb, 07:46, Spartanicus <inva...@invalid.invalidwrote:
>news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work)

Even if port 119 is firewalled?
What about writing an NNTP server, in something cross-platform like
Python, that runs on the localhost but converts everything into HTTP
requests that it sends to Google Groups?

Then you could use the newsreader of your choice, either behind a
firewall that lets just HTTP through or with an ISP that doesn't provide
a news server.

You'd be effectively "scraping" Google Groups' web interface, so the
program would need to be kept up-to-date, but it could work. Maybe they
would also have some terms and conditions against it.
Feb 23 '07 #17

P: n/a
On 02/23/2007 02:46 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:46:25 +0000 from Spartanicus
<in*****@invalid.invalid>:
>news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work) for only E10 per annum which is now payable via bank
transfer which should incur no extra costs for people in Euro zone
countries.

There is a charge for those of us in the US. But n.i.n allow
prepaying. Last April I sent payment for three years in advance, $39
and change.
Their website, http://news.individual.net/register.php , doesn't show a
prepayment option. How do you do that?
--
Windows Vista and your freedom in conflict:
http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/420/2
Feb 23 '07 #18

P: n/a
Mumia W. wrote:
On 02/23/2007 02:46 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:46:25 +0000 from Spartanicus
<in*****@invalid.invalid>:
news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP
provided nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are
connected to the net (home, work) for only E10 per annum which is
now payable via bank transfer which should incur no extra costs
for people in Euro zone countries.
There is a charge for those of us in the US. But n.i.n allow
prepaying. Last April I sent payment for three years in advance,
$39 and change.

Their website, http://news.individual.net/register.php , doesn't show
a prepayment option. How do you do that?
This is displayed on their page:
[..] payment with the Internet billing system ClickandBuy or by bank
transfer to a German bank account of Freie Universitšt Berlin [..]
Next to it, is the ClickandBuy logo with a link to the following:
http://clickandbuy.com/EU/en/info.html

Also, from ClickandBuy's help section, you'll find this information:
http://firstgate.com/EU/en/sa/help/p...bereich=surfer

The image under the "Selecting payment method" heading on the above
page shows what payment methods are supported, and a short description
of how they work.

--
Kim Andrť AkerÝ
- ki******@NOSPAMbetadome.com
(remove NOSPAM to contact me directly)
Feb 23 '07 #19

P: n/a
On 02/23/2007 06:00 AM, Kim Andrť AkerÝ wrote:
Mumia W. wrote:
>On 02/23/2007 02:46 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
>>There is a charge for those of us in the US. But n.i.n allow
prepaying. Last April I sent payment for three years in advance,
$39 and change.
Their website, http://news.individual.net/register.php , doesn't show
a prepayment option. How do you do that?

This is displayed on their page:
>[..] payment with the Internet billing system ClickandBuy or by bank
transfer to a German bank account of Freie Universitšt Berlin [..]

Next to it, is the ClickandBuy logo with a link to the following:
http://clickandbuy.com/EU/en/info.html

Also, from ClickandBuy's help section, you'll find this information:
http://firstgate.com/EU/en/sa/help/p...bereich=surfer

The image under the "Selecting payment method" heading on the above
page shows what payment methods are supported, and a short description
of how they work.
Okay thanks.

--
Windows Vista and your freedom in conflict:
http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/420/2
Feb 23 '07 #20

P: n/a
Fri, 23 Feb 2007 10:44:33 GMT from Mumia W.
<pa**************************@earthlink.net>:
On 02/23/2007 02:46 AM, Stan Brown wrote:
Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:46:25 +0000 from Spartanicus
<in*****@invalid.invalid>:
news.individual.net offer
an excellent quality text newsgroup service that unlike ISP provided
nntp servers can be accessed no matter how you are connected to the net
(home, work) for only E10 per annum which is now payable via bank
transfer which should incur no extra costs for people in Euro zone
countries.
There is a charge for those of us in the US. But n.i.n allow
prepaying. Last April I sent payment for three years in advance, $39
and change.

Their website, http://news.individual.net/register.php , doesn't show a
prepayment option. How do you do that?
I arranged it in email with Bettina. Click on the Contact link for
her email address.

The "$39 and change" was what my bank charged me for the 30 euro and
the wire-transfer fee. n.i.n got the 30 euro.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com/
HTML 4.01 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/
validator: http://validator.w3.org/
CSS 2.1 spec: http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/
validator: http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/
Why We Won't Help You:
http://diveintomark.org/archives/200..._wont_help_you
Feb 24 '07 #21

P: n/a
On 02/23/2007 06:38 PM, Stan Brown wrote:
Fri, 23 Feb 2007 10:44:33 GMT from Mumia W.
>Their website, http://news.individual.net/register.php , doesn't show a
prepayment option. How do you do that?

I arranged it in email with Bettina. Click on the Contact link for
her email address.

The "$39 and change" was what my bank charged me for the 30 euro and
the wire-transfer fee. n.i.n got the 30 euro.
Thanks, I might try to contact her. It'll be the first time I've done
any transactions in the Euro. :-)

--
Windows Vista and your freedom in conflict:
http://techdirt.com/articles/20061019/102225.shtml
Feb 24 '07 #22

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