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database market share 2003

http://biz.yahoo.com/rc/040526/tech_...etshare_1.html

Interesting to see that database sales for windows is more than
Unix.
Nov 12 '05
346 16671
"Data Goob" <da******@hotma il.com> wrote in message news:<OR******* ************@fe 42.usenetserver .com>...

Noon is not only a complete idiot, he's an a$$hole with
no point. I still don't get whatever he was talking
about and somehow he never understood the fact that DB2
runs the same single code base on all platforms. Utterly
amazing.


If you have not seen the point, you're blind as a bat.
as for your statements, try using a handle that sounds
like a person instead of a rat.
Nov 12 '05 #311
Serge Rielau apparently said,on my timestamp of 17/06/2004 2:32 PM:
http://www.hughdarwen.freeola.com/Th...Manifesto.web/


Ah, ding ding. The Data& Darwen thing threw me off before.
Know it only too well... Thanks anyway.

--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
wi*******@yahoo .com.au.nospam
Nov 12 '05 #312
Daniel Morgan apparently said,on my timestamp of 17/06/2004 1:24 PM:

This wasn't about who got there first. It was about non-relational
extensions to the relational engine. If you are proudly proclaiming
that DB2 is also non-relational ... then it leads to wondering why
the person that challenged Mark Townsend did so at all doesn't it.


Hehehehe!


--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
wi*******@yahoo .com.au.nospam
Nov 12 '05 #313
Blair Adamache apparently said,on my timestamp of 17/06/2004 4:16 AM:
That seemed like a promising methodology, but I did some google searches
in which the names of frequent posters to this thread were ANDed with
colourful descriptors (wanker) and the results shook my confidence in
the august credentials of our debating club.
I've got a few nice ones too.... There you go. I DO recommend a basic
course on logic and the meaning of AND. :)

BTW, I think it's irrelevant whether and how much Oracle and DB2 have
departed from Codd's 12 rules.
They haven't. If anything, they are closer now than ever.

We have watched relational databases
displace hierachical and network databases - I think it's appropriate
that the relational model gets stretched to address the needs of the
object-oriented and XML worlds.
Stretching does not mean getting away from. It means expanding.
You can expand a relational model WITHOUT becoming non-relational.
OLAP. Some of the world's most successful software (CICS, IMS) came from
tactical solutions developed by customers and field engineers.


Yes, but even IMS has a data storage theory behind it. Hierarchical
databases.

--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
wi*******@yahoo .com.au.nospam
Nov 12 '05 #314
I was going to try to come up with some poetry of my own,
but I'm not as good at it as you are.

The point is Nano-Nano that DB2 runs the same code base
across all platforms, as well as SQL-Server, and I believe
even Informix. I thought we covered this. What is very
strange is why you felt compelled to take personal shots at
just about everyone who has been in this conversation. It
is also strange why Oracle doesn't run well on mainframes,
and cannot scale their clustering beyond 8 servers, which
by the way is documented in Oracles' own literature. Even
Larry Ellison uses SQL-Server on all the Oracle web sites,
so I don't understand the vitriole coming from you.
"Noons" <wi*******@yaho o.com.au> wrote in message news:73******** *************** ***@posting.goo gle.com...
"Data Goob" <da******@hotma il.com> wrote in message news:<OR******* ************@fe 42.usenetserver .com>...

Noon is not only a complete idiot, he's an a$$hole with
no point. I still don't get whatever he was talking
about and somehow he never understood the fact that DB2
runs the same single code base on all platforms. Utterly
amazing.


If you have not seen the point, you're blind as a bat.
as for your statements, try using a handle that sounds
like a person instead of a rat.


Nov 12 '05 #315
Data Goob apparently said,on my timestamp of 17/06/2004 9:14 PM:
I was going to try to come up with some poetry of my own,
but I'm not as good at it as you are.
Please, spare us all....

The point is Nano-Nano that DB2 runs the same code base
The point is two-dicks: you don't have a clue.

across all platforms, as well as SQL-Server, and I believe
even Informix.
Absolutely. Care to talk about computers instead of shoes?

I thought we covered this.
You covered nothing. Stop deluding yourself.
strange is why you felt compelled to take personal shots at
just about everyone who has been in this conversation. It
It's not strange. It's the obvious consequence
when an idiot tries to use personal attacks on me.
is also strange why Oracle doesn't run well on mainframes,
Who cares about mainframes?
and cannot scale their clustering beyond 8 servers, which
Bull.
by the way is documented in Oracles' own literature.
Bull.

Even
Larry Ellison uses SQL-Server on all the Oracle web sites,
What a pile of crap. Get over the personal attacks, it might
work in the Microslop groups you frequent but doesn't stick
with professionals.
so I don't understand the vitriole coming from you.


Rest.
--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
wi*******@yahoo .com.au.nospam
Nov 12 '05 #316
"Serge Rielau" <sr*****@ca.e ye-be-em.com> wrote in message
news:ca******** **@hanover.toro lab.ibm.com...
http://www.hughdarwen.freeola.com/Th...Manifesto.web/


Talking about broken links,
http://www.TheThirdManifesto.com
is less likely to break in the future

Look at the chapter3 pdf on that site if you like your relational model to
be prescribed by a list of 'rules'.
(or better, buy the book)

Regards
Paul Vernon
Business Intelligence, IBM Global Services
Nov 12 '05 #317
"Noons" <wi*******@yaho o.com.au.nospam > wrote in message
news:40******** **************@ news.optusnet.c om.au...
[snip]
Yes, but even IMS has a data storage theory behind it. Hierarchical
databases.


That's arguable. In some ways Codd's greatest achievement was simply showing
that theory could be usefully applied to databases. Most pre-relational
databases did not have much theory behind them, certainly nothing that could
be regarded as a complete model. A better characterisatio n would be that the
implementations and/or specifications came first, and only later did the
more theoretically minded try to elicit abstract models from the mess of
detail.

Taking the example of the network model (and I believe the point holds for
the hierarchal model also) and quoting from Date again.

http://www.intelligententerprise.com.../online2.jhtml

<quote>
a.. First of all, Codd realized that to compare the very concrete CODASYL
specifications and the much more abstract relational model would be an
apples-and-oranges comparison and would involve numerous distracting
irrelevancies.

a.. Hence, it would be necessary first to define an abstract "network
model." The comparison could then be done on a level playing field, as it
were, in a fair and sensible manner.

a.. Codd therefore proceeded to define an abstraction of the CODASYL
specifications that might reasonably be regarded as such a model.

Thus, Codd has some claim to being the first person to attempt to give an
abstract definition, not just of the relational model (of course), but also
of a network model! Certainly none of the CODASYL documents ever attempted
any such thing
</quote>

BTW if you want to continue this arm of the thread, I suggest you start a
new thread in comp.databases. theory.

Regards
Paul Vernon
Business Intelligence, IBM Global Services
Nov 12 '05 #318
"Joel Garry" <jo********@hom e.com> wrote in message
news:91******** *************** ***@posting.goo gle.com...
"Paul Vernon" <pa*********@uk k.ibmm.comm> wrote in message

news:<ca******* ****@gazette.al maden.ibm.com>. ..
"Serge Rielau" <sr*****@ca.e ye-be-em.com> wrote in message
news:ca******** **@hanover.toro lab.ibm.com...
Noons wrote:
> Given that it is the ONLY commercial RDBMS out there that follows
> most of the relational db 12 rules, it probably deserves to be better > represented in education institutions.
"Relational db 12 rules"? Care to elaborate?
At the risk of looking stupid: I draw a blank here.
I only know of normal forms, relational algebra and SQL :-(


Stuipid? No, but one can always know more.

Here is Chris Date's take on "different relational models" where the 12
rules are mentioned in passing.

http://www.dbdebunk.com/page/page/622839.htm


That's a very good article. Given the thrust and tone of the article,
I found it quite entertaining that the numerous links to his book in
the article give "We're sorry, the page you are looking for does not
exists.[SIC]"


You could mail the editor and get it sorted.

More interestingly than those 12 rules however, would be too see which
current DBMS most closely resembles say Data & Darwen's proposals for a
clean relational database system.


I think putting down a database for having non-relational extensions
is silly. It's like saying a sports car isn't any good because it has
a quality radio.


Not a great analogy. I'ld certainly put down a sports car if it had say a
kitchen sink in the boot/trunk.

Regards
Paul Vernon
Business Consulting Services, IBM Global Services
Nov 12 '05 #319
Paul Vernon apparently said,on my timestamp of 17/06/2004 10:56 PM:

That's arguable. In some ways Codd's greatest achievement was simply showing
that theory could be usefully applied to databases. Most pre-relational
databases did not have much theory behind them, certainly nothing that could
be regarded as a complete model. A better characterisatio n would be that the
implementations and/or specifications came first, and only later did the
more theoretically minded try to elicit abstract models from the mess of
detail.
Dunno. Codasyl seemed to be pretty well established.
Note: the point I'm making is not if relational is better.
We all know it is. The point is if it was the _only one_
with a sound theoretical base. IMHO, relational had one big
advantage over the others: a sound mathematical foundation.
But theory behind them, they all had in heaps.
a.. First of all, Codd realized that to compare the very concrete CODASYL
specifications and the much more abstract relational model would be an
apples-and-oranges comparison and would involve numerous distracting
irrelevancies.
Agreed.
a.. Hence, it would be necessary first to define an abstract "network
model." The comparison could then be done on a level playing field, as it
were, in a fair and sensible manner.

a.. Codd therefore proceeded to define an abstraction of the CODASYL
specifications that might reasonably be regarded as such a model.
and in the process took some "liberties" that were never defined
in the Codasyl standard... Nothing wrong with that: he was
just trying to explain why relational was so much better.
Which is true.

Thus, Codd has some claim to being the first person to attempt to give an
abstract definition, not just of the relational model (of course), but also
of a network model! Certainly none of the CODASYL documents ever attempted
any such thing
Beg to disagree. Codd gave it one _interpretation _. But the Codasyl
model was as well defined as it could get, outside of formal maths.
BTW if you want to continue this arm of the thread, I suggest you start a
new thread in comp.databases. theory.


Narh, thanks. I'd rather talk to you folks than have
to endure that incompetent abortion called Celko.
Or the "OO-expert-du-jour", an even worse specimen
if that is possible.

--
Cheers
Nuno Souto
wi*******@yahoo .com.au.nospam
Nov 12 '05 #320

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