virtual methods ?

[Geiregat Jonas]

I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
class foo{
public:
virtual bool method();
}

what does virtual do ?

[Thomas Matthews]

Geiregat Jonas wrote:

I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
class foo{
public:
virtual bool method();
}

what does virtual do ?

Read your C++ text book or reference manual. If it doesn't
explain virtual functions, then get a better one.

See the FAQ:
http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lit...functions.html

Always research the reference manual first, the FAQ second
then search the newsgroups.

--
Thomas Matthews

C++ newsgroup welcome message:
http://www.slack.net/~shiva/welcome.txt
C++ Faq: http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite
C Faq: http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/c-faq/top.html
alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++ faq:
http://www.raos.demon.uk/acllc-c++/faq.html
Other sites:
http://www.josuttis.com -- C++ STL Library book

[E. Robert Tisdale]

Geiregat Jonas wrote:

I've seen some C++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:

class foo{
public:
virtual bool method(void);
}

what does virtual do?

It means that an invocation of bool method(void)
may actually resolve to the function definition
for a class derived from foo.

[Adie]

David Cattarin wrote:

Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<7f********************************@4ax.com>. ..

Geiregat Jonas wrote:

>I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
>class foo{
>public:
> virtual bool method();
>}
>
>what does virtual do ?

Adds a little spice.

[snip]

Base* someObject;
someObject = new DerivedB; // it's a DerivedB obj
someObject->aVirtual(x);// does something else

The point is that by making method aVirtual "virtual" the compiler allows
access to each derived classes functions at runtime, otherwise you will be
stuck with Base's.

That's not quite right. Without virtual, the compiler chooses the
method based on the pointer type.

Base* bObj;
Derived* dObj = new Derived;
bObj = dObj

bObj->fn( ); // Calls B's version of fn( )
dObj->fn( ); // Calls D's version of fn( )

Sorry, thought that was what I was getting at.

Might this be a better example?

Base* base;
base = new Base;
base->f(); // calls base version of f()
delete base;
base = new DerivedA;
base->f(); // calls DerivedA version of f()
delete base;
base = NULL;

I havent tried this, I'm guessing that it should be ok.

[Gavin Deane]

Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<7f********************************@4ax.com>. ..

Geiregat Jonas wrote:

I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
class foo{
public:
virtual bool method();
}

what does virtual do ?

Adds a little spice.

Actually, being as Those Who Know have decided that all C++ questions
should be directed to a FAQ

Not all C++ questions, just the frequently asked ones. Do you see now?

[David Cattarin]

Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<lc********************************@4ax.com>. ..

David Cattarin wrote:

Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<7f********************************@4ax.com>. ..

Geiregat Jonas wrote:

>I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
>class foo{
>public:
> virtual bool method();
>}
>
>what does virtual do ?

Adds a little spice. [snip] Base* someObject;
someObject = new DerivedB; // it's a DerivedB obj
someObject->aVirtual(x);// does something else

The point is that by making method aVirtual "virtual" the compiler allows
access to each derived classes functions at runtime, otherwise you will be
stuck with Base's.

That's not quite right. Without virtual, the compiler chooses the
method based on the pointer type.

Base* bObj;
Derived* dObj = new Derived;
bObj = dObj

bObj->fn( ); // Calls B's version of fn( )
dObj->fn( ); // Calls D's version of fn( )

Sorry, thought that was what I was getting at.

Might this be a better example?

Base* base;
base = new Base;
base->f(); // calls base version of f()
delete base;
base = new DerivedA;
base->f(); // calls DerivedA version of f()
delete base;
base = NULL;

I havent tried this, I'm guessing that it should be ok.

Not quite. When virtual is not used, the selection of the method is
determined at compile time based on how the method is accessed; in our
case we are talking about pointers.

So, there is one mistake in your example:
base = new DerivedA;
base->f( ); // calls *** Base *** version of f( )

Dave

[Adie]

David Cattarin wrote:

Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<lc********************************@4ax.com>. ..

David Cattarin wrote:

>Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<7f********************************@4ax.com>. ..
>> Geiregat Jonas wrote:
>>
>> >I've seen some c++ code where before a method there was vitual ex:
>> >class foo{
>> >public:
>> > virtual bool method();
>> >}
>> >
>> >what does virtual do ?
>>
>> Adds a little spice.

[snip]

>> Base* someObject;
>> someObject = new DerivedB; // it's a DerivedB obj
>> someObject->aVirtual(x);// does something else
>>
>> The point is that by making method aVirtual "virtual" the compiler allows
>> access to each derived classes functions at runtime, otherwise you will be
>> stuck with Base's.
>
>That's not quite right. Without virtual, the compiler chooses the
>method based on the pointer type.
>
>Base* bObj;
>Derived* dObj = new Derived;
>bObj = dObj
>
>bObj->fn( ); // Calls B's version of fn( )
>dObj->fn( ); // Calls D's version of fn( )

Sorry, thought that was what I was getting at.

Might this be a better example?

Base* base;
base = new Base;
base->f(); // calls base version of f()
delete base;
base = new DerivedA;
base->f(); // calls DerivedA version of f()
delete base;
base = NULL;

I havent tried this, I'm guessing that it should be ok.

Not quite. When virtual is not used, the selection of the method is
determined at compile time based on how the method is accessed; in our
case we are talking about pointers.

So, there is one mistake in your example:
base = new DerivedA;
base->f( ); // calls *** Base *** version of f( )

No it's ok, I was assuming (assumed that you'd assume too) that Base had a
virtual void f()

One thing that I havent discovered yet, is how to determine which type of
derived object the dynamically assigned Base pointer is pointing to. For
instance

class Base // includes virtual void f() { cout << "Hello from Base";}
class DerivedA : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedA";}
class DerivedB : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedB";}

int main (void)
{
std::vector<Base*> vBase;
Base *base, *derivedA, *derivedB;
base = new Base;
derivedA = new DerivedA;
derivedB = new DerivedB;
vBase.push_back(base);
vBase.push_back(derivedA);
vBase.push_back(derivedB);

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{

This is where i'm confused. How do I get the type of object each pointer
in vBase is pointing to? Will value_type do it or will that just return
Base? Haven't tried to compile this obviously.
}
}

[Michael Isenman]

"Adie" wrote:

One thing that I havent discovered yet, is how to determine which type of
derived object the dynamically assigned Base pointer is pointing to. For
instance

class Base // includes virtual void f() { cout << "Hello from Base";}
class DerivedA : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedA";}
class DerivedB : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedB";}

int main (void)
{
std::vector<Base*> vBase;
Base *base, *derivedA, *derivedB;
base = new Base;
derivedA = new DerivedA;
derivedB = new DerivedB;
vBase.push_back(base);
vBase.push_back(derivedA);
vBase.push_back(derivedB);

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{

This is where i'm confused. How do I get the type of object each pointer
in vBase is pointing to?
The smart-ass (but mostly correct answer) is "why do you care?". After all,
if you designed your class
hierarchy correctly, the polymorphic behavior will occur via virtual
functions without your knowing the
type of the object.In you example above, presumably you would just call f(),
and the correct f() will just
be called without your having to worry about which type of derived class it
is.
Will value_type do it or will that just return
Base?

value_type is Base*. value_type is not polymorphic, it's just a typedef for
what is stored in the vector,
which in this case you've defined to be Base*.

The less smart-ass answer is that if you absolutely, positively, must know
the exact type of the object, you
use the dynamic_cast operator. If you need more type info than dynamic_cast
provides, you can use the
type_id operator. But nine times out of ten - and maybe more frequently -
the fact that you need to know
the exact type of a polymorphic object is evidence of a design flaw in your
code - you should just be using
virtual functions, not if statements or switch statements that depend upon
the type of the object.

Best regards,

Tom

[Adie]

Michael Isenman wrote:

"Adie" wrote:

One thing that I havent discovered yet, is how to determine which type of
derived object the dynamically assigned Base pointer is pointing to. For
instance

class Base // includes virtual void f() { cout << "Hello from Base";}
class DerivedA : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedA";}
class DerivedB : public Base //void f() { cout << "Hello from DerivedB";}

int main (void)
{
std::vector<Base*> vBase;
Base *base, *derivedA, *derivedB;
base = new Base;
derivedA = new DerivedA;
derivedB = new DerivedB;
vBase.push_back(base);
vBase.push_back(derivedA);
vBase.push_back(derivedB);

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{

This is where i'm confused. How do I get the type of object each pointer
in vBase is pointing to?

The smart-ass (but mostly correct answer) is "why do you care?". After all,
if you designed your class
hierarchy correctly, the polymorphic behavior will occur via virtual
functions without your knowing the
type of the object.In you example above, presumably you would just call f(),
and the correct f() will just
be called without your having to worry about which type of derived class it
is.

So if the for loop looks like;

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];
newBase->f();
}

it'll wade through the vector assigning to the Base pointer but will still
call the correct f() for derived object? Is that right? Sounds kinda
groovy if it is.

Will value_type do it or will that just return
Base?

value_type is Base*. value_type is not polymorphic, it's just a typedef for
what is stored in the vector,
which in this case you've defined to be Base*.

The less smart-ass answer is that if you absolutely, positively, must know
the exact type of the object, you
use the dynamic_cast operator. If you need more type info than dynamic_cast
provides, you can use the
type_id operator. But nine times out of ten - and maybe more frequently -
the fact that you need to know
the exact type of a polymorphic object is evidence of a design flaw in your
code - you should just be using
virtual functions, not if statements or switch statements that depend upon
the type of the object.

Yes, I can see that would make it all very labour intensive.

[Adie]

Corey Murtagh wrote:

Adie wrote:

Michael Isenman wrote:

<snip>

The smart-ass (but mostly correct answer) is "why do you care?". After all,
if you designed your class
hierarchy correctly, the polymorphic behavior will occur via virtual
functions without your knowing the
type of the object.In you example above, presumably you would just call f(),
and the correct f() will just
be called without your having to worry about which type of derived class it
is.

So if the for loop looks like;

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];
newBase->f();
}

it'll wade through the vector assigning to the Base pointer but will still
call the correct f() for derived object? Is that right? Sounds kinda
groovy if it is.

Yes, that's exactly what the 'virtual' keyword is intended for. To test:

-----------
#include <iostream>

class Base
{
public:
virtual int f() const { return 1; }
};

class Derived : public Base
{
public:
virtual int f() const { return 2; }
};

int main()
{
Base* b = new Derived;
std::cout << b->f() << std::endl;
return 0;
}
-----------

The above prints '2'... or should. If it doesn't then something is
seriously wrong.

You know, I asked my lecturer about this a while back and she said that
you had to find the type when extracting the pointer from a container, I
thought at the time that it was a bit clumsy. She's actually a Java
programmer and suggested it was easier in Java, kinda fundamentally wrong
wasn't she.

[Corey Murtagh]

Adie wrote:

Corey Murtagh wrote:

<snip>

The above prints '2'... or should. If it doesn't then something is
seriously wrong.

You know, I asked my lecturer about this a while back and she said that
you had to find the type when extracting the pointer from a container, I
thought at the time that it was a bit clumsy. She's actually a Java
programmer and suggested it was easier in Java, kinda fundamentally wrong
wasn't she.

Yeah, it sounds that way. At the very least her statement was
misleading. She shouldn't be 'teaching' things like this to students
when she either doesn't know what she's talking about, or can't
communicate it correctly.

The only time you need to determine the true class of a polymorphic
object is if you need to access methods which are first defined for that
class. There are cases where this is desirable, which is most of the
reason for dynamic_cast<>(). In a lot of cases though you can avoid it
by designing your base class to provide all the interfaces you need for
your derived classes.

--
Corey Murtagh
The Electric Monk
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur!"

[Adie]

Corey Murtagh wrote:

Adie wrote:

You know, I asked my lecturer about this a while back and she said that
you had to find the type when extracting the pointer from a container, I
thought at the time that it was a bit clumsy. She's actually a Java
programmer and suggested it was easier in Java, kinda fundamentally wrong
wasn't she.
Yeah, it sounds that way. At the very least her statement was
misleading. She shouldn't be 'teaching' things like this to students
when she either doesn't know what she's talking about, or can't
communicate it correctly.

Sadly the coverage of standard C++ was poor, three modules (classes) in
total - the first gave us; void main() for which I promptly wrapped on
the knuckles for using on Usenet, the second offered an intro into GUI
toolkits with X, Athena and Qt whilst the third concentrated on using
Borland CPP Builder libraries/GUI with some UML/Patterns stuff thrown in
for good measure. I suppose they're worried that most people would become
bored with three straight C++ modules, disadvantage being that we didn't
get a good coverage of what are considered the basics.

Oh well, there's always books and Usenet, I'll get there in the end :-)
The only time you need to determine the true class of a polymorphic
object is if you need to access methods which are first defined for that
class. There are cases where this is desirable, which is most of the
reason for dynamic_cast<>(). In a lot of cases though you can avoid it
by designing your base class to provide all the interfaces you need for
your derived classes.

Doesn't that go against the grain of keeping Base classes as lightweight
as possible?

[Corey Murtagh]

Adie wrote:

Corey Murtagh wrote:

Adie wrote:

You know, I asked my lecturer about this a while back and she said that
you had to find the type when extracting the pointer from a container, I
thought at the time that it was a bit clumsy. She's actually a Java
programmer and suggested it was easier in Java, kinda fundamentally wrong
wasn't she.
Yeah, it sounds that way. At the very least her statement was
misleading. She shouldn't be 'teaching' things like this to students
when she either doesn't know what she's talking about, or can't
communicate it correctly.

Sadly the coverage of standard C++ was poor, three modules (classes) in
total - the first gave us; void main() for which I promptly wrapped on
the knuckles for using on Usenet, the second offered an intro into GUI
toolkits with X, Athena and Qt whilst the third concentrated on using
Borland CPP Builder libraries/GUI with some UML/Patterns stuff thrown in
for good measure. I suppose they're worried that most people would become
bored with three straight C++ modules, disadvantage being that we didn't
get a good coverage of what are considered the basics.

Unfortunately this seems to be a common trend. The perception that C++
is "too difficult" compared to languages like Java and Visual Basic has
really damaged the educational possibilities.
Oh well, there's always books and Usenet, I'll get there in the end :-)

As a self-taught programmer I've picked up an aweful lot of useful stuff
online :>

The downside is that I don't have a piece of paper to tell prospective
employers that I'm able to do what I've *been* doing for the past 7
years. Makes it rather difficult to get work, even though they claim
we've got a shortage of C++ programmers over here at the moment.

The only time you need to determine the true class of a polymorphic
object is if you need to access methods which are first defined for that
class. There are cases where this is desirable, which is most of the
reason for dynamic_cast<>(). In a lot of cases though you can avoid it
by designing your base class to provide all the interfaces you need for
your derived classes.

Doesn't that go against the grain of keeping Base classes as lightweight
as possible?

Code-wise, not really. Your base class doesn't actually have to
implement *any* of those interfaces if you really want it to stay light.
All of the functionality can be implemented down the inheritence tree.

That said, this is a fairly common structure in some areas:

class base_object
{
public:
base_object();
virtual ~base_object();

// some interfaces common to all derived
//...
};

class derived1a : public base_object
{
public:
derived1();
virtual ~derived1();

// common interfaces implemented in this class
//...

// new interfaces implemented for this branch
//...
};

class derived1b : public base_object
{
// like derived1a, but with different new interfaces
};

etc. This allows you to store all of your derived objects in a
base_object pointer, or vector of pointers, or whatever. Each branch
then has to be identified at its branch point using dynamic_cast<>().
So if I have a vector full of base_object*s and I need an interface
that's only provided by objects descended from derived1b, I can filter
the vector with dynamic_cast<>().

It has its uses. It can simplify certain aspects of your programs, but
overuse can make your code that much more difficult to read. Usually
it's preferable to have a more complete interface in the base and
provide implementation details in the descendants.
--
Corey Murtagh
The Electric Monk
"Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur!"

[Robert Groves]

On Wed, 25 Jun 2003 18:32:17 +0100, Adie <a_**********@hotmail.com>
wrote:

Corey Murtagh wrote:

Adie wrote:

Michael Isenman wrote:

<snip>

The smart-ass (but mostly correct answer) is "why do you care?". After all,
if you designed your class
hierarchy correctly, the polymorphic behavior will occur via virtual
functions without your knowing the
type of the object.In you example above, presumably you would just call f(),
and the correct f() will just
be called without your having to worry about which type of derived class it
is.

So if the for loop looks like;

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];
newBase->f();
}

it'll wade through the vector assigning to the Base pointer but will still
call the correct f() for derived object? Is that right? Sounds kinda
groovy if it is.

Yes, that's exactly what the 'virtual' keyword is intended for. To test:

-----------
#include <iostream>

class Base
{
public:
virtual int f() const { return 1; }
};

class Derived : public Base
{
public:
virtual int f() const { return 2; }
};

int main()
{
Base* b = new Derived;
std::cout << b->f() << std::endl;
return 0;
}
-----------

The above prints '2'... or should. If it doesn't then something is
seriously wrong.

You know, I asked my lecturer about this a while back and she said that
you had to find the type when extracting the pointer from a container, I
thought at the time that it was a bit clumsy. She's actually a Java
programmer and suggested it was easier in Java, kinda fundamentally wrong
wasn't she.

If she was a java programmer it is probably because in java there are
no templates. All the standard containers store Objects, which is
basically a Base type for every other java type. So when using a
container you must cast all objects that you pull out of the container
before you can use them. This is a huge flaw in java and, as I
understand, version 1.5 will have some type of templates. So it was
probably her way of doing things coming from java, but in C++ you
don't need to do this, provided you use a template container with the
interface you plan on using.

[Thomas Tutone]

"Adie" <a_**********@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8p********************************@4ax.com...

This is where i'm confused. How do I get the type of object each pointer in vBase is pointing to?
The smart-ass (but mostly correct answer) is "why do you care?". After all,if you designed your class
hierarchy correctly, the polymorphic behavior will occur via virtual
functions without your knowing the
type of the object.In you example above, presumably you would just call f(),and the correct f() will just
be called without your having to worry about which type of derived class itis.

So if the for loop looks like;

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];
newBase->f();

I know I'm stating the obvious, but I'd substitute:
vBase[i]->f();
for the above three lines. Less typing, plus it gets rid of the unneeded
newBase variable.
}

it'll wade through the vector assigning to the Base pointer but will still
call the correct f() for derived object? Is that right? Sounds kinda groovy if it is.

Welcome to C++, my friend.

Best regards,

Tom

[Adie]

Adie wrote:

Heh there's a UK university doing an MSc .NET, there's nothing like a well
rounded education, and that's nothing like a well a well rounded
education...

For the record it's ".NET MSc in Distributed Systems Development"

http://www2.dcs.hull.ac.uk/NETMSc/index.html

[Karl Heinz Buchegger]

Adie wrote:

etc. This allows you to store all of your derived objects in a
base_object pointer, or vector of pointers, or whatever. Each branch
then has to be identified at its branch point using dynamic_cast<>().
So if I have a vector full of base_object*s and I need an interface
that's only provided by objects descended from derived1b, I can filter
the vector with dynamic_cast<>().

Sorry to be dense, but doesn't dynamic_cast<type id>(expression) just cast
expression to type id? Can you us it in an "if" statement?

The trick with dynamic_cast ist the following:
dynamic_cast also checks if the object you want to cast is really
of the type you specify in the dynamic_cast. If you use it with
pointers and the object is not of the required type you will
get a 0 Pointer. And that is something you can detect.

example:

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];

// now newBase could point to a Base object or to
// DerivedA or DerivedB objects. Figure out which one

// try to cast newBase to a DerivedA pointer.
// But at runtime it should be checked, if the object newBase
// points at is really a DerivedA

DerivedA* pPtrA = dynamic_cast< DerivedA* >( newBase );
if( pPtrA != 0 ) {
// it was a DerivedA object
}

else {
DerivedB* pPtr = dynamic_cast< DerivedB* >( newBase );
if( pPtr != 0 ) {
// it was a DerivedB object
}
else {
// must have been a Base object
}
}
}

Now compare that with the simple use of a virtual function :-)

Additionally. Imagine you introduce a new class in about half a year:

class DerivedC : public Base
{
...
};

What do you have to do? Well, in the above you have to add some logic
for the new class to detect it and add another if - else branch.

And with the dispatch through virtual functions?
Surprise: You have to do nothing! You just implement the function f()
in the new class and the code you already had:

for (int i = 0; i < vBase.size(); i++)
{
Base* newBase;
newBase = vBase[i];
newBase->f();
}

dispatches to DerivedC::f() whenver there is a pointer to DerivedC
stored in the container. You don't even have to recompile the above
loop!

It has its uses. It can simplify certain aspects of your programs, but
overuse can make your code that much more difficult to read. Usually
it's preferable to have a more complete interface in the base and
provide implementation details in the descendants.

Might delegation also be used for this kind of problem, wrap the class
with the added functionality?

Since the goal is to store pointers in a container and use
polymorphism, this is not a good idea. If you want to make
use of polymorphism to your advantage, then creating a complete
interface in the base class is often far less work then any other
option.

--
Karl Heinz Buchegger
kb******@gascad.at