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Impact on C???

Is the introduction of DotNet and other advanced languages had a great
impact on the usage of C and C++?

Aug 5 '06 #1
7 1508
an***************@gmail.com said:
Is the introduction of DotNet and other advanced languages
..NET isn't a language, and it isn't all that advanced. It's just an attempt
to lock you into Microsoft. In my own experience of "managed" code under
..NET (admittedly using heavily recursive algorithms), the performance was
about 60 times slower than equivalent code translated and executed in the
usual way.
had a great impact on the usage of C and C++?
Not significantly, no. For one thing, it doesn't have any bearing at all on
C's traditional platforms - Unix and the embedded world. And for another
thing, the performance simply isn't there. Even C++ is (considerably)
faster without .NET than with it.

A few Win32 GUI developers will go the C# route, of course, just as they
went the J++ route a few years ago. Anyone remember that? Does anyone still
use J++? Probably one or two die-hards, but apart from that...

If you really want to re-develop your entire source base every eighteen
months, be sure to get the latest from MS. And don't forget those Service
Packs, folks!

--
Richard Heathfield
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29/7/1999
http://www.cpax.org.uk
email: rjh at above domain (but drop the www, obviously)
Aug 5 '06 #2
an***************@gmail.com a écrit :
Is the introduction of DotNet and other advanced languages had a great
impact on the usage of C and C++?
Yes!

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Aug 5 '06 #3
Richard Heathfield a écrit :
an***************@gmail.com said:

>>Is the introduction of DotNet and other advanced languages


.NET isn't a language, and it isn't all that advanced. It's just an attempt
to lock you into Microsoft. In my own experience of "managed" code under
.NET (admittedly using heavily recursive algorithms), the performance was
about 60 times slower than equivalent code translated and executed in the
usual way.

This depends. For instance I have tried the only real (serious)
application developped entirely under dot net, the new windows shell
"wsh".

To complete a simple command like

ls -R | grep edit5.c

windows shell takes 3 minutes 30 seconds to complete. Compare with
cmd.exe that takes 2 seconds to do the same. This is more than 100
times slower!

Just to startup the windows shell takes 9 seconds. All this in an
AMD64 3000 with 1GB RAM. This is slower than the command shell
of MSDOS!

>>had a great impact on the usage of C and C++?


Not significantly, no. For one thing, it doesn't have any bearing at all on
C's traditional platforms - Unix and the embedded world. And for another
thing, the performance simply isn't there. Even C++ is (considerably)
faster without .NET than with it.
Which C++?

Note that there is C++ and "managed" C++ that runs exclusively under dot
net.

The "new and improved" C++ is already quite different from the
traditional C++ and will in the next few months attain the
speed of JAVA...

A few Win32 GUI developers will go the C# route, of course, just as they
went the J++ route a few years ago. Anyone remember that? Does anyone still
use J++? Probably one or two die-hards, but apart from that...
There weren't so many J++ developers. A MUCH sadder story is the fate
of the VB6 developers, that now have to rewrite ALL their applications
since the new Visual Basic is NOT compatible with VB6. This means that
for many small shops they are faced with a financial burden that they
will never be able to cope with.
If you really want to re-develop your entire source base every eighteen
months, be sure to get the latest from MS. And don't forget those Service
Packs, folks!
Remember MFC?
I am glad I did not learn that. It is now completely obsolete, just a
few years after it was "the language of the day".
You mention J++ but you fail to mention all the OTHER stuff like ATL,
or the many versions of COM, etc etc.

Aug 5 '06 #4
<an***************@gmail.comwrote
Is the introduction of DotNet and other advanced languages had a great
impact on the usage of C and C++?
Obviously in areas where those laguages compete with C, some people who
would have programmed in C before they came available now program under dot
net.
dot net is actually a system of compilers rather than a language. A lot of
Windows applications are developed in C under dot net.

However the sort of code I am now developing, for example, doesn't run on
PCs and cannot be sensibly developed in anthing other than a fully portable,
stable language. We are actully still making eavey use of Fortran 77.

--
www.personal.leeds.ac.uk/~bgy1mm
freeware games to download.
Aug 5 '06 #5
jacob navia said:
Richard Heathfield a écrit :
>an***************@gmail.com said:
<snip>
>
>>>had a great impact on the usage of C and C++?

Not significantly, no. For one thing, it doesn't have any bearing at all
on C's traditional platforms - Unix and the embedded world. And for
another thing, the performance simply isn't there. Even C++ is
(considerably) faster without .NET than with it.

Which C++?
Shorthand for "native binaries for x86 that were translated from C++ source
code".
Note that there is C++ and "managed" C++ that runs exclusively under dot
net.
Yes, that's what I was comparing - what we might call native C++ (purely for
reasons of word economy) and managed C++ under .NET.

<snip>

--
Richard Heathfield
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29/7/1999
http://www.cpax.org.uk
email: rjh at above domain (but drop the www, obviously)
Aug 5 '06 #6
jacob navia <ja***@jacob.remcomp.frwrote:
Remember MFC?
<ot>As recently as two months ago I was tasked with maintaining some
God-awful legacy MFC code, so evidently some people do.</ot>

--
C. Benson Manica | I *should* know what I'm talking about - if I
cbmanica(at)gmail.com | don't, I need to know. Flames welcome.
Aug 7 '06 #7

"Christopher Benson-Manica" <at***@ukato.freeshell.orgwrote in message
news:eb**********@chessie.cirr.com...
jacob navia <ja***@jacob.remcomp.frwrote:
>Remember MFC?

<ot>As recently as two months ago I was tasked with maintaining some
God-awful legacy MFC code, so evidently some people do.</ot>
You do need tools though.
Typically I write all my Windows code in straight C with library calls.
However that strategy is only viable if you are writing little graphical
diddy programs with a few buttons here and there. Even I find myself doing a
awful lot of cutting and pasting.

I hated the sight of MFC, because basically I feel that programs should be
eother human-understandable programs, or totally automatic, not semi-machine
written, but when I saw someone tack up an all-singing, all-dancing API in a
couple of weeks, I was impressed.
--
www.personal.leeds.ac.uk/~bgy1mm
freeware games to download.

Aug 9 '06 #8

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