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C programme

Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv

Jan 20 '06 #1
29 1956
On 20 Jan 2006 14:47:26 -0800, "Kev P." <ke*********@mbda.co.uk>
wrote:
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv


You might like OpenWatcom, free at www.openwatcom.org .

--
Al Balmer
Sun City, AZ
Jan 20 '06 #2
Kev P. wrote
(in article
<11**********************@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups .com>):
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv


Off-Topic:
Assuming you want something for Windows, if you want to use the
command line, you can either download the free microsoft
compiler, or several gcc variants.

If you want an IDE development environment, try something like
Dev-C++ (despite the name, it can be used for straight C) from
Bloodshed.

In the future, you should ask questions like this in a forum
that caters to your specific platform interest.

c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.
--
Randy Howard (2reply remove FOOBAR)
"The power of accurate observation is called cynicism by those
who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw
How 'bout them Horns?

Jan 20 '06 #3
Kev P. wrote:
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

http://c-faq.com/resources/compilers.html

Brian

--
Please quote enough of the previous message for context. To do so from
Google, click "show options" and use the Reply shown in the expanded
header.
Jan 20 '06 #4
On Fri, 20 Jan 2006 23:01:19 +0000, Default User wrote:
Kev P. wrote:
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.


http://c-faq.com/resources/compilers.html


Another adjunct:
<http://www.clc-wiki.net/wiki/c_compilers>

--
http://members.dodo.com.au/~netocrat
Jan 20 '06 #5
Netocrat wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jan 2006 23:01:19 +0000, Default User wrote:
Kev P. wrote:
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.


http://c-faq.com/resources/compilers.html


Another adjunct:
<http://www.clc-wiki.net/wiki/c_compilers>


I'll have to start remembering the wiki :)


Brian
Jan 21 '06 #6
Randy Howard wrote:
Kev P. wrote
(in article
<11**********************@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups .com>):
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv

<snip>

c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.


Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I mean, come
on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c* - i.e., there's
nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie shouldn't ask *anything*
that's even *marginally c-related* here [apart from from the pedantry of
some of some of the folks that post here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where would you
go and ask on the usenet!! ?

--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, a pedant will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 21 '06 #7
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote:

[...]
c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.


Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I mean, come
on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c* - i.e., there's
nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie shouldn't ask *anything*
that's even *marginally c-related* here [apart from from the pedantry of
some of some of the folks that post here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where would you
go and ask on the usenet!! ?


<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>

--
http://members.dodo.com.au/~netocrat
Jan 21 '06 #8
pemo wrote:
Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions:


No.
That's where you post,
when you want to discuss the C standard document itself.
If you want to propose changes to the standard, that's the place.

--
pete
Jan 21 '06 #9
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
Randy Howard wrote:
Kev P. wrote [...] c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.
Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions:


No. comp.std.c is for discussion of the standard *as a document*.
This includes discussions of errors and ambiguities in the standard,
proposals for changes to the standard, and so forth. comp.lang.c is
for discussion of the language defined by the standard. The exact
division admittedly isn't always obvious.
I mean, come
on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c* - i.e., there's
nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie shouldn't ask *anything*
that's even *marginally c-related* here [apart from from the pedantry of
some of some of the folks that post here]
Again, no. Standard C is a bit enough topic to keep us well occupied.
There are *plenty* of system-specific newsgroups out there. If you
have a question that depends on POSIX features, for example, you can
ask in comp.unix.programmer. If you have a question that depends on
Windows-specific features, there are a number of Windows groups,
including comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win32. And so forth.

Our neighbor down the hall, comp.lang.c++, once experimented with
allowing anything C++-related to be discussed. It nearly destroyed
the newsgroup, as the people who wanted to discuss the language itself
were unable to get through the noise. The group has since recovered.
(This is second-hand information; I didn't witness this myself, but
I've heard about it.)
Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where would you
go and ask on the usenet!! ?
Quite possibly I'd go to comp.lang.c. If my question can be answered
within the scope of the standard, I'll probably get a good answer. If
not, hopefully someone will be kind enough to politely tell me where
to go to find the experts on whatever I'm asking about.

If I'm a sufficiently clever newbie, I might follow the newsgroup for
a while, or scan the recent archives, and find out whether my question
is topical before I post it.

[snip]
Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, a pedant will be along
shortly'].


The fact that factual errors are quickly corrected here is, IMHO, one
of the best features of this newsgroup. I suggest that you *should*
care about correctness, for the sake of the newbies if nothing else.

--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) ks***@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this.
Jan 21 '06 #10

"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:dq**********@news.ox.ac.uk...
Randy Howard wrote:
Kev P. wrote
(in article
<11**********************@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups .com>):
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv

<snip>

c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.


Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I mean,

come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c* - i.e., there's
nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie shouldn't ask *anything*
that's even *marginally c-related* here [apart from from the pedantry of
some of some of the folks that post here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?
If I were a newbie and I had a question I might ask it here. The replies
would help me to discern where the
question is appropriate.

..
--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, a pedant will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============

Jan 21 '06 #11
Default User wrote:
Netocrat wrote:
On Fri, 20 Jan 2006 23:01:19 +0000, Default User wrote:
Kev P. wrote:

Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.
http://c-faq.com/resources/compilers.html

Another adjunct:
<http://www.clc-wiki.net/wiki/c_compilers>


I'll have to start remembering the wiki :)


You could even add to it ;-)
--
Flash Gordon
Living in interesting times.
Although my email address says spam, it is real and I read it.
Jan 21 '06 #12
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote:

[...]
c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.


Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that post
here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?


<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs - what's NOT clear about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!

For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 21 '06 #13
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote:

[...]
c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.

Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that post
here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?


<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs - what's NOT clear about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!

For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


I just wrote a rather lengthy response to this. I've decided not to
post it for now; I may do so later.

pemo, please consider carefully whether you really want to antagonize
most of the readers of this newsgroup. Your attitude and behavior
have already put your further meaningful participation in this
newsgroup in serious doubt. I suspect a number of regulars have
already killfiled you, or will do so as soon as they read your latest
article. If you'll stop for a few minutes and think about it, I think
you'll understand why.

This is really just an honest difference of opinion over how this
newsgroup should be run -- and, frankly, you're not going to win.

Please reconsider your attitude and behavior. You'll find that
verbally abusing people who are trying to be helpful will not benefit
anybody.

--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) ks***@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this.
Jan 21 '06 #14
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 01:49:33 +0000, pemo wrote:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote: [...]
I mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[...] <http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>
Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs -


OK, then I'll explain that it's a Jack Klein post from November last year
that's the most balanced explanation I've yet read of the current
topicality norms in c.l.c.
what's NOT clear about comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!
The referenced post answers your question like this: there's nothing
unclear about the computing language, C - there's a single international
standard that defines it.

We'd all much rather discuss the technical than the meta-topical here,
right? So if, after reading that post, you come away thinking "hmm, well,
it makes enough sense" - great, let's get back to it. If you come away
thinking, "yes, but...", well then think it through carefully and post an
article responding to the issues it raises. I doubt that anyone here
*wants* to be seen as authoritarian/unkind - but neither does anyone want
to see their (excellent) technical group overrun with unfocused,
undiluted discussion and lose all expertise. I don't begrudge you having
an opinion on this group's topicality norms - and I haven't even expressed
my own opinion of them - all I've done is point out a long-time
contributor's explanation, so I don't see what you found so offensive for
you to end your post the way you did.
For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's
for homework, well, I'll at least [not simply dismiss it.]


I've noticed several regulars who frequently go beyond the strict
topicality norms when answering off-topic questions but who do so in such
a careful and sensible way that they don't get called on it, so agreed,
mostly there's no need to be dismissive.

--
http://members.dodo.com.au/~netocrat
Jan 21 '06 #15
"Keith Thompson" <ks***@mib.org> wrote in message
news:ln************@nuthaus.mib.org...
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote:
[...]
> c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
> discussions.

Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that post
here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?

<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>
Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs - what's NOT clear
about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!

For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


I just wrote a rather lengthy response to this. I've decided not to
post it for now; I may do so later.

pemo, please consider carefully whether you really want to antagonize
most of the readers of this newsgroup. Your attitude and behavior
have already put your further meaningful participation in this
newsgroup in serious doubt. I suspect a number of regulars have
already killfiled you, or will do so as soon as they read your latest
article. If you'll stop for a few minutes and think about it, I think
you'll understand why.

This is really just an honest difference of opinion over how this
newsgroup should be run -- and, frankly, you're not going to win.

Please reconsider your attitude and behavior. You'll find that
verbally abusing people who are trying to be helpful will not benefit
anybody.

--

Keith, please feel free to post the missive that you're holding back!

Secondly, should I really *truly care* if anyone does/doesn't add me to
their 'killfile' [whatever that is: I can guess!] - like, do you or anyone
here think that it's really going to offend -or- upset me in the slightest
if my 'articles' are automagically deleted by some 'clique come quango'
before the members of any subscribing factions 'dain' to read what I might
add, or contribute? Life's too short!

And anyway, what's with this term 'article' ---- oh, please don't post
another 60s/70s/80s etiquette URL! Replies are REPLIES, they're really not
'articles' you know. Um, maybe the usenet (c.l.c) should =relucantly= drag
itself into the 21st century here?

BUT, [deep breath - and I really did that then!] thanks for informing me of
the long sought after and erstwhile 'killfile' term [Q. Ok, how might I
create one of these myself: as I'd like to add certain people to it]?

Fact: I've only been posting here 'recently'. Fact: when I first posted
here, I thanked you for being 'constructive' - and I think you're trying to
be now too?
... and, frankly, you're not going to win


Who says? It's surely a matter of opinon/time - and whose killfile I might
end up in?

I stand by what I've said, although, in 'female speak' it's not a good time
of the month right now! No shag for you then!
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 21 '06 #16

"Netocrat" <ne******@dodo.com.au> wrote in message
news:pa****************************@dodo.com.au...
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 01:49:33 +0000, pemo wrote:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote: [...] I mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here [...] <http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs -


OK, then I'll explain that it's a Jack Klein post from November last year
that's the most balanced explanation I've yet read of the current
topicality norms in c.l.c.
what's NOT clear about comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!


The referenced post answers your question like this: there's nothing
unclear about the computing language, C - there's a single international
standard that defines it.

We'd all much rather discuss the technical than the meta-topical here,
right? So if, after reading that post, you come away thinking "hmm, well,
it makes enough sense" - great, let's get back to it. If you come away
thinking, "yes, but...", well then think it through carefully and post an
article responding to the issues it raises. I doubt that anyone here
*wants* to be seen as authoritarian/unkind - but neither does anyone want
to see their (excellent) technical group overrun with unfocused,
undiluted discussion and lose all expertise. I don't begrudge you having
an opinion on this group's topicality norms - and I haven't even expressed
my own opinion of them - all I've done is point out a long-time
contributor's explanation, so I don't see what you found so offensive for
you to end your post the way you did.
For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's
for homework, well, I'll at least [not simply dismiss it.]


I've noticed several regulars who frequently go beyond the strict
topicality norms when answering off-topic questions but who do so in such
a careful and sensible way that they don't get called on it, so agreed,
mostly there's no need to be dismissive.

--
http://members.dodo.com.au/~netocrat


I refer you to the reply I previously made to the honourable gentelman - or
some such 'Blair Speak'

--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 21 '06 #17
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:dq**********@news.ox.ac.uk...
For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


Pa... lonk!

-Mike
Jan 21 '06 #18

"Mike Wahler" <mk******@mkwahler.net> wrote in message
news:X2***************@newsread3.news.pas.earthlin k.net...
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:dq**********@news.ox.ac.uk...
For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


Pa... lonk!


Right back at ya ... table tennis - love it!

--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce ‘unwanted noise’ on the ‘signal’ ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - ‘not 100% pedantically correct’].
I don’t care too much about that though, and I reckon it’s the
same with most ‘visitors’ here. However, rest assured that any
‘essential’ (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - ‘to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly’].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 21 '06 #19
Flash Gordon wrote:
Default User wrote:

I'll have to start remembering the wiki :)


You could even add to it ;-)

Baby steps. BABY steps.

Brian
Jan 21 '06 #20
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
[...]
Keith, please feel free to post the missive that you're holding back!


Fine, I'll post it as a followup to your previous article.

--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) ks***@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this.
Jan 21 '06 #21
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote: [...]
c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.

Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that post
here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?


<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs - what's NOT clear about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!


Since you can't be bothered to follow a simple URL, here's the
content. It's an article that Jack Klein posted to this newsgroup on
November 20, 2005, in response to a question very similar to yours.
In answer to your question, nothing is unclear about it; you just
don't get it.

] I have no proof, but your question makes me think that you are
] relatively new to usenet.
]
] I've been here for a while, and I've seen good groups destroyed by
] being swamped by off-topic posts.
]
] It was perhaps five or six years ago that comp.lang.c++ was nearly
] destroyed by becoming yet another Visual C++/Windows programming
] group. I know I stopped reading and participating, and quite a few of
] the more knowledgeable regulars disappeared as well. It was only by
] the determined effort of a group of regulars that the group was saved.
]
] Is it really _right_? I think so, and I'll tell you why. Literally
] some of the most knowledgeable experts on C and C++ in the world help
] others on comp.lang.c and comp.lang.c++. That includes, not
] infrequently, members of the language standards committees. There is
] plenty of historical evidence that these are the first to leave when a
] group gets polluted by too much off-topic material.
]
] These groups are far too valuable as resources to be spoiled. For
] every poster who whines that "you can't write a real world program in
] standard C (or C++)", there are many more who realize that you can't
] write any program at all in C or C++ without using standard C or C++,
] and usually far more than you use any extensions or third party
] library.
]
] And as for what the group "should" be about, that's spelled out by the
] name: "comp.lang.c" is nothing but an abbreviation for "computer
] language C". And there is one and only one internationally recognized
] definition of the C programming language, the ANSI/ISO/IEC standard.

Thanks to Netocrat for posting the URL; it confirms something I
mentioned elsewhere in this thread and adds a great deal more detail.
For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


For the record, the only reason you're didn't just land in my killfile
is that I don't use one. I'm sure a lot of other readers here are not
so constrained.

We regulars hang out here because we enjoy discussing C and because we
like to help people. We try to maintain the topical focus of this
newsgroup because we believe it is the best way we can do so. You
are, of course, free to disagree with us. We have explained in
considerable detail just why we think this is the best course, and how
alternatives have failed in the past, but if you think the community
would be better served by turning comp.lang.c into
comp.lang.c.whatever, you have every right to hold that opinion. If
you want to whine and pout because somebody corrected an error you
made, or clarified a statement, or whatever it was, you're free to do
that too.

But when you insult and verbally abuse a group of people who are
simply trying to perform a public service, you cross the line.

Until and unless you change your behavior, I will treat you as I treat
any other troll. I'll post corrections if you post any
misinformation, but I will make no effort to be helpful. And I
suspect most other regulars here simply won't see your posts in the
first place.

It's too bad, because I've seen you post sensible articles here in the
past, but that's not enough reason to put up with your whining and
abuse.

Bye.

--
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) ks***@mib.org <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
San Diego Supercomputer Center <*> <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
We must do something. This is something. Therefore, we must do this.
Jan 21 '06 #22
Kev P. a écrit :
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.


Code::Blocks is the one you want.

http://www.codeblocks.org/

--
A+

Emmanuel Delahaye
Jan 21 '06 #23

Keith Thompson wrote:
"pemo" <us***********@gmail.com> writes:
Randy Howard wrote:
Kev P. wrote

<snip>
Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, a pedant will be along
shortly'].


The fact that factual errors are quickly corrected here is, IMHO, one
of the best features of this newsgroup. I suggest that you *should*
care about correctness, for the sake of the newbies if nothing else.


I find the concept of a programmer who doesn't care about correctness
pretty scary. Let us hope Pemo's programs arn't being used for
anything important.

Given his language and attitude I'm wondering if he's
posting-whilst-drunk
--
Nick Keighley

Jan 21 '06 #24
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 01:49:33 -0000, "pemo" <us***********@gmail.com>
wrote:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote: [...]
c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
discussions.

Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
No. comp.std.c is the place for discussion about the standard itself,
not the language it standardizes.
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that post
here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?


<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs


If you can't be bothered with the answer, why did you ask the
question?
- what's NOT clear about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!
What's not clear about "C is the language defined by the C standard."?

For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if it's for
homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own arse* that I'll
simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.
Then I suggest that you encourage people to email you directly.

================================================= ==============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
Then I assume you will expect to be corrected.
I don't care too much about that though,
Too bad. Be sure to mention this on your next job interview.
and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================= ==============


--
Al Balmer
Sun City, AZ
Jan 23 '06 #25
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 03:35:12 -0000, "pemo" <us***********@gmail.com>
wrote:
Secondly, should I really *truly care* if anyone does/doesn't add me to
their 'killfile' [whatever that is: I can guess!] - like, do you or anyone
here think that it's really going to offend -or- upset me in the slightest
if my 'articles' are automagically deleted by some 'clique come quango'
before the members of any subscribing factions 'dain' to read what I might
add, or contribute? Life's too short!


I'm glad you don't mind, and you have more or less correctly guessed
what a killfile is, so enjoy your stay in mine. So far, you have made
no contributions, and it doesn't look likely that you will. Bye, now.

--
Al Balmer
Sun City, AZ
Jan 23 '06 #26
Al Balmer wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 01:49:33 -0000, "pemo" <us***********@gmail.com>
wrote:
Netocrat wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:26:54 +0000, pemo wrote:
Randy Howard wrote:
[...]
> c.l.c is for discussions of standard C, not platform-specific
> discussions.

Isn't comp.std.c *really* the place for *stanard c* questions: I
No. comp.std.c is the place for discussion about the standard itself,
not the language it standardizes.
mean, come on people, this group is *computing DOT languages DOT c*
- i.e., there's nothing in the name that suggests that a newbie
shouldn't ask *anything* that's even *marginally c-related* here
[apart from from the pedantry of some of some of the folks that
post here]

Q. If you were a 'newbie', and had some C related question, where
would you go and ask on the usenet!! ?

<http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.c/msg/1460ed5b9ad3dae1?hl=en&>


Sorry - can't [be asked] to follow arbitrary URLs


If you can't be bothered with the answer, why did you ask the
question?


!
- what's NOT clear about
comp[uting].lang[uages].c?!


What's not clear about "C is the language defined by the C standard."?

For the record - if one wants to ask *anything* about C, even if
it's for homework, well, I'll at least be not so much *up my own
arse* that I'll simply dismiss it. And fuck you as a PS.


Then I suggest that you encourage people to email you directly.


Some kind people here already have - but not with their homework!

================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].


Then I assume you will expect to be corrected.


Certainly I do, esp. if it's a big blunder. But, other than that, no I
don't really. I.e., to save filtering noise form the signal, I'd rather any
'correction' to be of a non-pedantic nature *and* to do with the main thrust
of what's under discussion. If on the other hand it is on some esoteric
issue that's certainly not going to effect me, well, I'll have just have to
read through it, and sigh I guess.
I don't care too much about that though,


Too bad. Be sure to mention this on your next job interview.


Lucky for me that I don't need one then :-) I've already made my fortune
thanks: and, with only a few grey hairs showing, have since retired to
academia - or whatever it is that might take my fancy - very nice it is too.

But enough of this idle banter, I'm bored with this, as I'm sure everyone
else is.

--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 23 '06 #27
Al Balmer wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 03:35:12 -0000, "pemo" <us***********@gmail.com>
wrote:
Secondly, should I really *truly care* if anyone does/doesn't add me
to their 'killfile' [whatever that is: I can guess!] - like, do you
or anyone here think that it's really going to offend -or- upset me
in the slightest if my 'articles' are automagically deleted by some
'clique come quango' before the members of any subscribing factions
'dain' to read what I might add, or contribute? Life's too short!


I'm glad you don't mind, and you have more or less correctly guessed
what a killfile is, so enjoy your stay in mine. So far, you have made
no contributions, and it doesn't look likely that you will. Bye, now.


Sob, whimper, tears running down my little face - you've broken my heart.

--
================================================== =============
In an attempt to reduce 'unwanted noise' on the 'signal' ...

Disclaimer:

Any comment/code I contribute might =NOT= be 100% portable, nor
semantically correct [read - 'not 100% pedantically correct'].
I don't care too much about that though, and I reckon it's the
same with most 'visitors' here. However, rest assured that any
'essential' (?) corrections WILL almost certainly appear v.soon
[read - 'to add noise as they see fit, *a pedant* will be along
shortly'].

WARNINGS: Always read the label. No beside-the-point minutiae
filter supplied. Keep away from children. Do not ignite.
================================================== =============
Jan 23 '06 #28
On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 21:01:54 -0000, in comp.lang.c , "pemo"
<us***********@gmail.com> wrote:
Al Balmer wrote:
On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 03:35:12 -0000, "pemo" <us***********@gmail.com>
wrote:
Secondly, should I really *truly care* if anyone does/doesn't add me
to their 'killfile'


I'm glad you don't mind, and you have more or less correctly guessed
what a killfile is, so enjoy your stay in mine.


Sob, whimper, tears running down my little face - you've broken my heart.


If you plan getting any useful information out of a class, its not
wise persuade the teachers to ignore your questions. The same rule
operates in CLC.

Mark McIntyre
--
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
by definition, not smart enough to debug it."
--Brian Kernighan

----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----
Jan 23 '06 #29
Kev P. wrote:
Hi, I need to do some simple C programming.
I have a really OLD version of Borland Turbo C,
or fairly old Borland C++ v5.0.

However, I expect there is now something free (& better) available
online.

Can anyone recommend something.

I'm just a C dabbler, not relly up on C++

TIA, Niv

MS Visual Studio 2005 Express is free. I think you need to also
download the 'Platform SDK' to be able to use the win32 API. It seems
to be a usable IDE, except for the missing profiler.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/vstudio/ex...C/default.aspx
Jan 24 '06 #30

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