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I have taken a class for C and a class for C++, yet when I read through
some code, I am seriously lacking. I have tried to read countless
tutorial from numerous different sites and I even read my books, but
there is something missing. I need some guidance. The tutorials
aren't enough. I could use someone who could help me by letting me
know WHICH tutorials to read and giving me tasks to complete.

Anyone?

Nov 14 '05 #1
24 1298

"iamedd" <of****@iamedd.com> wrote in message
news:11********************@z14g2000cwz.googlegrou ps.com...
I have taken a class for C and a class for C++, yet when I read through
some code, I am seriously lacking. I have tried to read countless
tutorial from numerous different sites and I even read my books, but
there is something missing. I need some guidance. The tutorials
aren't enough. I could use someone who could help me by letting me
know WHICH tutorials to read and giving me tasks to complete.

Anyone?


Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.

Nov 14 '05 #2
iamedd wrote on 28/12/04 :
I have taken a class for C and a class for C++, yet when I read through
some code, I am seriously lacking. I have tried to read countless
tutorial from numerous different sites and I even read my books, but
there is something missing. I need some guidance. The tutorials
aren't enough. I could use someone who could help me by letting me
know WHICH tutorials to read and giving me tasks to complete.


Obviously, you need practice. Have you done the execrices of the K&R ?

--
Emmanuel
The C-FAQ: http://www.eskimo.com/~scs/C-faq/faq.html
The C-library: http://www.dinkumware.com/refxc.html

"Clearly your code does not meet the original spec."
"You are sentenced to 30 lashes with a wet noodle."
-- Jerry Coffin in a.l.c.c++

Nov 14 '05 #3
I can do the exercises, but then how will I know how well I've done?

Nov 14 '05 #4
I can do the exercises, but then how will I know how well I've done?

Nov 14 '05 #5
"iamedd" <of****@iamedd.com> wrote in message
news:11**********************@f14g2000cwb.googlegr oups.com...
I can do the exercises, but then how will I know how well I've done?


Post the exercises and your solutions, and ask for
comments and criticism.

-Mike
Nov 14 '05 #6
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?
Nov 14 '05 #7

infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?


Better ideas?

Nov 14 '05 #8
"iamedd" <of****@iamedd.com> writes:
infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:
>
> Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start > yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.
>
> 1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.
>
> 2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.
>
> 3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?


Better ideas?


Write code to work with characters in the execution character
set?
--
"Am I missing something?"
--Dan Pop
Nov 14 '05 #9
iamedd wrote:
infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:
Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens.
Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?

Better ideas?


1. Write a program to count characters in a text.

2. Write a program to count words in a text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a text.

See what I mean?
Nov 14 '05 #10
On 28 Dec 2004 09:58:27 -0800
"iamedd" <of****@iamedd.com> wrote:
infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what
happens. Start yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from
there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?


Better ideas?


Text. It matters not what encoding is used. In fact, doing it properly
for ASCII is harder because the system might not use ASCII so you can't
use library functions such as isspace.
--
Flash Gordon
Living in interesting times.
Although my email address says spam, it is real and I read it.
Nov 14 '05 #11

infobahn wrote:
iamedd wrote:
infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens.

Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from

there.
1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.

Why drag ASCII into it?

Better ideas?


1. Write a program to count characters in a text.

2. Write a program to count words in a text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a text.

See what I mean?

Should that be three seperate programs or one combined?

Nov 14 '05 #12

infobahn wrote:
iamedd wrote:
infobahn wrote:
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens.

Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from

there.
1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.

Why drag ASCII into it?

Better ideas?


1. Write a program to count characters in a text.

2. Write a program to count words in a text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a text.

See what I mean?

Should that be three seperate programs or one combined?

Nov 14 '05 #13
iamedd wrote:
infobahn wrote:
iamedd wrote:
infobahn wrote:

Why drag ASCII into it?

Better ideas?


1. Write a program to count characters in a text.

2. Write a program to count words in a text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a text.

See what I mean?


Should that be three seperate programs or one combined?


Personally, I think the student should decide, since it'll be
good exercise.

Just for reference, the unix utility, wc, combines all three
facilities in a single program.
Nov 14 '05 #14
Hi iamedd,

When you say "read", it makes me think you're just trying to know what
the program does, rather than _why_ it does what it does. I think you
should change your attitude with learning. Typically what I find with
students entering college (in general, of course) is they don't know
how to learn correctly. Learning is a skill that requires practice!
Rather than just knowing what something does, ask yourself questions.
If you do this, you will certainly learn it correctly, and learning it
correctly the first time is certainly an advantage by itself. Good
luck.

-Adam Roan

Nov 14 '05 #15

"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?


To keep it simple.
Nov 14 '05 #16

"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@titan.btinternet.com...
<snip>
Just for reference, the unix utility, wc, combines all three
facilities in a single program.


Where do you think i got the idea? Besides, it's a nice and easy way for the
OP to validate his/her work.
Nov 14 '05 #17
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:
"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...
dandelion wrote:

Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start
yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.

1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.

2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.

3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.


Why drag ASCII into it?


To keep it simple.


You do realise that by requiring ASCII, rather than the text
representation natural to the underlying system, you've actually made
the problem a lot less simple, don't you?

Richard
Nov 14 '05 #18

"Richard Bos" <rl*@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote in message
news:41****************@news.individual.net...
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:
"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...
dandelion wrote:
>
> Don't *read* code. Write it, test it, change it and C what happens. Start > yourself up with sime relatively easy task and progress from there.
>
> 1. Write a program to count characters in a ASCII text.
>
> 2. Write a program to count words in a ASCII text.
>
> 3. Write a program to count lines in a ASCII text.

Why drag ASCII into it?


To keep it simple.


You do realise that by requiring ASCII, rather than the text
representation natural to the underlying system, you've actually made
the problem a lot less simple, don't you?


Yes.. Although i find 'a lot less' something of an exaggeration.

However, the assignment calls for comparisons of only a limited number of
values to check (spaces, newlines) and i'm not asking for character
conversion. I put in ASCII (7 bit) to prevent the student to take the easy
route and use 'isspace()', 'isprint()' and such. First write one yourself.
Should not be that hard, especially when restricted to only 128 symbols.

Besides, many encoding schemes (notably UTF-8 and ISO) have ASCII as a
subset and for UTF-16/UCS-2 (where you have to wonder about endianness) it's
the same.
Nov 14 '05 #19
dandelion wrote:
"Richard Bos" <rl*@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote in message
news:41****************@news.individual.net...
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:

"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...

Why drag ASCII into it?

To keep it simple.
You do realise that by requiring ASCII, rather than the text
representation natural to the underlying system, you've actually made
the problem a lot less simple, don't you?

Yes.. Although i find 'a lot less' something of an exaggeration.


I'd be interested to see your solution, then. :-)

However, the assignment calls for comparisons of only a limited number of
values to check (spaces, newlines) and i'm not asking for character
conversion. I put in ASCII (7 bit) to prevent the student to take the easy
route and use 'isspace()', 'isprint()' and such. First write one yourself.
Should not be that hard, especially when restricted to only 128 symbols.

Besides, many encoding schemes (notably UTF-8 and ISO) have ASCII as a
subset and for UTF-16/UCS-2 (where you have to wonder about endianness) it's
the same.


But some character sets (notably EBCDIC) do not have ASCII as a subset.
So, to write the program(s) you suggest in full generality, you would
have to hard-code ASCII codes into the program, at the very least.

Also, on a note unrelated to ASCII, you failed to define "word". Not
a terrible omission, since it will cause the OP to think hard about
what is meant by the word "word" - an excellent exercise in itself. :-)
Nov 14 '05 #20

"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@hercules.btinternet.com...
dandelion wrote:
"Richard Bos" <rl*@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote in message
news:41****************@news.individual.net...
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:
"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...

>Why drag ASCII into it?

To keep it simple.

You do realise that by requiring ASCII, rather than the text
representation natural to the underlying system, you've actually made
the problem a lot less simple, don't you?

Yes.. Although i find 'a lot less' something of an exaggeration.


I'd be interested to see your solution, then. :-)


When I have time.

<snip>
Besides, many encoding schemes (notably UTF-8 and ISO) have ASCII as a
subset and for UTF-16/UCS-2 (where you have to wonder about endianness) it's the same.


But some character sets (notably EBCDIC) do not have ASCII as a subset.


I don't assume the OP is using EBDIC. I may be wrong, but sofar, i've seen
no indication
this may be the case. You'd have to dig for some pretty outdated hard and
software
AFAIK.
So, to write the program(s) you suggest in full generality, you would
have to hard-code ASCII codes into the program, at the very least.
No. It suffices to hardcode '\n', '\r' '\t' and ' '. I'd be satified if the
OP
includes those and impressed if (s)he includes code for 'non-printable'
characters and interpunction characters. Besides, ASCII-tables are a
dime a dozen.
Also, on a note unrelated to ASCII, you failed to define "word".
On purpose.
Not a terrible omission, since it will cause the OP to think hard about
what is meant by the word "word" - an excellent exercise in itself. :-)


That's the idea. I'm glad you agree.
Nov 14 '05 #21
dandelion wrote:
"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@hercules.btinternet.com...

But some character sets (notably EBCDIC) do not have ASCII as a subset.

I don't assume the OP is using EBDIC.


EBCDIC. Neither do I assume it. But I don't assume he's using ASCII
or a superset thereof, either.

I may be wrong, but sofar, i've seen
no indication
this may be the case. You'd have to dig for some pretty outdated hard and
software
AFAIK.
Well, not really. IBM mainframes, which are far from outdated, typically
use EBCDIC.

So, to write the program(s) you suggest in full generality, you would
have to hard-code ASCII codes into the program, at the very least.

No.


Er, yes, actually.
It suffices to hardcode '\n', '\r' '\t' and ' '.


Indeed. See?
Also, on a note unrelated to ASCII, you failed to define "word".

On purpose.


Fair enough.
Nov 14 '05 #22

"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@hercules.btinternet.com...

<snip>
I don't assume the OP is using EBDIC.
EBCDIC.


Of course. Pray forgive a typo.
Neither do I assume it. But I don't assume he's using ASCII
or a superset thereof, either.


I'd place a (modest) bet on that. That includes the ISO encodings,
so chances are (s)he does.
I may be wrong, but sofar, i've seen
no indication
this may be the case. You'd have to dig for some pretty outdated hard and
software
AFAIK.


Well, not really. IBM mainframes, which are far from outdated, typically
use EBCDIC.


Hmmm...

Somehow I do not find the image of the OP using an IBM mainframe very
convincing...
So, to write the program(s) you suggest in full generality, you would
have to hard-code ASCII codes into the program, at the very least.

No.


Er, yes, actually.
> It suffices to hardcode '\n', '\r' '\t' and ' '.


Indeed. See?


I misread thinking you required a full charset to be implemented.

Nov 14 '05 #23
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:
"Richard Bos" <rl*@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote in message
news:41****************@news.individual.net...
"dandelion" <da*******@meadow.net> wrote:
"infobahn" <in******@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:cq**********@sparta.btinternet.com...
> Why drag ASCII into it?

To keep it simple.
You do realise that by requiring ASCII, rather than the text
representation natural to the underlying system, you've actually made
the problem a lot less simple, don't you?


Yes.. Although i find 'a lot less' something of an exaggeration.

However, the assignment calls for comparisons of only a limited number of
values to check (spaces, newlines) and i'm not asking for character
conversion. I put in ASCII (7 bit) to prevent the student to take the easy
route and use 'isspace()', 'isprint()' and such.


Ah - so instead of learning to do the Right Thing, and use the functions
provided in <ctype.h> by every conforming implementation, you suggest
that students get learn to write their own, most likely non-portable,
inefficient replacements. I fail to see why this is advisable.
First write one yourself.
Should not be that hard, especially when restricted to only 128 symbols.
No char type is restriced to 128 symbols.
Besides, many encoding schemes (notably UTF-8 and ISO) have ASCII as a
subset and for UTF-16/UCS-2 (where you have to wonder about endianness) it's
the same.


And some do not.

Richard
Nov 14 '05 #24

"Richard Bos" <rl*@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl> wrote in message

<snip>
Ah - so instead of learning to do the Right Thing, and use the functions
provided in <ctype.h> by every conforming implementation, you suggest
that students get learn to write their own, most likely non-portable,
inefficient replacements. I fail to see why this is advisable.


It is good practice to implement some of the easier stuff yourself.
Electronics engineers in training start with resistors, capacitors and
transistors instead of complete IC's, latin students start with little,
simple sentences instead of Tacitus Historiae or Annales. Afterwards you can
point out the problems, inefficiencies and non-portabilities. But first let
them have a try at it themselves and see how they do.

Portability is a concept, i would introduce at a later stage. First learn to
do the basics, then worry about all kinds of other issues. Do not drown the
student in detail. Besides, i'd,let the student develop an idea of "The
Right Thing" of his/her own, instead of preaching it as a dogma. The RIght
Thing, after all, is something that flows from the practicalities of
programming, it's not something ordained by Ye Gods of Programming.
First write one yourself.
Should not be that hard, especially when restricted to only 128 symbols.


No char type is restriced to 128 symbols.


Not the char type. 7 bit ASCII.
Besides, many encoding schemes (notably UTF-8 and ISO) have ASCII as a
subset and for UTF-16/UCS-2 (where you have to wonder about endianness) it's the same.


And some do not.


True.
Nov 14 '05 #25

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