Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers.
-- Ari Winokur
ari_winokur at comcast dot net
40  2097 
"Ari W." <ar*********@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:64**************************@posting.google.c om... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers.
I don't think C++ is a suitable language for throwing together small
programs. Its a difficult language to master and unless you are prepared to
study hard and use it a lot its not going to repay any investment you make.
VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do. Perhaps
even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
don't know much about those.
Everyone learns in a different way, so if course ain't your thing then maybe
you need a good book and some self study. Tools (e.g. compilers) for many
languages are free. And of course the internet is a great resource for
reference and specific problems, just don't expect to learn a language from
a web site.
John
"Ari W." <ar*********@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:64**************************@posting.google.c om... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers.
See my reply to this same question you posted to
'alt.comp.lang.learn.c-c++.
Also, if you want to post the same message to more than
one group, don't post them separately, crosspost them.
(Look this stuff up if you don't understand what I mean).
-Mike
Ari W. wrote: Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers. http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys/learningcpp.htm
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
In article <2t*************@uni-berlin.de>, jo*************@hotmail.com
says... VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do. Perhaps
even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
don't know much about those.
It all depends on the available documentation and environment.
If compatibility is not an issue, I would doubtless recommend Ruby. But
then he would possibly need the appropriate book at hand (Programming
Ruby by Thomas/Hunt avail. from AW). But online docu is also available.
Ruby is IMHO the most object-oriented scripting language and therefore a
good preparation for C++.
Also, it is very easy to read, which should help.
Michael B.
Michael Bruschkewitz wrote: It all depends on the available documentation and environment.
If compatibility is not an issue, I would doubtless recommend Ruby.
Right. He should let C++ to get on... Ruby.
But
then he would possibly need the appropriate book at hand (Programming
Ruby by Thomas/Hunt avail. from AW). But online docu is also available.
Ruby is IMHO the most object-oriented scripting language and therefore a
good preparation for C++.
Also, it is very easy to read, which should help.
Thank you for sharing your insight with us.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
John Harrison wrote: I don't think C++ is a suitable language for throwing together small
programs.
Here we go again.
Its a difficult language to master and unless you are prepared to
study hard and use it a lot its not going to repay any investment you make.
VB, C# and Java all sound more suitable for what you want to do.
I think someone must tell you that you are telling crap. I know it
sounds harsh, but someone had to tell you the truth some day.
Perhaps
even better would be scripting languages such as Python and Ruby, but I
don't know much about those.
Everyone learns in a different way, so if course ain't your thing then maybe
you need a good book and some self study. Tools (e.g. compilers) for many
languages are free. And of course the internet is a great resource for
reference and specific problems, just don't expect to learn a language from
a web site.
Stop trolling.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
>
Stop trolling.
Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.
john
John Harrison wrote: Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.
One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
That is trolling.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098355011.539867@athnrd02... John Harrison wrote:
Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.
One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
That is trolling.
From the OP's original post
This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful.
I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be wrong
but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so personally.
john
Ioannis Vranos wrote: Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.
One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
That is trolling.
Ioannis, please come down off that cross. We need to use the wood.
Many newbies think C++ is the first language they should learn. Disagreeing
with you is not trolling, and calling your fellow regulars "idiots" lowers
your image here.
--
Phlip http://industrialxp.org/community/bi...UserInterfaces
John Harrison wrote: I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be wrong
but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so personally.
I am not sure if you want to understand.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098356520.551872@athnrd02... John Harrison wrote:
I just didn't think that C++ was the best for him, I could easily be
wrong but I was just offering my opinion. Not sure why you took it so
personally.
I am not sure if you want to understand.
Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.
John
John Harrison wrote: I am not sure if you want to understand.
Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.
Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
"managed extensions")?
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
Ioannis Vranos wrote: Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
"managed extensions")?
"They are _all_ better, because C++ sucks."
Is that what you want to hear?
No post should say that this or that is "better". Posts should say, "have
you considered Brand X."
We are not here to blindly promote C++. We are not marketeers for C++ Inc.
We are here to help recover our industry from the horribly sucky state of
its art. We do this by raising newbies' awareness of options. There is no
reason not to promote other languages on this newsgroup. If they "win", then
C++ wins too.
--
Phlip http://industrialxp.org/community/bi...UserInterfaces
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098360539.328523@athnrd02... John Harrison wrote:
I am not sure if you want to understand.
Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.
Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
"managed extensions")?
I never claimed that they were, I don't think that they are. For myself I
far prefer C++ to any other language mentioned in this thread. But I do
think that a language that is good for one purpose or one person may not be
so good for another purpose or another person. And this is for the
completely banal reason that people and languages have different strengths
and weaknesses.
If this is just going to be a 'my language is better than your language'
argument then I'm not interested. For a moment I thought you were going to
take the discussion in a much more interesting direction.
john
Phlip wrote: "They are _all_ better, because C++ sucks."
Is that what you want to hear?
No post should say that this or that is "better". Posts should say, "have
you considered Brand X."
We are not here to blindly promote C++. We are not marketeers for C++ Inc.
We are here to help recover our industry from the horribly sucky state of
its art. We do this by raising newbies' awareness of options. There is no
reason not to promote other languages on this newsgroup. If they "win", then
C++ wins too.
In any case, I asked him to support his assertion that VB and C#/CLI are
better for newcomers. I guess you have no problem with that. :-)
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
Ioannis Vranos wrote: In any case, I asked him to support his assertion that VB and C#/CLI are
better for newcomers. I guess you have no problem with that. :-)
For newbies and veterans alike, my permanent, professional opinion is:
C# and VB both suck wet farts out of dead seagulls.
But I'm not trolling!
--
Phlip http://industrialxp.org/community/bi...UserInterfaces
John Harrison wrote: I never claimed that they were, I don't think that they are. For myself I
far prefer C++ to any other language mentioned in this thread. But I do
think that a language that is good for one purpose or one person may not be
so good for another purpose or another person. And this is for the
completely banal reason that people and languages have different strengths
and weaknesses.
If this is just going to be a 'my language is better than your language'
argument then I'm not interested. For a moment I thought you were going to
take the discussion in a much more interesting direction.
I am talking about easiness for newcomers. VB and C#/CLI are CLI
specific so they don't provide any more features than CLI provides.
Actually C++/CLI provides more CLI features than these, like more
generics features.
What do you think of
String s="Text";
or String s("Text");
that is System::String objects with stack semantics and deterministic
destruction?
Isn't it far easier for beginners than the rest CLI languages where the
only option is using operator new?
C++ can do both stack semantics and managed heap semantics.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098360539.328523@athnrd02... John Harrison wrote:
I am not sure if you want to understand.
Hmm, try me. I promise no hard feelings, I'm just interested.
Lets see. Tell me why VB and C#/CLI are better than C++ (C++/CLI or even
"managed extensions")?
--
Ioannis Vranos
http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
They are better for "newbies" because you can throw a simple program
together in 10 minutes that would take (me - the newbie) 10 hours to do in
C++... Mainly because VB (dunno about C#) has alot more helpful
documentation than C++.
BUT when you learn the C++ language I'm sure you could do stuff in 10
minutes (more hardware/low-level/file stuff) than you could in VB because
you'd need to find out more info and type more to do the same.
--
=========
Comp Whizz
=========
(The C++ beginner)
Computer Whizz wrote: They are better for "newbies" because you can throw a simple program
together in 10 minutes that would take (me - the newbie) 10 hours to do in
C++... Mainly because VB (dunno about C#) has alot more helpful
documentation than C++.
BUT when you learn the C++ language I'm sure you could do stuff in 10
minutes (more hardware/low-level/file stuff) than you could in VB because
you'd need to find out more info and type more to do the same.
I have tried very hard in VB, for years, and I remain more productive (and
more robust) in C++. _Especially_ when I do high-level GUI work - the things
VB was allegedly designed for.
C++ with /Accelerated C++/, and mentoring, is a mostly harmless learner
language. But I can't recommend it online, because I don't know if the
reader has the book and the mentor.
--
Phlip http://industrialxp.org/community/bi...UserInterfaces
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098355011.539867@athnrd02... John Harrison wrote:
Just because you disagree with my opinions doesn't mean I was trolling.
One person asked how he can start learning C++ in comp.lang.c++, and
instead of providing some information on this you tell him to move to
C#, VB and Java (and 2 other idiots to Ruby).
That is trolling.
No, it's not. It's an attempt to help. Look up the definition
of trolling.
Anyway, to the point: context is important. If you'll read
the *entire* message from the OP, you should realize that
John's advice was appropriate. Of course OP should read
all the replies and make his own decisions.
-Mike
Mike Wahler wrote: Anyway, to the point: context is important. If you'll read
the *entire* message from the OP, you should realize that
John's advice was appropriate.
Not it wasn't. Consider me if I was sticking around in Java newsgroups,
and when someone asked for some book of Java to begin with, or some
compiler, to tell him to move to C++.
Or in Ruby newsgroups, VB, etc. This behaviour is not appropriate.
If someone asked what language he should consider, then such answers
would be valid. Otherwise it is trolling, or in other words impolite.
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys ar*********@comcast.net (Ari W.) writes: Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers.
-- Ari Winokur
I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
for awhile.
2. DO NOT buy the book "The C++ Standard Library: A Tutorial and Reference"
by Nicolai M. Josuttis. I feel that my $65 was almost completely wasted on
this book, even though it is given a "highly recommended" rating in the
FAQ for this group.
--
% Randy Yates % "She's sweet on Wagner-I think she'd die for Beethoven.
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % She love the way Puccini lays down a tune, and
%%% 919-577-9882 % Verdi's always creepin' from her room."
%%%% <ya***@ieee.org> % "Rockaria", *A New World Record*, ELO http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr
I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
for awhile.
Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because I've
never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
So, I'm interested, what was it that you liked about this book?
2. DO NOT buy the book "The C++ Standard Library: A Tutorial and
Reference" by Nicolai M. Josuttis. I feel that my $65 was almost completely wasted on
this book, even though it is given a "highly recommended" rating in the
FAQ for this group.
What was it that you didn't like about this? When I first bought it I though
it contained very little that I couldn't get elsewhere and that it was
somewhat repetitious. But since then I've found I do refer to it quite
often.
john
Randy Yates wrote:
I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
for awhile.
2. DO NOT buy the book "The C++ Standard Library: A Tutorial and Reference"
by Nicolai M. Josuttis. I feel that my $65 was almost completely wasted on
this book, even though it is given a "highly recommended" rating in the
FAQ for this group.
You suggestions reflect your performance in this group :-)
Ari:
Shildt's book have a bad reputation
Randy is right in not suggesting Josuttis book *now*. It surely
is way over the head for a newbie. However when you have come to
speed in C++, it is defenitly a recommended buy.
--
Karl Heinz Buchegger kb******@gascad.at
Randy Yates wrote: I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt.
Perhaps you mean by Jesse Liberty?
--
Ioannis Vranos http://www23.brinkster.com/noicys
John Harrison wrote: Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because
I've never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
I went into a VONS (a regional supermarket chain), and by the entrance was a
table of old books, to be sold for a couple bucks each for charity. Before
avoiding the Danielle Steel covers and going shopping, I noticed /Advanced
C/ by HS.
I was absolutely tickled, because it contained chapters from my second C
book ever. I immediately looked up "recursive descent parser", and there it
was, the same friendly and comprehensible verbiage, and the same lean but
terse code. No spaces between operators and variables, the latter usually of
a single letter. You gotta respect the patience to write the same
explanation of recursion, over and over again, in different ways, to make
sure that all the readers "get" it.
HS's bad reputation comes from declaring a technical accuracy he's incapable
of defining, and from refusing to publish "errata" and such. If you don't
treat him like a thought leader or guru, and shelve him with the "Unleashed
Dummies in 21 Days" books, he can't affect you. Much.
--
Phlip http://industrialxp.org/community/bi...UserInterfaces ar*********@comcast.net (Ari W.) wrote in message news:<64**************************@posting.google. com>... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++. I am
hoping nobody tells me to take courses. I am still in college and
tried taking courses but found that all the details about pseudocode
and other programming basics drove me insane. I think after taking
that course and from general knowledge I have picked up I am pretty
familiar with the way programs are built on a basic level at least. I
am not looking to make a career of programming, I simply want
familiarity with such languages as C++ because it can help in many IT
jobs to be able to throw together small programs. This is why I am
also interested in VB and curious about any other languages that can
be useful. Thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this and
I hope I get some answers.
-- Ari Winokur
ari_winokur at comcast dot net
Stuart Gerchick,
I am going to recommend a number of useful books to start with that
will give you a good perspective
1) Accelerated C++ by Koeing and Moo. This book starts with high
level STL code to get you moving fast and build apps quickly, without
learning the details till later
2) Essential C++ by Stanley B. Lippman a good starting book
3) C++ primer by Stanley B. Lippman - a 1000+ page book. However, it
will
take you from basic stuff to very advanced topics.
Searching the internet is fine. but you need a good book to get a
clear consistent view of c++ programming
"Ioannis Vranos" <iv*@guesswh.at.grad.com> wrote in message
news:1098428312.171512@athnrd02... Mike Wahler wrote:
Anyway, to the point: context is important. If you'll read
the *entire* message from the OP, you should realize that
John's advice was appropriate.
Not it wasn't. Consider me if I was sticking around in Java newsgroups,
and when someone asked for some book of Java to begin with, or some
compiler, to tell him to move to C++.
Then you'd be advising the OP to move to a more complex language.
John did the inverse. Note again OP's *entire* message.
Or in Ruby newsgroups, VB, etc. This behaviour is not appropriate.
If someone asked what language he should consider, then such answers
would be valid. Otherwise it is trolling, or in other words impolite.
Please look up definition of trolling.
-Mike
Karl Heinz Buchegger <kb******@gascad.at> writes: Randy Yates wrote:
I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
for awhile.
2. DO NOT buy the book "The C++ Standard Library: A Tutorial and Reference"
by Nicolai M. Josuttis. I feel that my $65 was almost completely wasted on
this book, even though it is given a "highly recommended" rating in the
FAQ for this group.
You suggestions reflect your performance in this group :-)
When did you get appointed Head Bottlewasher of comp.lang.c++?
Ari:
Shildt's book have a bad reputation
Randy is right in not suggesting Josuttis book *now*. It surely
is way over the head for a newbie. However when you have come to
speed in C++, it is defenitly a recommended buy.
Ari, my recommendations stand.
--
Randy Yates
Sony Ericsson Mobile Communications
Research Triangle Park, NC, USA ra*********@sonyericsson.com, 919-472-1124
"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> writes:
I have two suggestions:
1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
for awhile.
Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because I've
never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
So, I'm interested, what was it that you liked about this book?
Why would it matter? It sounds to me like you've made up your mind. 2. DO NOT buy the book "The C++ Standard Library: A Tutorial and
Reference" by Nicolai M. Josuttis. I feel that my $65 was almost completely wasted on
this book, even though it is given a "highly recommended" rating in the
FAQ for this group.
What was it that you didn't like about this? When I first bought it I though
it contained very little that I couldn't get elsewhere and that it was
somewhat repetitious. But since then I've found I do refer to it quite
often.
Good for you.
--
Randy Yates
Sony Ericsson Mobile Communications
Research Triangle Park, NC, USA ra*********@sonyericsson.com, 919-472-1124
>> > 1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it > is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
> serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
> for awhile.
Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because
I've
never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
So, I'm interested, what was it that you liked about this book?
Why would it matter? It sounds to me like you've made up your mind.
Not at all, I'm always wanting to hear contrary opinions.
I've read many revues of his books and they seem to come from a rather
narrow point of view. He's obviously doing something right or his books
wouldn't be so popular. Never having actually read any of them myself I'm
genuinely interested in hearing from someone who has and who got a lot of
benefit from it.
john ar*********@comcast.net (Ari W.) wrote in message news:<64**************************@posting.google. com>... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++.
[snip]
"Accelerated C++" by Koenig and Moo. Learn it the right way first.
Then, if you are going to be doing work in it, pick up some of the
other standards and learn more of the language in more detail.
Socks
"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> writes: > 1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think it
> is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
> serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
> for awhile.
Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because
I've
never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
So, I'm interested, what was it that you liked about this book?
Why would it matter? It sounds to me like you've made up your mind.
Not at all, I'm always wanting to hear contrary opinions.
I've read many revues of his books and they seem to come from a rather
narrow point of view. He's obviously doing something right or his books
wouldn't be so popular. Never having actually read any of them myself I'm
genuinely interested in hearing from someone who has and who got a lot of
benefit from it.
john
Ok, John, I'll take you at your word.
What I like best about his book is the abundance of examples. In many
cases, the general syntax is presented, followed by an example of the
syntax and its usage within a small program.
His writing style is simple and concepts are presented in small
"chunks" using plain English with no attempt at sounding
"erudite". Sometimes this gets in the way since you might have to read
through a lot of text before finding what you're after, but generally
I'd rather have it this way than overly terse and academic.
Finally, I think his coverage is good. The basics are provided
(classes, constructors, destructors, etc.), but so are some
not-so-basic items such as friend functions, multiple-inheritance,
virtual base classes, pure virtual functions, and templates.
My $0.02.
It may be relevent to note that my version of the book is copyright
1994 and I took this class in 1996.
--
% Randy Yates % "So now it's getting late,
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % and those who hesitate
%%% 919-577-9882 % got no one..."
%%%% <ya***@ieee.org> % 'Waterfall', *Face The Music*, ELO http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr
"Randy Yates" <ya***@ieee.org> wrote in message
news:wt**********@ieee.org... "John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> writes:
> 1. DO buy the book "Teach Yourself C++" by Herbert Schildt. I think
> it
> is not only an excellent introduction to the language, but will
> serve as a reference for refreshing concepts when one has been away
> for awhile.
Schildt has an appaling reputation. I can't say if its deserved because
I've
never read any of his books. I have however seen some of the howlers
contained in some of his books.
So, I'm interested, what was it that you liked about this book?
Why would it matter? It sounds to me like you've made up your mind.
Not at all, I'm always wanting to hear contrary opinions.
I've read many revues of his books and they seem to come from a rather
narrow point of view. He's obviously doing something right or his books
wouldn't be so popular. Never having actually read any of them myself I'm
genuinely interested in hearing from someone who has and who got a lot of
benefit from it.
john
Ok, John, I'll take you at your word.
What I like best about his book is the abundance of examples. In many
cases, the general syntax is presented, followed by an example of the
syntax and its usage within a small program.
His writing style is simple and concepts are presented in small
"chunks" using plain English with no attempt at sounding
"erudite". Sometimes this gets in the way since you might have to read
through a lot of text before finding what you're after, but generally
I'd rather have it this way than overly terse and academic.
Finally, I think his coverage is good. The basics are provided
(classes, constructors, destructors, etc.), but so are some
not-so-basic items such as friend functions, multiple-inheritance,
virtual base classes, pure virtual functions, and templates.
My $0.02.
Well you're a brave man for sticking up for Schildt on comp.lang.c++. But
even his critics praise his style which you obviously found helpful. Most of
the criticism he gets is over his technical accuracy and I've seen examples
which have genuinely made me wonder how well he understands C++. It's a pity
he can't combine accuracy and style, I'm sure that would be possible without
sacrificing any clarity.
But I think accuracy is not the most important thing in a beginners book,
the most important thing it to get the beginner engaged in the process of
programming. Most people learn by doing and only need a nudge or two when
they get stuck or to introduce a new topic. Having taught programming myself
I know that the most important part of the lesson is where I shut up and let
the pupils get on with it. As you say, trying to be erudite is going to turn
off 90% of beginners.
One day I'll have to pick up one of his books and make my own mind up.
John
John Harrison wrote: Well you're a brave man for sticking up for Schildt on comp.lang.c++. But
even his critics praise his style which you obviously found helpful. Most
of the criticism he gets is over his technical accuracy and I've seen
examples which have genuinely made me wonder how well he understands C++.
It's a pity he can't combine accuracy and style, I'm sure that would be
possible without sacrificing any clarity.
I take my firsts steps in pre-standard C++ with a spanish edition of a
Schildt book, "C++ Guía de autoenseñanza", and I think my brain was not
irreparably damaged ;) I think it was a very good introductory book, and I
don't think that complete accuracy is fundamental in that level.
--
Salu2
"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> writes: [...]
Most of the criticism he gets is over his technical accuracy
and I've seen examples which have genuinely made me wonder how well
he understands C++.
Is there an example of an inaccuracy in this particular book/edition that
I could take a look at? I'm curious what sorts of errors he makes.
It's a pity he can't combine accuracy and style, I'm sure that would
be possible without sacrificing any clarity.
Sure seems so to me.
One day I'll have to pick up one of his books and make my own mind up.
As should always be the case.
--
% Randy Yates % "...the answer lies within your soul
%% Fuquay-Varina, NC % 'cause no one knows which side
%%% 919-577-9882 % the coin will fall."
%%%% <ya***@ieee.org> % 'Big Wheels', *Out of the Blue*, ELO http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr pu*********@hotmail.com wrote in message news:<c7**************************@posting.google. com>... ar*********@comcast.net (Ari W.) wrote in message news:<64**************************@posting.google. com>... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++.
[snip]
"Accelerated C++" by Koenig and Moo. Learn it the right way first.
Then, if you are going to be doing work in it, pick up some of the
other standards and learn more of the language in more detail.
Socks
Exacly. Accelerated C++ is the way to go and will have you off and
going quickly. It will also be the start of a good programming
library http://giuciao.altervista.org/free_b...ml#Programming sg*******@bloomberg.net (Stuart Gerchick) wrote in message news:<e2**************************@posting.google. com>... pu*********@hotmail.com wrote in message news:<c7**************************@posting.google. com>... ar*********@comcast.net (Ari W.) wrote in message news:<64**************************@posting.google. com>... Does anybody here have any input on how to start learning C++.
[snip]
"Accelerated C++" by Koenig and Moo. Learn it the right way first.
Then, if you are going to be doing work in it, pick up some of the
other standards and learn more of the language in more detail.
Socks
Exacly. Accelerated C++ is the way to go and will have you off and
going quickly. It will also be the start of a good programming
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