C going to C++

[Kevin Torr]

I've been using C for some time now and I would like to take my first leap
into C++. I should warn you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and help->about menus.
Inside the box will be an input field where you type in your number, and a
button that says 'Go'.
Under that will be another text field which will give you 2* what you typed
previously if it's a number, otherwise it pops up with an error box saying
"Please enter only integers and decimals into the box".

So this is what I have done so far:
Created a new "Win32 application" project called "thetest".
I then create a new "C++ Source File" called "thesource" and add it to the
workspace "thetest".
I go up to 'insert -> resource -> menu' and create the menu
I save the resource as 'menu.rc' and 'menu.rc' to the 'Resource Files'
folder in the 'File View'

This is about as far as I can get without a tutorial or instructions to get
me further.
I'm not sure how to access the resources I have included to the project from
the C++ source file.

If someone could followup with either instructions or a URL that can run me
through this step-by-step, it would be very handy. Thanks.

Also, How do I remove files/resources from my workspace? There is no
'delete' item in the right-click menu!

Thanks.

[Steven T. Hatton]

Kevin Torr wrote:

I've been using C for some time now and I would like to take my first leap
into C++. I should warn you that I have little or no experience with
visual C++, though I do have some experience with different OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and help->about menus.
Inside the box will be an input field where you type in your number, and a
button that says 'Go'.
Under that will be another text field which will give you 2* what you
typed previously if it's a number, otherwise it pops up with an error box
saying "Please enter only integers and decimals into the box".

So this is what I have done so far:
Created a new "Win32 application" project called "thetest".
I then create a new "C++ Source File" called "thesource" and add it to the
workspace "thetest".
I go up to 'insert -> resource -> menu' and create the menu
I save the resource as 'menu.rc' and 'menu.rc' to the 'Resource Files'
folder in the 'File View'

This is about as far as I can get without a tutorial or instructions to
get me further.
I'm not sure how to access the resources I have included to the project
from the C++ source file.

If someone could followup with either instructions or a URL that can run
me through this step-by-step, it would be very handy. Thanks.

Also, How do I remove files/resources from my workspace? There is no
'delete' item in the right-click menu!

Thanks.

Detailed discussions of the use of any particular IDE are taboo in this
newsgroup. There's a very helpful FAQ which you would do well to read.
People tend to be pretty tough about sticking to the guidelines discussed
therein. If you have C++ related questions, this is a good place to ask
them. If you have VC++ related questions, I believe you can find links to
resources in the FAQ. If you have questions of a newbie nature, try to
find the answer in the FAQ, if the FAQ isn't clear, or doesn't address the
question, then post the question. Here's the FAQ:

http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/

There's also a learning C++ newsgroup listed somewhere on Stroustrup's site.
http://www.research.att.com/~bs/C++.html

My experience has been that trying to learn C++ the easy way doesn't work.
I.e., you won't get there by clicking icons, and menu selections in an IDE.
There are some books listed in the FAQ. Consider getting one or three.
You may do well to poke around on Microsoft's developer's site as well. I,
personally, don't do Windoze, but I do know they have some good resources.
My advice is to stay away from anything IDE specific until you get grounded
in C++.
--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[John Harrison]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40***********************@news.syd.swiftdsl.c om.au...

I've been using C for some time now and I would like to take my first leap
into C++. I should warn you that I have little or no experience with visual C++, though I do have some experience with different OOP languages.

So far so good.
I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

Not very relavent to learning C++.
I would like to create a very simple program to begin with:

Good.
A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and help->about menus.
Inside the box will be an input field where you type in your number, and a
button that says 'Go'.
C++ has no dialog boxes, or menus or buttons.
Under that will be another text field which will give you 2* what you typed previously if it's a number, otherwise it pops up with an error box saying
"Please enter only integers and decimals into the box".

So this is what I have done so far:
Created a new "Win32 application" project called "thetest".
I then create a new "C++ Source File" called "thesource" and add it to the
workspace "thetest".
I go up to 'insert -> resource -> menu' and create the menu
I save the resource as 'menu.rc' and 'menu.rc' to the 'Resource Files'
folder in the 'File View'

This is about as far as I can get without a tutorial or instructions to get me further.
I'm not sure how to access the resources I have included to the project from the C++ source file.

If someone could followup with either instructions or a URL that can run me through this step-by-step, it would be very handy. Thanks.

Also, How do I remove files/resources from my workspace? There is no
'delete' item in the right-click menu!

You seem confused between C++ and Visual C++. Visual C++ is a development
environment and your questions are all about how to use that tool. As such
they have no relevance on a group about the C++ language (or C language
either).

Learning C++ is learning a new language, if that is what you want to do then
fine, ask your C++ questions here. On the other hand learning how to program
Windows or how to use Visual C++ does not require that you learn C++ (Visual
C++ is a perfectly good C compiler).

Try news:microsoft.public.vc.ide_general for help with the Visual C++
development tool (you can find this on Microsoft's news server
news.Microsoft.com if your server doesn't carry it). Try
news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming questions.

john

[John Harrison]

> Try news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming
questions.

Should be

news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win32

john

[Kevin Torr]

"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4*************@ID-196037.news.uni-berlin.de...

You seem confused between C++ and Visual C++. Visual C++ is a development
environment and your questions are all about how to use that tool. As such
they have no relevance on a group about the C++ language (or C language
either).
Learning C++ is learning a new language, if that is what you want to do then fine, ask your C++ questions here. On the other hand learning how to program Windows or how to use Visual C++ does not require that you learn C++ (Visual C++ is a perfectly good C compiler).
Try news:microsoft.public.vc.ide_general for help with the Visual C++
development tool (you can find this on Microsoft's news server
news.Microsoft.com if your server doesn't carry it). Try
news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming questions.

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

[Kevin Torr]

"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4*************@ID-196037.news.uni-berlin.de...

You seem confused between C++ and Visual C++. Visual C++ is a development
environment and your questions are all about how to use that tool. As such
they have no relevance on a group about the C++ language (or C language
either).
Learning C++ is learning a new language, if that is what you want to do then fine, ask your C++ questions here. On the other hand learning how to program Windows or how to use Visual C++ does not require that you learn C++ (Visual C++ is a perfectly good C compiler).
Try news:microsoft.public.vc.ide_general for help with the Visual C++
development tool (you can find this on Microsoft's news server
news.Microsoft.com if your server doesn't carry it). Try
news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming questions.

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

[Frane Roje]

Ok, I suggest you start with console applications in C++,
and after you have conqured that you can move onto win32 apps.

If you want to learn about win32 apps you should get a newbie book
Programming for Windows by Charles Petzold

And finnaly you should ask your questions about win32 apps on the
newsgroup that John Harrison posted

--
Have a nice day

Remove (*dele*te) from email to reply

[Frane Roje]

Ok, I suggest you start with console applications in C++,
and after you have conqured that you can move onto win32 apps.

If you want to learn about win32 apps you should get a newbie book
Programming for Windows by Charles Petzold

And finnaly you should ask your questions about win32 apps on the
newsgroup that John Harrison posted

--
Have a nice day

Remove (*dele*te) from email to reply

[John Harrison]

>

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

I'm not sure you do. You seem to be linking to things that are separate,
learning C++ and learning Windows programming.

For a tutorial on Windows programming try the Microsoft MSDN site.

I'm not aware of any online tutorials in C++ that are worth reading.

john

[Steven T. Hatton]

Kevin Torr wrote:

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

This is actually an issue some of the C++ architects have some sensitivity
to. They understand that commandline programming seems mundane and
antiquated to people new to the language. There's been some discussion of
including a basic windowing library in the Standard, or in the collection
of libraries on the periphery. The latter seems far more reasonable than
the former. But neither exist.

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html
--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Chris Fogelklou]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40***********************@news.syd.swiftdsl.c om.au...

"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4*************@ID-196037.news.uni-berlin.de...

You seem confused between C++ and Visual C++. Visual C++ is a development environment and your questions are all about how to use that tool. As such they have no relevance on a group about the C++ language (or C language
either).
Learning C++ is learning a new language, if that is what you want to do then

fine, ask your C++ questions here. On the other hand learning how to

program

Windows or how to use Visual C++ does not require that you learn C++

(Visual

C++ is a perfectly good C compiler).
Try news:microsoft.public.vc.ide_general for help with the Visual C++
development tool (you can find this on Microsoft's news server
news.Microsoft.com if your server doesn't carry it). Try
news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming

questions.
I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

It has plenty of good examples to walk through, compiles natively on your
chosen platform, and lets you focus on the C++ coding rather than the
graphics.

Cheers, Chris

[John Harrison]

>

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

I'm not sure you do. You seem to be linking to things that are separate,
learning C++ and learning Windows programming.

For a tutorial on Windows programming try the Microsoft MSDN site.

I'm not aware of any online tutorials in C++ that are worth reading.

john

[Steven T. Hatton]

Kevin Torr wrote:

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

This is actually an issue some of the C++ architects have some sensitivity
to. They understand that commandline programming seems mundane and
antiquated to people new to the language. There's been some discussion of
including a basic windowing library in the Standard, or in the collection
of libraries on the periphery. The latter seems far more reasonable than
the former. But neither exist.

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html
--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Chris Fogelklou]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40***********************@news.syd.swiftdsl.c om.au...

"John Harrison" <jo*************@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c4*************@ID-196037.news.uni-berlin.de...

You seem confused between C++ and Visual C++. Visual C++ is a development environment and your questions are all about how to use that tool. As such they have no relevance on a group about the C++ language (or C language
either).
Learning C++ is learning a new language, if that is what you want to do then

fine, ask your C++ questions here. On the other hand learning how to

program

Windows or how to use Visual C++ does not require that you learn C++

(Visual

C++ is a perfectly good C compiler).
Try news:microsoft.public.vc.ide_general for help with the Visual C++
development tool (you can find this on Microsoft's news server
news.Microsoft.com if your server doesn't carry it). Try
news:comp.os.ms-windows.programmer.win for Windows programming

questions.
I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

It has plenty of good examples to walk through, compiles natively on your
chosen platform, and lets you focus on the C++ coding rather than the
graphics.

Cheers, Chris

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
<snip>

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html

I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real Windows API
instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you want to
do something useful with your program it costs around several thousand
dollars.
It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.

If you want to use a glossy wrapper around the real & elegant Win32 API, use
something with good licensing terms such as WTL.

- Pete

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
<snip>

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html

I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real Windows API
instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you want to
do something useful with your program it costs around several thousand
dollars.
It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.

If you want to use a glossy wrapper around the real & elegant Win32 API, use
something with good licensing terms such as WTL.

- Pete

[Steven T. Hatton]

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
<snip>

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html
I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real Windows
API instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you want to
do something useful with your program it costs around several thousand
dollars.

That's interesting. I'm using a Qt based application as my usenet client,
and the license is free. AAMOF, my entire desktop is Qt based, and free.
Oh, you want to /sell/ your product, and not /pay/ TrollTech! Well....
It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.

There is nothing in Qt that isn't standard C++. That is, there is no
language feature used in Qt that is not specified in the Standard. Perhaps
you mean moc? It's standard preprocessor metaprogramming.

But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Claudio Puviani]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]

This isn't going to help you learn C++ any more than getting thrown in a
crate and shipped to Wisconsin will help you learn how to fly a plane.
You'll be spending all your energy trying to figure out the aspects of
programming the graphical interface and practically none learning anything
meaningful about C++.

As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs, databases,
and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Claudio Puviani

[Steven T. Hatton]

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
<snip>

I will *highly* recommend the learning materials found in the Qt
documentation. You can get Qt free for Win32, or better.

http://www.trolltech.com

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/index.html
I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real Windows
API instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you want to
do something useful with your program it costs around several thousand
dollars.

That's interesting. I'm using a Qt based application as my usenet client,
and the license is free. AAMOF, my entire desktop is Qt based, and free.
Oh, you want to /sell/ your product, and not /pay/ TrollTech! Well....
It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.

There is nothing in Qt that isn't standard C++. That is, there is no
language feature used in Qt that is not specified in the Standard. Perhaps
you mean moc? It's standard preprocessor metaprogramming.

But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote: <snip>

I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real
Windows API instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you
want to do something useful with your program it costs around
several thousand dollars.

That's interesting. I'm using a Qt based application as my usenet
client, and the license is free. AAMOF, my entire desktop is Qt
based, and free. Oh, you want to /sell/ your product, and not /pay/
TrollTech! Well....

No. If I had a bunch of Qt apps and needed to sell them, I'd pay.
But IMO when better and free tools (WTL) are availible, I'd rather not pay.

It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.
There is nothing in Qt that isn't standard C++. That is, there is no
language feature used in Qt that is not specified in the Standard.
Perhaps you mean moc? It's standard preprocessor metaprogramming.

Signals, slots, and other junk.

But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows (desktop
and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad move to not use
the native toolkit.

- Pete

[Claudio Puviani]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]

This isn't going to help you learn C++ any more than getting thrown in a
crate and shipped to Wisconsin will help you learn how to fly a plane.
You'll be spending all your energy trying to figure out the aspects of
programming the graphical interface and practically none learning anything
meaningful about C++.

As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs, databases,
and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Claudio Puviani

[Steven T. Hatton]

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the code,
and it is all standard C++. I'm not going to go into this any further.
It's not proper for me to speak for TrollTech, nor is it proper for you to
deride their product in a forum such as this where it is not appropriate
for them to defend their product. You can go elsewhere and hash it out,
but I don't think I'll follow.
But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows (desktop
and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad move to not use
the native toolkit.

Fine. That's your business. I wasn't offering the advice to you.

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote: <snip>

I will *highly* recommend you stay away from Qt and use the real
Windows API instead.
Qt's licensing is horrible. Yes, you can get it free, but once you
want to do something useful with your program it costs around
several thousand dollars.

That's interesting. I'm using a Qt based application as my usenet
client, and the license is free. AAMOF, my entire desktop is Qt
based, and free. Oh, you want to /sell/ your product, and not /pay/
TrollTech! Well....

No. If I had a bunch of Qt apps and needed to sell them, I'd pay.
But IMO when better and free tools (WTL) are availible, I'd rather not pay.

It also includes a bunch of non-standard C++ language features.
There is nothing in Qt that isn't standard C++. That is, there is no
language feature used in Qt that is not specified in the Standard.
Perhaps you mean moc? It's standard preprocessor metaprogramming.

Signals, slots, and other junk.

But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows (desktop
and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad move to not use
the native toolkit.

- Pete

[richard.forrest1]

"Chris Fogelklou" <ch*************@comhem.se> wrote in message
news:t%********************@newsb.telia.net...

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

It has plenty of good examples to walk through, compiles natively on your
chosen platform, and lets you focus on the C++ coding rather than the
graphics.

wxWindows has recently changed its name to wxWidgets after a request from
Microsoft.

That aside, it is an excellent GUI library for cross-platform work, as all
work should be ;-)
It is also opensource and may be downloaded from www.wxwidgets.com

Richard

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.
They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the
code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have similar
mechinisms.
I'm not going to go into this any
further. It's not proper for me to speak for TrollTech, nor is it
proper for you to deride their product in a forum such as this where
it is not appropriate for them to defend their product. You can go
elsewhere and hash it out, but I don't think I'll follow.
Sorry I came across as deriding their product, that wasn't my intention.
I was just expressing dislike for Qt, in the same manner you have expressed
dislike of Windows. Remember, MS reps don't come here either.
But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows
(desktop and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad
move to not use the native toolkit.

Fine. That's your business. I wasn't offering the advice to you.

Good point. Maybe I should suggest wxWidgets instead of WTL, to be PC.

IMVHO, though, unless you're specifically targetting a niche market that
uses OSs like Linux, I feel it's better to use a toolkit like WTL that is
made from the ground up for the OS that 90% of the general computer users
use.

Also, IIRC WTL is open source also, though.

- Pete

[Rui Maciel]

In article <t%********************@newsb.telia.net>,
ch*************@comhem.se says...

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

<snip>

wxWindows is now called wxWidgets (http://www.wxwidgets.org/)

The name was changed due to some trademark issue raised by Microsoft. If
you are interested in the official explanation, please check out
http://www.wxwidgets.org/name.htm
P.S.: I believe that the library has great potencial and that the new
name is better than the previous one. But that's jus me.

--
Using MicroPlanet Gravity - Open Source Usenet News Reader for Windows
95/98/2K/XP
http://mpgravity.sourceforge.net/

[Steven T. Hatton]

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the code,
and it is all standard C++. I'm not going to go into this any further.
It's not proper for me to speak for TrollTech, nor is it proper for you to
deride their product in a forum such as this where it is not appropriate
for them to defend their product. You can go elsewhere and hash it out,
but I don't think I'll follow.
But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows (desktop
and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad move to not use
the native toolkit.

Fine. That's your business. I wasn't offering the advice to you.

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Leor Zolman]

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the
code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have similar
mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or Andrei
Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we ought to
just write our own implementations from scratch because it "isn't hard"?
-leor

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Pete]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
> Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read
the code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have
similar mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or
Andrei Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we
ought to just write our own implementations from scratch because it
"isn't hard"? -leor

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

- Pete

[richard.forrest1]

"Chris Fogelklou" <ch*************@comhem.se> wrote in message
news:t%********************@newsb.telia.net...

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

It has plenty of good examples to walk through, compiles natively on your
chosen platform, and lets you focus on the C++ coding rather than the
graphics.

wxWindows has recently changed its name to wxWidgets after a request from
Microsoft.

That aside, it is an excellent GUI library for cross-platform work, as all
work should be ;-)
It is also opensource and may be downloaded from www.wxwidgets.com

Richard

[Pete]

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.
They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the
code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have similar
mechinisms.
I'm not going to go into this any
further. It's not proper for me to speak for TrollTech, nor is it
proper for you to deride their product in a forum such as this where
it is not appropriate for them to defend their product. You can go
elsewhere and hash it out, but I don't think I'll follow.
Sorry I came across as deriding their product, that wasn't my intention.
I was just expressing dislike for Qt, in the same manner you have expressed
dislike of Windows. Remember, MS reps don't come here either.
But the really nice thing is, you don't even need to use Windows.

I don't really care about that. There's no OS other than Windows
(desktop and CE) that my target audience uses, so it would be a bad
move to not use the native toolkit.

Fine. That's your business. I wasn't offering the advice to you.

Good point. Maybe I should suggest wxWidgets instead of WTL, to be PC.

IMVHO, though, unless you're specifically targetting a niche market that
uses OSs like Linux, I feel it's better to use a toolkit like WTL that is
made from the ground up for the OS that 90% of the general computer users
use.

Also, IIRC WTL is open source also, though.

- Pete

[Rui Maciel]

In article <t%********************@newsb.telia.net>,
ch*************@comhem.se says...

Also check out wxWindows, a cross platform C++ GUI library that can be
compiled in MSVC, GCC, mingw, or any other compiler for many platforms.

<snip>

wxWindows is now called wxWidgets (http://www.wxwidgets.org/)

The name was changed due to some trademark issue raised by Microsoft. If
you are interested in the official explanation, please check out
http://www.wxwidgets.org/name.htm
P.S.: I believe that the library has great potencial and that the new
name is better than the previous one. But that's jus me.

--
Using MicroPlanet Gravity - Open Source Usenet News Reader for Windows
95/98/2K/XP
http://mpgravity.sourceforge.net/

[Leor Zolman]

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read the
code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have similar
mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or Andrei
Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we ought to
just write our own implementations from scratch because it "isn't hard"?
-leor

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Pete]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:

Pete wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
> Pete wrote:

Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read
the code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have
similar mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or
Andrei Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we
ought to just write our own implementations from scratch because it
"isn't hard"? -leor

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

- Pete

[Leor Zolman]

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
Pete wrote:

> Steven T. Hatton wrote:
>> Pete wrote:

> Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read
the code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have
similar mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or
Andrei Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we
ought to just write our own implementations from scratch because it
"isn't hard"? -leor

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++". As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

- Pete

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Leor Zolman]

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Steven T. Hatton wrote:
Pete wrote:

> Steven T. Hatton wrote:
>> Pete wrote:

> Signals, slots, and other junk.

They are merely shorthand for code produced by moc. You can read
the code, and it is all standard C++.

Then why not use real C++ in the first place? It's not hard to have
similar mechinisms.

Pete, isn't that a bit like saying that using the Boost libs, or
Andrei Alexandrescu's Loki facilities, isn't using "real C++", and we
ought to just write our own implementations from scratch because it
"isn't hard"? -leor

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++". As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

- Pete

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Steven T. Hatton]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.
Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++".

I was merely repeating what I was told by people at TrollTech. That's why I
backed off. I don't understand it well enough to substantiate the claim.
But basically, Signals and Slots are implemented with high powered macros
of some kind.

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/moc.html
As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

I've never claimed I'm never wrong. And sometimes when I'm right, I don't
even know it. E.g., taking out the name hiding stuff in that virtual
inheritance example. That was just plain dumb luck. I took out the part I
didn't understand, and started pulling the example apart.

BTW, you were intimating I might to better to chose another book. A few
things I should point out. I put the book down for several months, so I'm
really rusty on the first part. I haven't been working the exercises.
(like I did with the Feynman Lectures on Physics - no I never finished the
entire 3 Volumes, but I do still have the (original) problem sets. :-D ) I
suspect Stroustrup put some of the important lessons in the problems. It
seems to me, his goal is to teach you how to think about solving the kind
of problem in question at the fundamental level, not by a set of memorized
rules. That's what you took for me knowing more than I let on. It all just
fell into place.

There was another thread going on at the same time discussing how to do
things in the opposite direction. That is, call the functions in the
baseclass not the derived class. I need to revisit that topic.

- Pete

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Steven T. Hatton]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:14:56 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.
Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++".

I was merely repeating what I was told by people at TrollTech. That's why I
backed off. I don't understand it well enough to substantiate the claim.
But basically, Signals and Slots are implemented with high powered macros
of some kind.

http://doc.trolltech.com/3.3/moc.html
As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

I've never claimed I'm never wrong. And sometimes when I'm right, I don't
even know it. E.g., taking out the name hiding stuff in that virtual
inheritance example. That was just plain dumb luck. I took out the part I
didn't understand, and started pulling the example apart.

BTW, you were intimating I might to better to chose another book. A few
things I should point out. I put the book down for several months, so I'm
really rusty on the first part. I haven't been working the exercises.
(like I did with the Feynman Lectures on Physics - no I never finished the
entire 3 Volumes, but I do still have the (original) problem sets. :-D ) I
suspect Stroustrup put some of the important lessons in the problems. It
seems to me, his goal is to teach you how to think about solving the kind
of problem in question at the fundamental level, not by a set of memorized
rules. That's what you took for me knowing more than I let on. It all just
fell into place.

There was another thread going on at the same time discussing how to do
things in the opposite direction. That is, call the functions in the
baseclass not the derived class. I need to revisit that topic.

- Pete

--
p->m == (*p).m == p[0].m
http://www.kdevelop.org
http://www.suse.com
http://www.mozilla.org

[Jon Bell]

In article <MP************************@news.telepac.pt>,
Rui Maciel <re*****************************@mail.com> wrote:

[about wxWidgets, formerly wxWindows]
P.S.: I believe that the library has great potencial and that the new
name is better than the previous one. But that's jus me.

For an example of widely-used cross-platform software that uses this
library, see VueScan, scanning software that can drive a variety of film
and flatbed scanners: <http://www.hamrick.com/vsm.html>.

--
Jon Bell <jt*******@presby.edu> Presbyterian College
Dept. of Physics and Computer Science Clinton, South Carolina USA

[Jon Bell]

In article <MP************************@news.telepac.pt>,
Rui Maciel <re*****************************@mail.com> wrote:

[about wxWidgets, formerly wxWindows]
P.S.: I believe that the library has great potencial and that the new
name is better than the previous one. But that's jus me.

For an example of widely-used cross-platform software that uses this
library, see VueScan, scanning software that can drive a variety of film
and flatbed scanners: <http://www.hamrick.com/vsm.html>.

--
Jon Bell <jt*******@presby.edu> Presbyterian College
Dept. of Physics and Computer Science Clinton, South Carolina USA

[Kevin Torr]

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8g*********************@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.n et...

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs,

databases, and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and the reason I
wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI capabilities. Is there
really that much difference between C and C++ that I need to start from the
command line all over again? :(

I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters, file
splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly with a
graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into DOS.

[Kevin Torr]

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8g*********************@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.n et...

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs,

databases, and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and the reason I
wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI capabilities. Is there
really that much difference between C and C++ that I need to start from the
command line all over again? :(

I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters, file
splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly with a
graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into DOS.

[Leor Zolman]

On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 11:42:16 +1000, "Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com>
wrote:

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8g*********************@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv. net...

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

> I've been using C for some time now and I would
> like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
> you that I have little or no experience with visual
> C++, though I do have some experience with different
> OOP languages.
>
> I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.
>
> I would like to create a very simple program to
> begin with:
>
> A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
> help->about menus.
> [rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs,

databases,

and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and the reason I
wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI capabilities.

C++ does not /have/ "GUI capabilities". C++ is a programming language, not
a GUI framework. "Microsoft Visual C++" is a product that combines the C++
language and Standard (NON-graphical) library with a bunch of proprietary
GUI libraries and tools.

There are other language that support GUI frameworks (C, Java [which
actually /does/ bundle the GUI framework into the standard development
system], Visual Basic, lots of other.

There are GUI frameworks other than Microsoft's MFC or .NET that work with
C++: wxWidgets for example (my favorite).

Some people believe Microsoft invented C++, so that all the GUI facilities
provided with Visual C++ are somehow part of the "The C++ Language". No.
Is there
really that much difference between C and C++ that I need to start from the
command line all over again? :(
Independent of the preceding GUI issue, the answer is still yes. Well, you
don't /have/ to start from the command line, but by decoupling the GUI
facilities from the language facilities while you learn, you'll at least
have a prayer of retaining your sanity. They're /each/ complex so that
you're better off not having to learn the other at the same time. Since the
GUI facilities use the language facilities, is makes sense to begin with
the language facilities /in isolation from/ the GUI facilities. That leaves
you with: the command-line.

I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters, file
splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly with a
graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into DOS.
Sounds good. As Scott Meyers has said (though not with regard to this exact
same subject): "There's no reason to get ahead of ourselves. First we
crawl. Later we crawl on broken glass."
-leor

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Claudio Puviani]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding
GUIs, databases, and other platform-specific distractions
and by modeling various problems using the core C++
language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with that,
it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and
the reason I wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI
capabilities.

C++ doesn't have better GUI capabilities than C. It's just that there are
frameworks that make GUI programming easier.
Is there really that much difference between C and C++ that
I need to start from the command line all over again? :(
Lord, yes! It's not just a question of learning the language features,
though there are certainly many new ones, but of learning the proper
idiomatic use of the language. Don't let this discourage you. It's easy if
you take it in gradually and allow yourself the time to learn it the right
way.
I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters,
file splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly
with a graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into
DOS.

They would, and you'll eventually do it. I just think it's not the right
place to start learning C++. Most, if not all, GUI frameworks force bad
programming practices for reasons of expediency and to lower the learning
curve for new users. I've noticed that people who start C++ programming from
there are very hard to wean away from those practices. You'll often see that
even in this forum with people justifying abominable design decisions with
"but MFC does it that way." :-)

But everyone is different. If you feel that you're capable of learning
questionable practices and then freely abandon them as you learn better ways
(and many people can't), maybe having the visual rewards that GUI
programming offers will motivate you to go forward faster.

Claudio Puviani

[John Tsiombikas (Nuclear / the Lab)]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++". As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

Try not to trust blindly something someone said, since we all make
mistakes or missunderstand questions.
Qt may be written in standard C++, however you cannot compile a program
that uses Qt with a C++ compiler directly. It has it's own preprocessor
that you must use before that. Now image what would happen if every
library out there required a custom preprocessing stage...

One a personal note, I prefer GTKmm when I need GUI stuff. It is as easy
to use as Qt (which admittedly appart from the signals&slots thing has a
pretty well-structured interface), but you can also use it through
standard C++

--
John Tsiombikas (Nuclear / the Lab)
nu*****@siggraph.org
http://thelab.demoscene.gr/nuclear/

[Leor Zolman]

On Mon, 5 Apr 2004 11:42:16 +1000, "Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com>
wrote:

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8g*********************@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv. net...

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

> I've been using C for some time now and I would
> like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
> you that I have little or no experience with visual
> C++, though I do have some experience with different
> OOP languages.
>
> I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.
>
> I would like to create a very simple program to
> begin with:
>
> A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
> help->about menus.
> [rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding GUIs,

databases,

and other platform-specific distractions and by modeling various problems
using the core C++ language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with
that, it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and the reason I
wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI capabilities.

C++ does not /have/ "GUI capabilities". C++ is a programming language, not
a GUI framework. "Microsoft Visual C++" is a product that combines the C++
language and Standard (NON-graphical) library with a bunch of proprietary
GUI libraries and tools.

There are other language that support GUI frameworks (C, Java [which
actually /does/ bundle the GUI framework into the standard development
system], Visual Basic, lots of other.

There are GUI frameworks other than Microsoft's MFC or .NET that work with
C++: wxWidgets for example (my favorite).

Some people believe Microsoft invented C++, so that all the GUI facilities
provided with Visual C++ are somehow part of the "The C++ Language". No.
Is there
really that much difference between C and C++ that I need to start from the
command line all over again? :(
Independent of the preceding GUI issue, the answer is still yes. Well, you
don't /have/ to start from the command line, but by decoupling the GUI
facilities from the language facilities while you learn, you'll at least
have a prayer of retaining your sanity. They're /each/ complex so that
you're better off not having to learn the other at the same time. Since the
GUI facilities use the language facilities, is makes sense to begin with
the language facilities /in isolation from/ the GUI facilities. That leaves
you with: the command-line.

I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters, file
splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly with a
graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into DOS.
Sounds good. As Scott Meyers has said (though not with regard to this exact
same subject): "There's no reason to get ahead of ourselves. First we
crawl. Later we crawl on broken glass."
-leor

--
Leor Zolman --- BD Software --- www.bdsoft.com
On-Site Training in C/C++, Java, Perl and Unix
C++ users: Download BD Software's free STL Error Message Decryptor at:
www.bdsoft.com/tools/stlfilt.html

[Claudio Puviani]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

"Claudio Puviani" <pu*****@hotmail.com> wrote

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote

I've been using C for some time now and I would
like to take my first leap into C++. I should warn
you that I have little or no experience with visual
C++, though I do have some experience with different
OOP languages.

I am using Microsoft Visual C++ 6.0.

I would like to create a very simple program to
begin with:

A dialog box, say 320x240 in size, with file->exit and
help->about menus.
[rest snipped]
As boring as it may seem, you'll learn far more by avoiding
GUIs, databases, and other platform-specific distractions
and by modeling various problems using the core C++
language and libraries. Once you're comfortable with that,
it will be a lot easier to expand into other territories.

Makes sense. I've done a fair bit of C command-line stuff, and
the reason I wanted to move into C++ was because of it's GUI
capabilities.

C++ doesn't have better GUI capabilities than C. It's just that there are
frameworks that make GUI programming easier.
Is there really that much difference between C and C++ that
I need to start from the command line all over again? :(
Lord, yes! It's not just a question of learning the language features,
though there are certainly many new ones, but of learning the proper
idiomatic use of the language. Don't let this discourage you. It's easy if
you take it in gradually and allow yourself the time to learn it the right
way.
I've been building things like graphics converters, file encrypters,
file splicers etc - all of these would be a lot more user-friendly
with a graphical interface rather than typing massive strings into
DOS.

They would, and you'll eventually do it. I just think it's not the right
place to start learning C++. Most, if not all, GUI frameworks force bad
programming practices for reasons of expediency and to lower the learning
curve for new users. I've noticed that people who start C++ programming from
there are very hard to wean away from those practices. You'll often see that
even in this forum with people justifying abominable design decisions with
"but MFC does it that way." :-)

But everyone is different. If you feel that you're capable of learning
questionable practices and then freely abandon them as you learn better ways
(and many people can't), maybe having the visual rewards that GUI
programming offers will motivate you to go forward faster.

Claudio Puviani

[John Tsiombikas (Nuclear / the Lab)]

Leor Zolman wrote:

On Sun, 04 Apr 2004 16:55:23 GMT, "Pete" <x@x.x> wrote:

No, Qt uses some sort of preprocessor so you can have "slot" functions and
other stuff.
Boost is written in pure C++ AFAIK.

Well, all I had to go on (since I've never even heard of "Qt" before this
thread) was what Steven T. Hatton wrote, that "it is all standard C++". As
we've learned around here, Steven is never wrong.
-leor

Try not to trust blindly something someone said, since we all make
mistakes or missunderstand questions.
Qt may be written in standard C++, however you cannot compile a program
that uses Qt with a C++ compiler directly. It has it's own preprocessor
that you must use before that. Now image what would happen if every
library out there required a custom preprocessing stage...

One a personal note, I prefer GTKmm when I need GUI stuff. It is as easy
to use as Qt (which admittedly appart from the signals&slots thing has a
pretty well-structured interface), but you can also use it through
standard C++

--
John Tsiombikas (Nuclear / the Lab)
nu*****@siggraph.org
http://thelab.demoscene.gr/nuclear/

[jeffc]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40***********************@news.syd.swiftdsl.c om.au...

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

I think you're still missing the point. Anything "visual" like that isn't
part of C++ per se. You're going to have to get a book on your specific
application (Visual C++). One book that does a good job separating the
Windows part from the C++ part is "Beginning Visual C++" by Horton.

[jeffc]

"Kevin Torr" <ke*******@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:40***********************@news.syd.swiftdsl.c om.au...

I understand what you're saying.

Where can I find a tutorial that will show me the steps in writing a C++
program that will perform my task, or at least something visually similar?

A box with an input, an output field, and a button that runs the function.

I think you're still missing the point. Anything "visual" like that isn't
part of C++ per se. You're going to have to get a book on your specific
application (Visual C++). One book that does a good job separating the
Windows part from the C++ part is "Beginning Visual C++" by Horton.