58  3160 
"Chris Dunaway" <du******@gmail.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@y5g2000h sf.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 19, 1:36 pm, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk...@pobox.comwrote:
>Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out:
http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk...@pobox.com>http://www.pobox.com/~skeet
Blog:http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK:http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Hi Jon,
We are able to download the software, but the page on MSDN
subscriptions doesn't list a subscriber key for VS2008. Can you shed
some light on this?
Thanks,
Chris
There is no key required (it's hard coded in the product), if you are
allowed to download the product, you are assumed to be a legal licensee.
Willy..
On Nov 19, 2:29 pm, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
"Chris Dunaway" <dunaw...@gmail.comwrote in message
news:58**********************************@y5g2000h sf.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 19, 1:36 pm, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk...@pobox.comwrote:
Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out:
>http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk...@pobox.com>http://www.pobox.com/~skeet
Blog:http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK:http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Hi Jon,
We are able to download the software, but the page on MSDN
subscriptions doesn't list a subscriber key for VS2008. Can you shed
some light on this?
Thanks,
Chris
There is no key required (it's hard coded in the product), if you are
allowed to download the product, you are assumed to be a legal licensee.
Willy..
Thanks,
Chris
"DeveloperX" <nn*****@operamail.comwrote in message
news:97**********************************@s36g2000 prg.googlegroups.com...
On 19 Nov, 19:36, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk...@pobox.comwrote:
>Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out:
http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk...@pobox.com>http://www.pobox.com/~skeet
Blog:http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK:http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Seems to be popular, I can't get any bandwidth :/
me either (for Pro, not Express) ...
actually, I'm getting this message:
"There's a persistent network connectivity error preventing download
completion, indicating a problem with your connection to the Internet.
Please check your Internet connection before continuing."
and there's nothing wrong with my connection to the Internet that I can see
....
anyone else seeing the same or similar message?
On 19 Nov, 21:23, "Liz" <l...@tiredofspam.comwrote:
"DeveloperX" <nntp...@operamail.comwrote in message
news:97**********************************@s36g2000 prg.googlegroups.com...
On 19 Nov, 19:36, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk...@pobox.comwrote:
Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out:
>http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk...@pobox.com>http://www.pobox.com/~skeet
Blog:http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK:http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Seems to be popular, I can't get any bandwidth :/
me either (for Pro, not Express) ...
actually, I'm getting this message:
"There's a persistent network connectivity error preventing download
completion, indicating a problem with your connection to the Internet.
Please check your Internet connection before continuing."
and there's nothing wrong with my connection to the Internet that I can see
...
anyone else seeing the same or similar message?
Seems to be working now, although it seems to be downloading the 90
day trial. I hate MSDN for this, I never seem to be able to find the
right link, or figure out which is the right key :/ I'll get there
though :)
I can't help I'm afraid Liz, it was broken until I posted the above :/
On the plus side, once it works, this is going to be the best VS we've
seen. I loved the beta, and can't wait to get this running in the
office :)
Is anyone using 3 in the wild? We've just made it to 2, and that was a
struggle.
Thanks, I thought this wasn't out until January, and so wouldn't have
noticed.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Skeet [C# MVP] [mailto:sk***@pobox.com]
Posted At: Tuesday, 20 November 2007 4:37 AM
Posted To: microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp
Conversation: Visual Studio 2008 released
Subject: Visual Studio 2008 released
Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out: http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
This link seems to work for me: http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-au/sub.../bb608344.aspx
-----Original Message-----
From: DeveloperX [mailto:nn*****@operamail.com]
Posted At: Tuesday, 20 November 2007 9:20 AM
Posted To: microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp
Conversation: Visual Studio 2008 released
Subject: Re: Visual Studio 2008 released
On 19 Nov, 21:23, "Liz" <l...@tiredofspam.comwrote:
"DeveloperX" <nntp...@operamail.comwrote in message
news:97**********************************@s36g2000 prg.googlegroups.com..
..
>
On 19 Nov, 19:36, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk...@pobox.comwrote:
Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now
available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are
also
out:
>http://www.microsoft.com/express/download/
--
Jon Skeet - <sk...@pobox.com>http://www.pobox.com/~skeet
Blog:http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK:http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Seems to be popular, I can't get any bandwidth :/
me either (for Pro, not Express) ...
actually, I'm getting this message:
"There's a persistent network connectivity error preventing download
completion, indicating a problem with your connection to the Internet.
Please check your Internet connection before continuing."
and there's nothing wrong with my connection to the Internet that I
can see
...
anyone else seeing the same or similar message?
Seems to be working now, although it seems to be downloading the 90
day trial. I hate MSDN for this, I never seem to be able to find the
right link, or figure out which is the right key :/ I'll get there
though :)
I can't help I'm afraid Liz, it was broken until I posted the above :/
On the plus side, once it works, this is going to be the best VS we've
seen. I loved the beta, and can't wait to get this running in the
office :)
Is anyone using 3 in the wild? We've just made it to 2, and that was a
struggle.
"DeveloperX" <nn*****@operamail.comwrote in message
news:0f**********************************@f3g2000h sg.googlegroups.com...
I can't help I'm afraid Liz, it was broken until I posted the above :/
On the plus side, once it works, this is going to be the best VS we've
seen. I loved the beta, and can't wait to get this running in the
office :)
thanks for replying, DevX .... I got it a little while after posting my
question ... I'm dying to see it .. and afraid to install it ... lol ...
suppose my projects won't build??
anyone cut over yet?
Liz
As soon as I get home tonight (about 6 hours) I'll be giving it a shot,
moving me projects (in a test environment) over to it.
Will inform of success, but of course, results may vary depending on
what features you have used.
-----Original Message-----
From: Liz [mailto:li*@tiredofspam.com]
Posted At: Tuesday, 20 November 2007 11:24 AM
Posted To: microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp
Conversation: Visual Studio 2008 released
Subject: Re: Visual Studio 2008 released
"DeveloperX" <nn*****@operamail.comwrote in message
news:0f**********************************@f3g2000h sg.googlegroups.com...
I can't help I'm afraid Liz, it was broken until I posted the above :/
On the plus side, once it works, this is going to be the best VS we've
seen. I loved the beta, and can't wait to get this running in the
office :)
thanks for replying, DevX .... I got it a little while after posting my
question ... I'm dying to see it .. and afraid to install it ... lol
....
suppose my projects won't build??
anyone cut over yet?
Liz
DeveloperX <nn*****@operamail.comwrote:
<snip>
Is anyone using 3 in the wild? We've just made it to 2, and that was a
struggle.
I hope to be using C# 3 at work within the next few months. I doubt
that I'll be using .NET 3.5 any time soon, but you can use most of the
C# 3 features while targeting .NET 2.0.
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP********************@msnews.microsoft.com.. .
DeveloperX <nn*****@operamail.comwrote:
<snip>
>Is anyone using 3 in the wild? We've just made it to 2, and that was a
struggle.
I hope to be using C# 3 at work within the next few months. I doubt
that I'll be using .NET 3.5 any time soon, but you can use most of the
C# 3 features while targeting .NET 2.0.
True, this is because all "targets" build with C# 3. However, there's
something that I don't like about this "Version targeting", there is no way
to use V2 of the C# compiler from within VS2008, although C# 2 installed
with VS2008 is the latest build (V8.00.50727.1433) targeting V2 of the
framework.
Willy.
On Nov 20, 9:28 am, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
I hope to be using C# 3 at work within the next few months. I doubt
that I'll be using .NET 3.5 any time soon, but you can use most of the
C# 3 features while targeting .NET 2.0.
True, this is because all "targets" build with C# 3. However, there's
something that I don't like about this "Version targeting", there is no way
to use V2 of the C# compiler from within VS2008, although C# 2 installed
with VS2008 is the latest build (V8.00.50727.1433) targeting V2 of the
framework.
Yes, it's a shame - it means that if you *do* share projects between
VS2005 and VS2008 users, you need to be careful not to put C# 3 code
in there.
I don't suppose it's possible by manually editing the csproj file is
it? I can't say I've looked at it in detail, but I wouldn't be
surprised if there was a property you could set... (In particular, you
have to set a flag for the CSharpCodeProvider to use C# 3 stuff, so
we'd be looking for the reverse in this case...)
Jon
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:f8**********************************@d61g2000 hsa.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 20, 9:28 am, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
I hope to be using C# 3 at work within the next few months. I doubt
that I'll be using .NET 3.5 any time soon, but you can use most of the
C# 3 features while targeting .NET 2.0.
True, this is because all "targets" build with C# 3. However, there's
something that I don't like about this "Version targeting", there is no
way
to use V2 of the C# compiler from within VS2008, although C# 2 installed
with VS2008 is the latest build (V8.00.50727.1433) targeting V2 of the
framework.
Yes, it's a shame - it means that if you *do* share projects between
VS2005 and VS2008 users, you need to be careful not to put C# 3 code
in there.
I don't suppose it's possible by manually editing the csproj file is
it? I can't say I've looked at it in detail, but I wouldn't be
surprised if there was a property you could set... (In particular, you
have to set a flag for the CSharpCodeProvider to use C# 3 stuff, so
we'd be looking for the reverse in this case...)
Jon
What I'm doing is set the ToolsVersion value to 2.0 in the .csproj file.
....
<Project ToolsVersion="2.0"
this forces the project to be build using the V2 tools (C# 2).
However, this doesn't mean you can share the project between VS2005 and
2005.
Willy.
Jon Skeet [C# MVP] wrote:
Just in case people had missed it, Visual Studio 2008 is now available
for download for MSDN subscribers, and the Express editions are also
out:
I was lucky enough to attend the launch of Visual Studio 2005, and got a
free copy of VS2005 Pro. This time around, I'm not so lucky and
certainly cannot afford to buy the Pro version of VS2008 :( So I am
resigned to using the Express version.
Not having used an Express version before, I'm unsure of the
differences. Is there something out there that offers a comparison of
the different versions so I can see if there's anything I will miss by
using the Express version?
Cheers,
--
Dylan Parry http://electricfreedom.org | http://webpageworkshop.co.uk
The opinions stated above are not necessarily representative of
those of my cats. All opinions expressed are entirely your own.
On 2007-11-20 02:37:40 -0800, Dylan Parry <us****@dylanparry.comsaid:
[...]
Not having used an Express version before, I'm unsure of the
differences. Is there something out there that offers a comparison of
the different versions so I can see if there's anything I will miss by
using the Express version?
I can't speak for the 2008 version, but having used both Express and
retail versions of 2005, I can say that I found very little in the
retail version that I simply couldn't live without.
That's not to say there's no value in the retail version; I was just
surprised at how functional the free version was.
Things I definitely missed when using the Express version:
* Thread debugging support. Express will break in any thread as
needed, but it offers no UI to switch from one thread to another while
the application is paused.
* Integration. The Express versions are all individual according
to language. This was most noticeable when trying to use C# and
managed C++ together, as I had no obvious way to put a C# project into
the same solution with a C++ project.
* non-Forms, native Win32 support. There's no real resource editor
in the Express version, which means that if you want to develop native
Win32 applications that use dialogs, string tables, etc. you have to
write your .rc file by hand.
There are other differences, but these are the ones that seemed most
significant to me.
That said, you already wrote that you "cannot afford to buy the Pro
version of VS2008", so it seems that this is a moot question. Assuming
you need to use the 2008 version of _something_, you'll be using
Express and you'll soon find out for yourself what's missing. :)
I should have been paying better attention, but have not: can one
somehow upgrade VS2005 to handle C# 3.0? I'm assuming that as with the
other .NET upgrades, no IDE upgrade is required to support it (other
than installing the latest SDK), but I can see how C# 3.0 would require
a new compiler (duh :) ). I'm wondering if the compiler might be
included in an SDK release, allowing someone with a retail version of
VS2005 to continue using it even with the new stuff.
If so, that might be the way to go in your case.
Pete
Peter Duniho wrote:
That said, you already wrote that you "cannot afford to buy the Pro
version of VS2008", so it seems that this is a moot question. Assuming
you need to use the 2008 version of _something_, you'll be using
Express and you'll soon find out for yourself what's missing. :)
Well, yes... it was a bit of a moot question, but I do like to be
prepared. I'd rather know now what I am going to miss (if anything) than
find out later and go "arghh!" and start bashing things <g>
From what you've said about the differences for 2005; If the 2008
versions are similarly different [sic], then I don't think I'll even notice!
--
Dylan Parry http://electricfreedom.org | http://webpageworkshop.co.uk
The opinions stated above are not necessarily representative of
those of my cats. All opinions expressed are entirely your own.
On Nov 20, 10:24 am, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
What I'm doing is set the ToolsVersion value to 2.0 in the .csproj file.
...
<Project ToolsVersion="2.0"
this forces the project to be build using the V2 tools (C# 2).
However, this doesn't mean you can share the project between VS2005 and
2005.
So what happens when you open a project like that within 2008?
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Jon
There is no key required (it's hard coded in the product), if you are
allowed to download the product, you are assumed to be a legal licensee.
Is it the same key for everyone or do they embed one for each subscription
before you download ?
--
Christian
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:dc**********************************@n20g2000 hsh.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 20, 10:24 am, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
>What I'm doing is set the ToolsVersion value to 2.0 in the .csproj file.
...
<Project ToolsVersion="2.0"
this forces the project to be build using the V2 tools (C# 2).
However, this doesn't mean you can share the project between VS2005 and
2005.
So what happens when you open a project like that within 2008?
The project opens builds and runs succesfully using C# 2, basically what
happens is that VS picks all tools (like the compiler) from the FrameworkV2
directory. It's not possible to open the project in VS2005 however.
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
Willy.
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
I open a 2008 solution, and add existing 2005 projects. Seems to work
fine.
It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
I open a 2008 solution, and add existing 2005 projects. Seems to work
fine.
When you add a VS2005 project file to a VS2008 Solution, the VS Conversion
Wizard comes up, right? (it does for me).
At that moment the project file gets "partly" converted to the VS2008
format, basically the csprj file remains a VS2005 csprj file..
"ToolsVersion="3.5"" is added in the Project Element, however, this doesn't
prevent the file to be loaded and run correctly in VS2005.
Changing " ...ToolsVersion="3.5" into ToolsVersion="2.0" causes VS2008 to
use C# 2, and VS2005 is also happy with this as he doesn't know about this
anyway.
Willy.
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
>It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
>Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
Scott Gu on his weblog today said that VS 2005/2008 can share project files
but not solution files. He recommends using one solution file for VS 2005
and one for VS 2008 but each can reference the same project file just fine
(according to him).
Thanks,
Shawn
Shawn B. <le****@html.comwrote:
It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
Scott Gu on his weblog today said that VS 2005/2008 can share project files
but not solution files. He recommends using one solution file for VS 2005
and one for VS 2008 but each can reference the same project file just fine
(according to him).
Exactly. However, there are a few details around that - which version
you should create the project in, what the wrinkles are, etc. That's
what I'll be addressing.
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Liz <li*@tiredofspam.comwrote:
It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
Of course :)
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
I open a 2008 solution, and add existing 2005 projects. Seems to work
fine.
When you add a VS2005 project file to a VS2008 Solution, the VS Conversion
Wizard comes up, right? (it does for me).
At that moment the project file gets "partly" converted to the VS2008
format, basically the csprj file remains a VS2005 csprj file..
"ToolsVersion="3.5"" is added in the Project Element, however, this doesn't
prevent the file to be loaded and run correctly in VS2005.
Changing " ...ToolsVersion="3.5" into ToolsVersion="2.0" causes VS2008 to
use C# 2, and VS2005 is also happy with this as he doesn't know about this
anyway.
Hmm... changing ToolsVersion to 2.0 doesn't stop it from compiling on
my box. However, adding a <LangVersion>ISO-2</LangVersiondoes. I'm
intrigued as to what ToolsVersion really does...
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Just to confirm, the conversion wizard comes up here as well, rendering
the project unusable in VS2005
Regards,
Wingot
-----Original Message-----
From: Willy Denoyette [MVP] [mailto:wi*************@telenet.be]
Posted At: Wednesday, 21 November 2007 5:01 AM
Posted To: microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp
Conversation: Visual Studio 2008 released
Subject: Re: Visual Studio 2008 released
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between
2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
I open a 2008 solution, and add existing 2005 projects. Seems to work
fine.
When you add a VS2005 project file to a VS2008 Solution, the VS
Conversion
Wizard comes up, right? (it does for me).
At that moment the project file gets "partly" converted to the VS2008
format, basically the csprj file remains a VS2005 csprj file..
"ToolsVersion="3.5"" is added in the Project Element, however, this
doesn't
prevent the file to be loaded and run correctly in VS2005.
Changing " ...ToolsVersion="3.5" into ToolsVersion="2.0" causes VS2008
to
use C# 2, and VS2005 is also happy with this as he doesn't know about
this
anyway.
Willy.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Skeet [C# MVP] [mailto:sk***@pobox.com]
Posted At: Wednesday, 21 November 2007 9:12 AM
Posted To: microsoft.public.dotnet.languages.csharp
Conversation: Visual Studio 2008 released
Subject: Re: Visual Studio 2008 released
Wingot <wi****@newsgroup.nospamwrote:
Just to confirm, the conversion wizard comes up here as well,
rendering
the project unusable in VS2005
What happens when you try to use it in VS2005? Note that I'm talking
about *projects* here, not *solutions*.
See http://msmvps.com/blogs/jon.skeet/ar...20/vs2005-and-
vs2008-co-existence.aspx
for my experiences.
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com>
http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Yes, I noticed this in one of your posts further down this thread.
Sorry, I was referring to Solutions, which you clarified is not able to
be used across both.
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
>"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com ...
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
For the book, I've got several projects which I'm using between 2005
and 2008, and it's all working fine.
Hmm..., you don't open a VS2005 solution/project in VS2008 without
conversion, do you?
I open a 2008 solution, and add existing 2005 projects. Seems to work
fine.
When you add a VS2005 project file to a VS2008 Solution, the VS
Conversion
Wizard comes up, right? (it does for me).
At that moment the project file gets "partly" converted to the VS2008
format, basically the csprj file remains a VS2005 csprj file..
"ToolsVersion="3.5"" is added in the Project Element, however, this
doesn't
prevent the file to be loaded and run correctly in VS2005.
Changing " ...ToolsVersion="3.5" into ToolsVersion="2.0" causes VS2008 to
use C# 2, and VS2005 is also happy with this as he doesn't know about
this
anyway.
Hmm... changing ToolsVersion to 2.0 doesn't stop it from compiling on
my box. However, adding a <LangVersion>ISO-2</LangVersiondoes. I'm
intrigued as to what ToolsVersion really does...
I didn't say it stops it from compiling, it forces VS2008 to use C# V2 of
the compiler instead of V3.5.
All "ToolsVersion" does is tell VS2008 to load the CSC.EXE from the V2
Framework directory.
Willy.
On 2007-11-20 16:13:37 -0800, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk***@pobox.comsaid:
Liz <li*@tiredofspam.comwrote:
>>It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
Ouch. It got line-wrapped. :(
Hopefully this will work:
<http://msmvps.com/blogs/jon.skeet/archive/2007/11/20/vs2005-and-vs2008-co-existence.aspx>
If
not, this definitely will: http://tinyurl.com/2jq4jv
On 2007-11-20 16:13:37 -0800, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk***@pobox.comsaid: http://msmvps.com/blogs/jon.skeet/ar...existence.aspx
Um...maybe
>
it's just me, but there appear to be some missing inline sections.
Several places, the text reads as if some example of some XML will
follow the text, but nothing's there.
Looks like it didn't take long for the blog spammers to find the entry
either. Oh well...
Peter Duniho <Np*********@NnOwSlPiAnMk.comwrote:
On 2007-11-20 16:13:37 -0800, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk***@pobox.comsaid:
http://msmvps.com/blogs/jon.skeet/ar...existence.aspx
Um...maybe
it's just me, but there appear to be some missing inline sections.
Several places, the text reads as if some example of some XML will
follow the text, but nothing's there.
Hmm... looks alright on my box, in both IE and Firefox. Which browser
are you using? Do you have a specific bit in mind?
Looks like it didn't take long for the blog spammers to find the entry
either. Oh well...
Don't worry, I'll sort those out when I've got a minute.
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
Hmm... changing ToolsVersion to 2.0 doesn't stop it from compiling on
my box. However, adding a <LangVersion>ISO-2</LangVersiondoes. I'm
intrigued as to what ToolsVersion really does...
I didn't say it stops it from compiling, it forces VS2008 to use C# V2 of
the compiler instead of V3.5.
But presumably that should stop it from compiling C# 3 code, which is
what I meant - sorry.
All "ToolsVersion" does is tell VS2008 to load the CSC.EXE from the V2
Framework directory.
Mmm... doesn't seem to be doing anything on my machine :(
Unless that's interacting with the difference between MSBuildToolsPath
and MSBuildBinPath...
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com> http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
On Nov 21, 8:05 am, Peter Duniho <NpOeStPe...@NnOwSlPiAnMk.comwrote:
<snip>
Hmm... looks alright on my box, in both IE and Firefox. Which browser
are you using? Do you have a specific bit in mind?
Ah. Maybe a browser bug. I'm using Mac Safari. I loaded the page in
Mac Opera and it looks fine.
<snip>
Ironically I've only recently started using "div" for this sort of
thing, precisely because I couldn't get my previous mechanism (using
tables) to look nice on both IE and Firefox... and now Safari isn't
coping!
I think I'd be more worried if Mac users were likely to be part of my
main demographic. Google Analytics (running on my home page; I can't
get it to work on my blog for some reason) shows Safari at only 0.63%
of hits. It's very annoying though - but at least I know, in case
someone asks...
Jon
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:MP*********************@msnews.microsoft.com. ..
Willy Denoyette [MVP] <wi*************@telenet.bewrote:
Hmm... changing ToolsVersion to 2.0 doesn't stop it from compiling on
my box. However, adding a <LangVersion>ISO-2</LangVersiondoes. I'm
intrigued as to what ToolsVersion really does...
I didn't say it stops it from compiling, it forces VS2008 to use C# V2
of
the compiler instead of V3.5.
But presumably that should stop it from compiling C# 3 code, which is
what I meant - sorry.
>All "ToolsVersion" does is tell VS2008 to load the CSC.EXE from the V2
Framework directory.
Mmm... doesn't seem to be doing anything on my machine :(
Unless that's interacting with the difference between MSBuildToolsPath
and MSBuildBinPath...
--
Jon Skeet - <sk***@pobox.com>
http://www.pobox.com/~skeet Blog: http://www.msmvps.com/jon.skeet
World class .NET training in the UK: http://iterativetraining.co.uk
Jon,
Here's the output of a rebuild of a VS2008 solution containing two projects:
1. is a VS2008 project (wftaT1) targeting V3.5
2. is a VS2005 project (volsvs) added to the VS2008 solution.
In project 2, I changed ToolsVersion= "3.5" into "2.0", so now the first
line of .csproj looks like this:
<Project DefaultTargets="Build"
xmlns="http://schemas.microsoft.com/developer/msbuild/2003"
ToolsVersion="2.0">
------ Rebuild All started: Project: wfaT1, Configuration: Debug x86 ------
C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v3.5\Csc.exe /noconfig /nowarn:1701,1702
/platform:x86 /errorreport:prompt /define:DEBUG;TRACE /reference:"C:\Program
Files (x86)\Reference Assemblies\Microsoft\Framework\v3.5\System.Core.dl l"
/reference:"C:\Program Files (x86)\Reference
Assemblies\Microsoft\Framework\v3.5\System.Data.Da taSetExtensions.dll"
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Data.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Deployment.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Drawing.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Windows.Forms.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Xml.dll
/reference:"C:\Program Files (x86)\Reference
Assemblies\Microsoft\Framework\v3.5\System.Xml.Lin q.dll" /debug+ /debug:full
/filealign:512 /out:obj\x86\Debug\wfaT1.exe
/resource:obj\x86\Debug\wfaT1.Form1.resources
/resource:obj\x86\Debug\wfaT1.Properties.Resources. resources /target:winexe
/win32manifest:app.manifest Form1.cs Form1.Designer.cs Program.cs
Properties\AssemblyInfo.cs Properties\Resources.Designer.cs
Properties\Settings.Designer.cs
Compile complete -- 0 errors, 0 warnings
wfaT1 -E:\Develop\VS2008Proj\wfaT1\wfaT1\bin\x86\Debug\wf aT1.exe
------ Rebuild All started: Project: volsvs, Configuration: Debug Any
CPU ------
C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0.50727\Csc. exe /noconfig
/nowarn:1701,1702 /platform:x86 /errorreport:prompt /warn:4
/define:DEBUG;TRACE
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Data.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.dll
/reference:C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v2.0. 50727\System.Xml.dll
/debug+ /debug:full /optimize- /out:obj\Debug\volsvs.exe /target:exe
Program.cs Properties\AssemblyInfo.cs
Compile complete -- 0 errors, 0 warnings
volsvs -E:\Develop\vs2005proj\volsvs\volsvs\bin\Debug\vols vs.exe
========== Rebuild All: 2 succeeded, 0 failed, 0 skipped ==========
See, the project (1) is build using csc.exe V3.5 (C# 3), while for (2),
csc.exe is V2.
The great thing here is that you can mix project versions, you can change
project settings from within the VS2008 IDE, the "ToolsVersion" will not be
touched.
Things to keep in mind when setting the ToolsVersion="2.0", are:
- the project file does not become a true VS2008 project file, it remains an
imported project file, and
- CSC V2 does/can not add a manifest to the resulting exe (for exe targets),
this is a problem when targeting Vista and W2K8. You should never run
manifest-less applications on Vista and up, so, here you'll have to add a
manifest by running mt.exe after each build.
Willy.
By adding the ToolsVersion (to avoid the upgrade) I get similar output
(framework 2.0.blah of csc) - however, it also compiles perfectly
happily with C# 3 code - i.e. "var test = 2;", and in a team scenario
that isn't going to work well with colleagues who haven't upgraded
yet.
So it may well be using the 2.0 versions of the satellite tools get
used, but at the core it is using the C# 3 compiler even though it
uses csc 2.0... I don't know how or why...
Marc
And even more bizarrely, if I copy the command-line from the
*successful* build output (including the path with framework 2.0) and
execute directly, then I get a CS0246 (The type or namespace 'var'
could not be found...).
Maybe some environment variable?
Marc
**warning**
One of my test-rigs here was VS2008 only, and while it /worked/ with
the 2.0 flag, it raised a silent warning about not being able to find
the 2.0 SDK path. So I thought "what the heck, lets install the 2.0
SDK".
VS2008 did not like that very much ;-(
Oh well, it only takes a couple of hours to reinstall... and I have
other rigs...
Marc
"Marc Gravell" <ma**********@gmail.comwrote in message
news:e%****************@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
By adding the ToolsVersion (to avoid the upgrade) I get similar output
(framework 2.0.blah of csc) - however, it also compiles perfectly happily
with C# 3 code - i.e. "var test = 2;", and in a team scenario that isn't
going to work well with colleagues who haven't upgraded yet.
So it may well be using the 2.0 versions of the satellite tools get used,
but at the core it is using the C# 3 compiler even though it uses csc
2.0... I don't know how or why...
Marc
Ok, forget about this "ToolsVersion" thing, VS doesn't use the command line
compilers at all. VS loads the CS language services "... \Microsoft Visual
Studio 9.0\VC#\VCSPackages\cslangsvc.dll" in devenv.exe, the CSC output
message is kind of bogus. That means that whatever you do, VS will always
use the latest "compiler", that means that you can't rely on the compiler to
detect C# 3 feature usage in projects that target V2 or V3 projects.
Willy.
On Nov 21, 1:39 pm, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
<snip>
Ok, forget about this "ToolsVersion" thing, VS doesn't use the command line
compilers at all. VS loads the CS language services "... \Microsoft Visual
Studio 9.0\VC#\VCSPackages\cslangsvc.dll" in devenv.exe, the CSC output
message is kind of bogus. That means that whatever you do, VS will always
use the latest "compiler", that means that you can't rely on the compiler to
detect C# 3 feature usage in projects that target V2 or V3 projects.
Okay, so at least we know why it wasn't working then. Glad it wasn't
just me.
As I mention in the blog post, you *can* stop the compiler from using
C# 3 features, but not in a way which works with 2005 - if you specify
a LangVersion of "ISO-2" it will give nice error messages in VS2008,
but not recognise it as a valid value in VS2005 :(
Jon
Cheers for the info. If nothing else, it'll stop me from wasting time
trying ;-p
Marc
"Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comwrote in message
news:c3**********************************@l22g2000 hsc.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 21, 1:39 pm, "Willy Denoyette [MVP]"
<willy.denoye...@telenet.bewrote:
<snip>
>Ok, forget about this "ToolsVersion" thing, VS doesn't use the command
line
compilers at all. VS loads the CS language services "... \Microsoft
Visual
Studio 9.0\VC#\VCSPackages\cslangsvc.dll" in devenv.exe, the CSC output
message is kind of bogus. That means that whatever you do, VS will always
use the latest "compiler", that means that you can't rely on the compiler
to
detect C# 3 feature usage in projects that target V2 or V3 projects.
Okay, so at least we know why it wasn't working then. Glad it wasn't
just me.
As I mention in the blog post, you *can* stop the compiler from using
C# 3 features, but not in a way which works with 2005 - if you specify
a LangVersion of "ISO-2" it will give nice error messages in VS2008,
but not recognise it as a valid value in VS2005 :(
Jon
It's getting messy isn't it? When installing VS2008 on a 64 bit system that
has VS2005 SP1 installed, you'll end with a system that has:
- The framework command line compiler version 8.00.50727.1433 (C# 2.0) for
2.0.50727 of the framework, note that this is the compiler that comes with
SP1 of the Framework!
- The framework command line compiler "version 3.5.21022.8" (C# 3.0) for
version 3.5 of the framework.
The same as above, but in a 64-bit version (you have separate Frameworks
tools for 32 and 64 bit).
- The VS2008 compiler "components" version 3.5.21022.8 (C# 3.0).
- The VS2005 compiler "components" 8.00.50727.0762 (C# 2.0) (SP1 of VS2005!)
Note that for VS there is only one set of compiler components (one per
version), VS is 32 bit code so are the components (DLL's).
We know by now that VS2008 builds exclusively using 3.5.21022.8 (C# 3.0)
components, there is no way to use 8.00.50727.1433 from within the IDE.
VS2005 uses 8.00.50727.0762 (C# 2.0) of the compiler components. That all
means that we cannot build a project using the compiler version
8.00.50727.1433 , that is SP1 of the framework using VS.
This scares me a bit, especially when you know that a number of compiler
bugs may have been corrected in the SP1 binaries. I definitely would like to
see a list of the bugs corrected in SP1 of the framework.
Willy.
On 2007-11-21 00:56:53 -0800, "Jon Skeet [C# MVP]" <sk***@pobox.comsaid:
Ironically I've only recently started using "div" for this sort of
thing, precisely because I couldn't get my previous mechanism (using
tables) to look nice on both IE and Firefox... and now Safari isn't
coping!
I didn't look at the CSS where "code" is defined, but it may be there's
some property that's specifically causing the problem and which could
be implemented some other way. Or possibly it has to do with the
broader layout of the page (such as the other section to the left)
that's causing a Safari bug to manifest itself.
I have successfully used similar techniques in a way that's compatible
with Safari, so I can at least say that it's not the "div" itself
that's causing the problem per se. :)
I think I'd be more worried if Mac users were likely to be part of my
main demographic. Google Analytics (running on my home page; I can't
get it to work on my blog for some reason) shows Safari at only 0.63%
of hits. It's very annoying though - but at least I know, in case
someone asks...
Do your metrics tell you whether that's Mac Safari or Windows Safari?
Or does it lump it all into the same category? Does it tell you the
version?
I'm using Safari 2, though I've been thinking about upgrading to 3 now
that it's had a bit of public wringing out (it had a bunch of bugs,
including security flaws, when it was first released). Maybe the
latest version works better (Safari doesn't handle MSDN's web site very
well either, failing to display the navigation pane properly).
At 0.63%, I think it's possible that I am the only user out of a couple
hundred that visit the blog who is using Mac Safari. :) If your
unique visitors numbers more in tens of thousands or greater, then
frankly I find 0.63% to be quite high...there are more masochists out
there than I might have thought. :)
In any case, I have never been a fan of going to much effort to work
around bugs in third-party software. There a certain situations where
it's required, but I'd say in this case there's no reason for you to
put any additional effort into getting things to look right on Safari.
You could spend quite a lot of time working around bugs in that browser
if you're so-inclined.
Pete
"Peter Duniho" <Np*********@NnOwSlPiAnMk.comwrote in message
news:2007112017461875249-NpOeStPeAdM@NnOwSlPiAnMkcom...
On 2007-11-20 16:13:37 -0800, Jon Skeet [C# MVP] <sk***@pobox.comsaid:
>Liz <li*@tiredofspam.comwrote:
>>>It seems there's quite a lot of hand-waving around this at the moment.
Tonight I'm going to try various different things and write it all up,
either as a blog post or a web site article (any preference, folks?) -
anyone wishing to also experiment is welcome to contribute results :)
>>one way or the other, you'll post a link here? thanks ....
>
<http://msmvps.com/blogs/jon.skeet/archive/2007/11/20/vs2005-and-vs2008-co-existence.aspx>
thanks, Peter .... and Chris S .... and Jon ....
I downloaded and installed Wireshark; now I know how much I know about
networking .. it's depressing ....
that aside, do you have to explicitly UNINSTALL VS 2005 before installing VS
2008 or does the installer handle all of that for you? This thread has been closed and replies have been disabled. Please start a new discussion. Similar topics
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