How is everyone else doing IE7 testing?

[Nathan Sokalski]

As we all know, IE7 is now available. However, it also cannot be installed
side by side with IE6. This makes it very hard to test pages on both
versions using the same machine. I am guessing that most businesses simply
have multiple machines, some with IE6 and some with IE7. However, being a
home developer who develops as both a personal hobby and potential career, I
need a way to test both versions from home with the same machine. The only
suggestion given to me from the microsoft.public newsgroups so far has been
to use VirtualPC, but that would be a lot of extra effort and not be very
efficient anyway. I am surprised that Microsoft has not created anything for
developers/designers that allows them to have IE6 and IE7 installed. If they
are willing to create utilities that prevent AutomaticUpdates from
installing it, I would think they would at least create a utility to run
them side by side if they want more people to start using IE7 (I know of
several universities that removed IE7 from the AutomaticUpdates at the
network level, so anybody not in a technology-related field might not even
know it exists for a while, and many businesses won't be installing it on
their machines for a while as well). I have been looking forward to IE7 and
following the blogs ever since I learned about them, but I'm not going to
give up having IE6 on my machine until people are no longer using it. What
are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine?
Thanks.
--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

[Randy Webb]

Nathan Sokalski said the following on 11/15/2006 12:25 AM:

<snip>

What are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine?

While I do have multiple machines to test on (both at home and work) and
keep my laptop with IE6 on it, check into a dual boot setup where you
can have multiple OS'es. I did that for a while with Win98 and WinXP at
home because I got tired of my wife fussing about me testing on her PC :)

But, as far as MS is concerned, IE6 will be old and dead shortly and the
track record for MS isn't very promising as far as supporting older
products that have an update out. Maybe it will be different for IE7 but
don't count on it.

--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javascript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq
Javascript Best Practices - http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/bestpractices/

[Mark Rae]

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

What are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one
machine?

That's what Virtual PC is for... :-) No need for additional machines - no
need for pointless dual-booting etc...

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtualpc/default.mspx

[Anthony Jones]

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

As we all know, IE7 is now available. However, it also cannot be installed
side by side with IE6. This makes it very hard to test pages on both
versions using the same machine. I am guessing that most businesses simply
have multiple machines, some with IE6 and some with IE7. However, being a
home developer who develops as both a personal hobby and potential career,

I

need a way to test both versions from home with the same machine. The only
suggestion given to me from the microsoft.public newsgroups so far has

been

to use VirtualPC, but that would be a lot of extra effort and not be very
efficient anyway. I am surprised that Microsoft has not created anything

for

developers/designers that allows them to have IE6 and IE7 installed. If

they

are willing to create utilities that prevent AutomaticUpdates from
installing it, I would think they would at least create a utility to run
them side by side if they want more people to start using IE7 (I know of
several universities that removed IE7 from the AutomaticUpdates at the
network level, so anybody not in a technology-related field might not even
know it exists for a while, and many businesses won't be installing it on
their machines for a while as well). I have been looking forward to IE7

and

following the blogs ever since I learned about them, but I'm not going to
give up having IE6 on my machine until people are no longer using it. What
are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine?
Thanks.

Frankly if you only have one machine then upgrade to IE7 and test on that.
It's more likely that things that work on IE6 will be broken on IE7 than the
other way round. Just make sure when developing you avoid using any new
features of IE7.

--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

[Randy Webb]

Anthony Jones said the following on 11/15/2006 5:42 AM:

<snip>

Frankly if you only have one machine then upgrade to IE7 and test on that.

And code to IE7, it's only a matter of time.

It's more likely that things that work on IE6 will be broken on IE7 than the
other way round.

Actually, its the other way around. Things that got fixed in IE7 will
still be broken in IE6.

Just make sure when developing you avoid using any new features of IE7.

Upgrade to IE7 and then ignore it?

--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javascript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq
Javascript Best Practices - http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/bestpractices/

[Jesús López]

I have experienced things working on IE7 and not working on IE6 and
viceversa, things woking on IE6 and not working on IE7.

Regards:

Jesús López

"Anthony Jones" <An*@yadayadayada.comescribió en el mensaje
news:eL**************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

>
"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>As we all know, IE7 is now available. However, it also cannot be
installed
side by side with IE6. This makes it very hard to test pages on both
versions using the same machine. I am guessing that most businesses
simply
have multiple machines, some with IE6 and some with IE7. However, being a
home developer who develops as both a personal hobby and potential
career,

I

>need a way to test both versions from home with the same machine. The
only
suggestion given to me from the microsoft.public newsgroups so far has

been

>to use VirtualPC, but that would be a lot of extra effort and not be very
efficient anyway. I am surprised that Microsoft has not created anything

for

>developers/designers that allows them to have IE6 and IE7 installed. If

they

>are willing to create utilities that prevent AutomaticUpdates from
installing it, I would think they would at least create a utility to run
them side by side if they want more people to start using IE7 (I know of
several universities that removed IE7 from the AutomaticUpdates at the
network level, so anybody not in a technology-related field might not
even
know it exists for a while, and many businesses won't be installing it on
their machines for a while as well). I have been looking forward to IE7

and

>following the blogs ever since I learned about them, but I'm not going to
give up having IE6 on my machine until people are no longer using it.
What
are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine?
Thanks.

Frankly if you only have one machine then upgrade to IE7 and test on that.
It's more likely that things that work on IE6 will be broken on IE7 than
the
other way round. Just make sure when developing you avoid using any new
features of IE7.

>--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

[Laurent Bugnion]

Hi,

Jesús López wrote:

I have experienced things working on IE7 and not working on IE6 and
viceversa, things woking on IE6 and not working on IE7.

Regards:

Jesús López

The IE team deliberately broke some things which worked on IE6 because
they were not compatible with the standards. This is especially true in
CSS. I think it was a clever and courageous decision. So as a rule of
thumb you can say that:

- What worked on IE6 and doesn't on IE7 was wrong to start with, and
should be corrected.
- What works on IE7 and doesn't on IE6 is just compliant with the
standards, which IE6 doesn't follow.

Of course IE7 is new, so it will have bugs.

My best memory from Mix06 is IE's product manager publicly apologizing
for what they did wrong in IE6 (5, 4...)

HTH,
Laurent
--
Laurent Bugnion, GalaSoft
Software engineering: http://www.galasoft-LB.ch
Private/Malaysia: http://mypage.bluewin.ch/lbugnion
Support children in Calcutta: http://www.calcutta-espoir.ch

[C A Upsdell]

Laurent Bugnion wrote:

>
- What worked on IE6 and doesn't on IE7 was wrong to start with, and
should be corrected.
- What works on IE7 and doesn't on IE6 is just compliant with the
standards, which IE6 doesn't follow.

My experience has been that, in some cases, different code is required
for IE6 and IE7, that 'fixing' the IE6 code in a way that makes it work
on IE7 may make it no longer work on IE6. So parallel testing for IE6
and IE7 is still necessary, and conditional comments continue to be a
vital tool.

Of course IE7 is new, so it will have bugs.

One problem is that Microsoft traditionally does not fix bugs, except
for security bugs, in minor updates. E.g., Microsoft may update IE7 to
fix security bugs, but not to fix (say) CSS bugs. So if IE7 misbehaves,
it will be necessary to code around it until IE8 (hopefully) comes out.

[Laurent Bugnion]

Hi,

C A Upsdell wrote:

My experience has been that, in some cases, different code is required
for IE6 and IE7, that 'fixing' the IE6 code in a way that makes it work
on IE7 may make it no longer work on IE6. So parallel testing for IE6
and IE7 is still necessary, and conditional comments continue to be a
vital tool.

Only if you wish to continue to support IE6. The need for that should be
evaluated on each case, I know that I won't continue to support IE6 for
my personal web applications, but I probably will have to support it for
the apps I develop in my firm. That said, I never had to resort to any
CSS tricks, I preferred to cancel (or modify) a requirement rather than
to use tricks. Of course I am lucky because the people in our marketing
department are reasonable, and accept the "not feasible in a standard
way" answer as a valid one.

>Of course IE7 is new, so it will have bugs.

One problem is that Microsoft traditionally does not fix bugs, except
for security bugs, in minor updates. E.g., Microsoft may update IE7 to
fix security bugs, but not to fix (say) CSS bugs. So if IE7 misbehaves,
it will be necessary to code around it until IE8 (hopefully) comes out.

I have a different experience. In one case at least (one case I know
of), Microsoft fixed a memory leak reported by us in an update
distributed through a security update this year. The advantage of fixing
bugs in security updates is that they are more likely to be installed ;-)

HTH,
Laurent
--
Laurent Bugnion, GalaSoft
Software engineering: http://www.galasoft-LB.ch
Private/Malaysia: http://mypage.bluewin.ch/lbugnion
Support children in Calcutta: http://www.calcutta-espoir.ch

[Nathan Sokalski]

Do you know why Web Developers & Designers test their pages/sites on
multiple browsers?! They do it because there will never be a guarantee that
if it works in one browser it will work in another. Whether a page is more
likely to have problems in IE6 or IE7 is irrelevant here, because unless you
KNOW that a page works in both, you should test.
--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

"Anthony Jones" <An*@yadayadayada.comwrote in message
news:eL**************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

>
"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>As we all know, IE7 is now available. However, it also cannot be
installed
side by side with IE6. This makes it very hard to test pages on both
versions using the same machine. I am guessing that most businesses
simply
have multiple machines, some with IE6 and some with IE7. However, being a
home developer who develops as both a personal hobby and potential
career,

I

>need a way to test both versions from home with the same machine. The
only
suggestion given to me from the microsoft.public newsgroups so far has

been

>to use VirtualPC, but that would be a lot of extra effort and not be very
efficient anyway. I am surprised that Microsoft has not created anything

for

>developers/designers that allows them to have IE6 and IE7 installed. If

they

>are willing to create utilities that prevent AutomaticUpdates from
installing it, I would think they would at least create a utility to run
them side by side if they want more people to start using IE7 (I know of
several universities that removed IE7 from the AutomaticUpdates at the
network level, so anybody not in a technology-related field might not
even
know it exists for a while, and many businesses won't be installing it on
their machines for a while as well). I have been looking forward to IE7

and

>following the blogs ever since I learned about them, but I'm not going to
give up having IE6 on my machine until people are no longer using it.
What
are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine?
Thanks.

Frankly if you only have one machine then upgrade to IE7 and test on that.
It's more likely that things that work on IE6 will be broken on IE7 than
the
other way round. Just make sure when developing you avoid using any new
features of IE7.

>--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

[Nathan Sokalski]

I could be wrong, but from what I understand VirtualPC is for multiple
operating systems. I do not want multiple operating systems on my machine, I
also don't want to install XP a second time and need to login twice in order
to use both browsers (not to mention that would mean each browser would be
running under a different username). Does anybody REALLY want to recreate
their whole system setup just to use another browser? Should we really need
to do that anyway?
--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

"Mark Rae" <ma**@markNOSPAMrae.comwrote in message
news:u1**************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>What are all of you doing as far as testing IE7 when limited to one
machine?

That's what Virtual PC is for... :-) No need for additional machines - no
need for pointless dual-booting etc...

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/virtualpc/default.mspx

[Mark Rae]

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:eu**************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>I could be wrong, but from what I understand VirtualPC is for multiple
operating systems.

That's right.

I do not want multiple operating systems on my machine,

So don't do it, then...Nobody's forcing you to do anything...

I also don't want to install XP a second time and need to login twice in
order to use both browsers

So decide whether you want IE6 or IE7 - you obviously can't have both
installed on the same machine...

(not to mention that would mean each browser would be running under a
different username).

??? No it wouldn't... Why would it mean that...?

Does anybody REALLY want to recreate their whole system setup just to use
another browser?

I have a virtual machine just for cross-browser testing - currently, it has
IE6, FireFox 2, Netscape 8.12, Opera 9 and Mozilla 1.7.3.

It takes about 10 seconds to launch and maybe another three seconds to log
in under exactly the same account as the host machine (or not...).

It also means that I can e.g. run a web app in debug mode on my host
machine, browse to it from one of the browsers on the virtual machine and
actually step through the code - same scenario with the various browsers
installed on another virtual machine running SuSE Linux, and the various
browsers installed on my Mac Mini...

Should we really need to do that anyway?

You don't *NEED* to do anything at all. You asked how people are currently
doing cross-browser testing, and the above is how I'm currently doing it.

[Anthony Jones]

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

Do you know why Web Developers & Designers test their pages/sites on
multiple browsers?! They do it because there will never be a guarantee

that

if it works in one browser it will work in another. Whether a page is more
likely to have problems in IE6 or IE7 is irrelevant here, because unless

you

KNOW that a page works in both, you should test.

Of course and if your concerned that it works in IE6 as well as IE7 then you
will probably want to test in Firefox (1.5 and 2), Netscape, Opera etc as
well. The established professionals take this as read.

However you stated that you only had one machine and setting up (possibly
having to purchase) a virtual machine was too much of a faf. You also
stated that you were going to stick with IE6 for a while. IMO that would be
a mistake go to IE7.

If you want to do things professionally buy a test machine, some extra
copies of appropriate OSes and and some ghost software. Now you can test
your various target environments properly.

[Mark Rae]

"Anthony Jones" <An*@yadayadayada.comwrote in message
news:OB**************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

Of course and if your concerned that it works in IE6 as well as IE7 then
you
will probably want to test in Firefox (1.5 and 2), Netscape, Opera etc as
well. The established professionals take this as read.

Obviously.

However you stated that you only had one machine and setting up (possibly
having to purchase) a virtual machine was too much of a faf. You also
stated that you were going to stick with IE6 for a while. IMO that would
be
a mistake go to IE7.

I agree, but simply can't understand the problem with Virtual PC. It's free
to download, takes about a minute to install, and then you have an unlimited
amount of virtual machines (subject obviously to hard disk space and
licensing *) which you can create and destroy as your business needs
dictate...

If you require nothing more than cross-browser testing on Windows XP, this
would be a one-off exercise which would take less than an hour...

If you want to do things professionally buy a test machine, some extra
copies of appropriate OSes and and some ghost software. Now you can test
your various target environments properly.

* Or, alternatively, get a basic MSDN subscription, which will allow you to
deploy as many copies of the various flavours of Windows on as many machines
(real or virtual) as you like, so long as this deployment is for development
and/or testing purposes...

[Randy Webb]

Anthony Jones posted the following on 11/16/2006 4:46 AM:

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

>Do you know why Web Developers & Designers test their pages/sites on
multiple browsers?! They do it because there will never be a guarantee

that

>if it works in one browser it will work in another. Whether a page is more
likely to have problems in IE6 or IE7 is irrelevant here, because unless

you

>KNOW that a page works in both, you should test.

Of course and if your concerned that it works in IE6 as well as IE7 then you
will probably want to test in Firefox (1.5 and 2), Netscape, Opera etc as
well. The established professionals take this as read.

And most "established professionals" know that Netscape 8 uses the
Mozilla engine and the IE engine to render/process with so testing in FF
and then NS8 is moot.

However you stated that you only had one machine and setting up (possibly
having to purchase) a virtual machine was too much of a faf. You also
stated that you were going to stick with IE6 for a while. IMO that would be
a mistake go to IE7.

Everybody said the same thing about IE6. To date, my personal experience
has been that when the browser is first released to the public, stay
away from it as the majority of users will still be using the previous
version. That was true when going from IE4 to 5.0, from 5.0 to 5.5, from
5.5 to 6.0 and now from 6.0 to 7.0.

The converse is true with Opera and FF though where the users tend to
update them pretty frequent as they chose to use that browser, most IE
users don't have a choice (either don't have one or don't know they have
one).

If you want to do things professionally buy a test machine, some extra
copies of appropriate OSes and and some ghost software. Now you can test
your various target environments properly.

Really? So to do things "professionally" I need a second machine, some
extra copies of OSes and ghost software? I do my work professionally and
I do it from the same PC I "play" on. You can post a URL to

comp.lang.javascript,
comp.info.www.authoring.html and comp.infosystems.www.authoring.stylesheets

And ask for a critique or how it looks in other browsers and the
regulars there are more than glad to test it for you. Some are more
critical than others.

So no, you don't have to spend a ton of money to do things
"professionally", you just have to know how to get it done. I have been
writing - professionally - cross-browser/cross-OS scripts for a little
over 6 years now and I have yet to own a mac.

--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javascript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq
Javascript Best Practices - http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/bestpractices/

[Anthony Jones]

"Randy Webb" <Hi************@aol.comwrote in message
news:vr********************@telcove.net...

Anthony Jones posted the following on 11/16/2006 4:46 AM:

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

Do you know why Web Developers & Designers test their pages/sites on
multiple browsers?! They do it because there will never be a guarantee

that

if it works in one browser it will work in another. Whether a page is

more

likely to have problems in IE6 or IE7 is irrelevant here, because

unless

you

KNOW that a page works in both, you should test.

Of course and if your concerned that it works in IE6 as well as IE7 then

you

will probably want to test in Firefox (1.5 and 2), Netscape, Opera etc

as

well. The established professionals take this as read.

And most "established professionals" know that Netscape 8 uses the
Mozilla engine and the IE engine to render/process with so testing in FF
and then NS8 is moot.

Cool we can take one of those out of the list then.

However you stated that you only had one machine and setting up

(possibly

having to purchase) a virtual machine was too much of a faf. You also
stated that you were going to stick with IE6 for a while. IMO that

would be

a mistake go to IE7.

Everybody said the same thing about IE6. To date, my personal experience
has been that when the browser is first released to the public, stay
away from it as the majority of users will still be using the previous
version. That was true when going from IE4 to 5.0, from 5.0 to 5.5, from
5.5 to 6.0 and now from 6.0 to 7.0.

The difference is that in many cases it's just going to arrive via windows
update and much has been made of IE6's past security difficencies. IMO IE7
will have a much faster uptake than the IE5/5.5 to IE6 transition. If you
only have one machine put IE7 on it.

>
The converse is true with Opera and FF though where the users tend to
update them pretty frequent as they chose to use that browser, most IE
users don't have a choice (either don't have one or don't know they have
one).

If you want to do things professionally buy a test machine, some extra
copies of appropriate OSes and and some ghost software. Now you can

test

your various target environments properly.

Really? So to do things "professionally" I need a second machine, some
extra copies of OSes and ghost software? I do my work professionally and
I do it from the same PC I "play" on. You can post a URL to

comp.lang.javascript,
comp.info.www.authoring.html and

comp.infosystems.www.authoring.stylesheets

>
And ask for a critique or how it looks in other browsers and the
regulars there are more than glad to test it for you. Some are more
critical than others.

Yeah "professional" is probably too broad a term and it really does depend
on who your customers are and what they are going to do with the site you
are developing and... the list goes on. If my customers asked me how I
tested that my application works on multiple browsers, I'm fairly sure they
would be dismayed by 'Oh I made it publically available for all and sundry
to see, posted a link to it in some newsgroups and asked people the to come
and hack around with it'. I'm certain that they won't consider that to be
"professional".

So no, you don't have to spend a ton of money to do things
"professionally", you just have to know how to get it done. I have been
writing - professionally - cross-browser/cross-OS scripts for a little
over 6 years now and I have yet to own a mac.

Well done.

>
--
Randy
Chance Favors The Prepared Mind
comp.lang.javascript FAQ - http://jibbering.com/faq
Javascript Best Practices -

http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com/bestpractices/

[Mark Rae]

"Anthony Jones" <An*@yadayadayada.comwrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...

If my customers asked me how I
tested that my application works on multiple browsers, I'm fairly sure
they
would be dismayed by 'Oh I made it publically available for all and sundry
to see, posted a link to it in some newsgroups and asked people the to
come
and hack around with it'. I'm certain that they won't consider that to be
"professional".

I couldn't agree more! Anyone who believes that the above constitutes
testing really isn't worth bothering with...

[Dave Anderson]

Laurent Bugnion wrote:

- What worked on IE6 and doesn't on IE7 was wrong to start with, and
should be corrected.
- What works on IE7 and doesn't on IE6 is just compliant with the
standards, which IE6 doesn't follow.

Of course IE7 is new, so it will have bugs.

It looks like I got a new version of jscript.dll when I upgraded to IE7, but
the Number.toFixed() bug still has not been fixed. Pathetic. I otherwise
like IE7 so far.

--
Dave Anderson

Unsolicited commercial email will be read at a cost of $500 per message. Use
of this email address implies consent to these terms.

[Dave Anderson]

Randy Webb wrote:

To date, my personal experience has been that when the browser
is first released to the public, stay away from it as the
majority of users will still be using the previous version.
That was true when going from IE4 to 5.0, from 5.0 to 5.5,
from 5.5 to 6.0 and now from 6.0 to 7.0.

What is different this time is that Microsoft plans to distribute the
browser as a high-priority update:

"To help our customers become more secure and up-to-date,
Microsoft will distribute Internet Explorer 7 as a high-
priority update via Automatic Updates soon after the final
version of the browser is released for Windows XP later
this year.[1]"

Furthermore, Microsoft advised companies to deploy the Blocker Toolkit
before November 2006, so this update could be imminent. Lastly, Windows
Vista users will not have IE6. I expect IE7 adoption will be much faster
than IE6. But that's just my opinion.

--
Dave Anderson

Unsolicited commercial email will be read at a cost of $500 per message. Use
of this email address implies consent to these terms.

[d d]

This blocker toolkit you speak of. That stops you being
forced to get the IE7 update? I have Virtual Machines
setup with IE4, 5, 5.5, 6 and I don't want any of them to
receive IE7. They range from 98 to XPsp2.

Do you have a link? I realize it might be earlier in this
thread but yours is the only message I see in this thread.

~dd

"Dave Anderson" <NY**********@spammotel.comwrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

"To help our customers become more secure and up-to-date,
Microsoft will distribute Internet Explorer 7 as a high-
priority update via Automatic Updates soon after the final
version of the browser is released for Windows XP later
this year.[1]"

Furthermore, Microsoft advised companies to deploy the Blocker Toolkit
before November 2006, so this update could be imminent. Lastly, Windows
Vista users will not have IE6. I expect IE7 adoption will be much faster
than IE6. But that's just my opinion.
--
Dave Anderson

[Dave Anderson]

d d wrote:

This blocker toolkit you speak of. That stops you being
forced to get the IE7 update? I have Virtual Machines
setup with IE4, 5, 5.5, 6 and I don't want any of them to
receive IE7. They range from 98 to XPsp2.

Do you have a link? I realize it might be earlier in this
thread but yours is the only message I see in this thread.

Internet Explorer 7 Automatic Updates distribution process:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ie/...s/default.mspx

Toolkit to Disable Automatic Delivery of Internet Explorer 7:
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...D-869B4A90159C


--
Dave Anderson

Unsolicited commercial email will be read at a cost of $500 per message. Use
of this email address implies consent to these terms.

[Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM]

" d d" <[e-mail] in message
news:uj**************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

This blocker toolkit you speak of. That stops you being
forced to get the IE7 update? I have Virtual Machines
setup with IE4, 5, 5.5, 6 and I don't want any of them to
receive IE7. They range from 98 to XPsp2.

Do you have a link? I realize it might be earlier in this
thread but yours is the only message I see in this thread.

~dd

"Dave Anderson" <NY**********@spammotel.comwrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP06.phx.gbl...

> "To help our customers become more secure and up-to-date,
Microsoft will distribute Internet Explorer 7 as a high-
priority update via Automatic Updates soon after the final
version of the browser is released for Windows XP later
this year.[1]"

Furthermore, Microsoft advised companies to deploy the Blocker Toolkit
before November 2006, so this update could be imminent. Lastly, Windows
Vista users will not have IE6. I expect IE7 adoption will be much faster
than IE6. But that's just my opinion.
--
Dave Anderson

There is no forced update to IE7. The user is given an opportunity to say
No or to say Ask again later.

--
Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM
http://www.fjsmjs.com
Answer in newsgroup. Don't send mail.

[Dave Anderson]

Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM wrote:

There is no forced update to IE7. The user is given an
opportunity to say No or to say Ask again later.

I don't think I said anyone would be forced to update, though it's a moot
point for anyone who gets a new PC with Vista installed.

I *do* intend to imply that many users, faced with an update labeled "hig
priority", will affirm, given how weary we all have gotten fighting with
exploits to security vulnerabilities. Do you really think a large segment of
the public differentiates between high priority updates and security
patches? There is certainly no point in explaining it to my mother -- I long
ago told her to apply everything offered by Windows Update, if only because
I didn't need a call about it every Tuesday.


--
Dave Anderson

Unsolicited commercial email will be read at a cost of $500 per message. Use
of this email address implies consent to these terms.

[Nathan Sokalski]

Nobody is "forced" to update to IE7, but because many people have Automatic
Updates set to install high priority updates automatically in the
background, there will be many people who end up coming home one day to
unexpectedly find a new browser on their computer. Some people don't even
know they have Automatic Updates set to this setting, because it all happens
while they are at work, in bed, or just away from their computer. Some
people just say "Well, I guess my computer had a little glitch or
something". I know that if I hadn't installed the blocker on my parents'
computers, I would have gotten a call from them the very next day.
Guaranteed.
--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

"Dave Anderson" <NY**********@spammotel.comwrote in message
news:12*************@corp.supernews.com...

Frank Saunders, MS-MVP OE/WM wrote:

>There is no forced update to IE7. The user is given an
opportunity to say No or to say Ask again later.

I don't think I said anyone would be forced to update, though it's a moot
point for anyone who gets a new PC with Vista installed.

I *do* intend to imply that many users, faced with an update labeled "hig
priority", will affirm, given how weary we all have gotten fighting with
exploits to security vulnerabilities. Do you really think a large segment
of the public differentiates between high priority updates and security
patches? There is certainly no point in explaining it to my mother -- I
long ago told her to apply everything offered by Windows Update, if only
because I didn't need a call about it every Tuesday.


--
Dave Anderson

Unsolicited commercial email will be read at a cost of $500 per message.
Use of this email address implies consent to these terms.

[Joe Fawcett]

"Nathan Sokalski" <nj********@hotmail.comwrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...

As we all know, IE7 is now available. However, it also cannot be installed
side by side with IE6. This makes it very hard to test pages on both
versions using the same machine. I am guessing that most businesses simply
have multiple machines, some with IE6 and some with IE7. However, being a
home developer who develops as both a personal hobby and potential career,
I need a way to test both versions from home with the same machine. The
only suggestion given to me from the microsoft.public newsgroups so far
has been to use VirtualPC, but that would be a lot of extra effort and not
be very efficient anyway. I am surprised that Microsoft has not created
anything for developers/designers that allows them to have IE6 and IE7
installed. If they are willing to create utilities that prevent
AutomaticUpdates from installing it, I would think they would at least
create a utility to run them side by side if they want more people to
start using IE7 (I know of several universities that removed IE7 from the
AutomaticUpdates at the network level, so anybody not in a
technology-related field might not even know it exists for a while, and
many businesses won't be installing it on their machines for a while as
well). I have been looking forward to IE7 and following the blogs ever
since I learned about them, but I'm not going to give up having IE6 on my
machine until people are no longer using it. What are all of you doing as
far as testing IE7 when limited to one machine? Thanks.
--
Nathan Sokalski
nj********@hotmail.com
http://www.nathansokalski.com/

I don't see why Virtual PC is difficult or inefficient. It's a relatively
easy install, free, and requires a decent amount of disk-space and RAM.
Oncce you have a couple of OSs set up you'll wonder how you did without it.
I have different environments that can be trashed and re-cretaed, e.g. a
Visual Studio 2003 and SQL Server 2000 that I use for maintaining some of
our older code, different versions of IE are easy this way.
Alternatively we also use www.browsercam.com but that is more effort and
only used when a project is near completion rather than min ute by minute
changes.

--

Joe Fawcett (MVP - XML)
http://joe.fawcett.name

[dotNuttah]

Randy Webb wrote:

>
<snip>

But, as far as MS is concerned, IE6 will be old and dead shortly and
the track record for MS isn't very promising as far as supporting
older products that have an update out. Maybe it will be different
for IE7 but don't count on it.

Old and dead except for the people who still use Win2000. Old and dead
except for the people who uninstalled IE7 because it doesn't work or
otherwise broke their system. In a (non-technical) forum where I post a lot
there are rather a few people giving that last action as their policy
regarding IE7. It was a step backward for them and they're glad to get rid
of it.