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P: n/a
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.
Nov 19 '05 #1
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67 Replies


P: n/a
Doesn't for me... can open and create a new project quite quickly... < 1 min
for certain.
Sounds like something on your machine. Try your AV's active scanning
settings once.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #2

P: n/a
3minutes or seconds?
Patrick

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #3

P: n/a
WJ
Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.

John

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #4

P: n/a
You mentioned only a few f the variables involved in the mix. Here are a few
more:

Processor Speed
Running Tasks (including programs, services, and background tasks)
Disk Fragmentation
Anti-virus software
Registry size
Number of Environment variables loaded
Other memory-consuming issues (memory leaks, for example, which would lower
the amount of available memory)
Viruses, Trojan Horses, Spyware
BIOS

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #5

P: n/a
MINUTES!

"Patirck Ige" wrote:
3minutes or seconds?
Patrick

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #6

P: n/a
> Processor Speed

2GHz
Running Tasks (including programs, services, and background tasks)
Minimal system processes
Disk Fragmentation
Brand new image
Anti-virus software
N/A
Registry size
Typical for corporate workstation w/Office
Number of Environment variables loaded
??
Other memory-consuming issues (memory leaks, for example, which would lower
the amount of available memory)
No other applications running (besides O/S)
Viruses, Trojan Horses, Spyware
Unlikely (these are corporate boxes that re-imaged frequently)
BIOS
Up to date (brand new HP machines).

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Big things are made up of
lots of little things.

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #7

P: n/a
I know it's not supposed to take that long, hence my question.

Something on my machine?? Really, you think?

"Curt_C [MVP]" wrote:
Doesn't for me... can open and create a new project quite quickly... < 1 min
for certain.
Sounds like something on your machine. Try your AV's active scanning
settings once.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #8

P: n/a
Dont be a dink...
Did you try any the AV settings? Have you tried anything? You're post is the
equivalent of "somethings wrong, you guess" and you aren't likely to find the
answer without more details.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com

"Scott M." wrote:
I know it's not supposed to take that long, hence my question.

Something on my machine?? Really, you think?

"Curt_C [MVP]" wrote:
Doesn't for me... can open and create a new project quite quickly... < 1 min
for certain.
Sounds like something on your machine. Try your AV's active scanning
settings once.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #9

P: n/a
Maybe VS.Net or IIS is trying to make a network request to some unknown
place and is waiting for a time-out. Active Directory and some windows
security are ideal candidates.

Christoph
Nov 19 '05 #10

P: n/a
I don't want to get into a flame war with you Curt. I provided as much
information as I thought was necessary in my post. It was your reply that
was useless information (i.e. sounds like you are having a problem - duh!).

Yes, I did try shutting down the AV.

"Curt_C [MVP]" wrote:
Dont be a dink...
Did you try any the AV settings? Have you tried anything? You're post is the
equivalent of "somethings wrong, you guess" and you aren't likely to find the
answer without more details.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com

"Scott M." wrote:
I know it's not supposed to take that long, hence my question.

Something on my machine?? Really, you think?

"Curt_C [MVP]" wrote:
Doesn't for me... can open and create a new project quite quickly... < 1 min
for certain.
Sounds like something on your machine. Try your AV's active scanning
settings once.

--
Curt Christianson
site: http://www.darkfalz.com
blog: http://blog.darkfalz.com
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
> with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
> Application on http://localhost?
>
> It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott M.
>

Nov 19 '05 #11

P: n/a
Why would it do that if I'm attempting to make the new web project on the
localhost?

BTW: The project does successfully get built, it just takes several minutes
to happen. Also, I am logged on as an Admin.

Thanks.

"Christoph Wienands" wrote:
Maybe VS.Net or IIS is trying to make a network request to some unknown
place and is waiting for a time-out. Active Directory and some windows
security are ideal candidates.

Christoph

Nov 19 '05 #12

P: n/a
I have. No effect.

"WJ" wrote:
Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.

John

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
Application on http://localhost?

It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.

Thanks,

Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #13

P: n/a
....And, my account as well as the ASPNET account are members of the:

DebuggerUsers Group
VS Developers Group

"Scott M." wrote:
Why would it do that if I'm attempting to make the new web project on the
localhost?

BTW: The project does successfully get built, it just takes several minutes
to happen. Also, I am logged on as an Admin.

Thanks.

"Christoph Wienands" wrote:
Maybe VS.Net or IIS is trying to make a network request to some unknown
place and is waiting for a time-out. Active Directory and some windows
security are ideal candidates.

Christoph

Nov 19 '05 #14

P: n/a
Is your hard drive in good condition ?
Run a hard drive integrity check.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
I have. No effect.

"WJ" wrote:
Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.

John

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
> with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
> Application on http://localhost?
>
> It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott M.
>


Nov 19 '05 #15

P: n/a
This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.

The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
everything sails.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
Is your hard drive in good condition ?
Run a hard drive integrity check.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
I have. No effect.

"WJ" wrote:
Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them
running.
These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.

John

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro.
> (P4's
> with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET
> Web
> Application on http://localhost?
>
> It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott M.
>


Nov 19 '05 #16

P: n/a
Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?

My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.

With VS 2003 it took about the same time.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate workstations. As
I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs. The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web application
takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything sails.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
Is your hard drive in good condition ?
Run a hard drive integrity check.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
I have. No effect.

"WJ" wrote:

Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.

John

"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
> with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
> Application on http://localhost?
>
> It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Scott M.
>



Nov 19 '05 #17

P: n/a
What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
earlier in this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have
been using .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
out how quickly it works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so
long for me and I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.

Thanks anyway.

"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?

My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.

With VS 2003 it took about the same time.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy
specs.

The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the
web application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
everything sails.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
Is your hard drive in good condition ?
Run a hard drive integrity check.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
I have. No effect.

"WJ" wrote:

> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them
> running.
> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>
> John
>
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro.
> > (P4's
> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new
> > ASP.NET Web
> > Application on http://localhost?
> >
> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
> > not
> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Scott M.
> >
>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #18

P: n/a
re:
I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl... What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in this
thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been using
.NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it works
for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm telling you that
the specs are not the issue.

Thanks anyway. "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?

My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.

With VS 2003 it took about the same time.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate workstations.
As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.

The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything sails.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
Is your hard drive in good condition ?
Run a hard drive integrity check.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>I have. No effect.
>
> "WJ" wrote:
>
>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>
>> John
>>
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >
>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>> >
>> > Thanks,
>> >
>> > Scott M.
>> >
>>
>>
>>



Nov 19 '05 #19

P: n/a
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am
saying that ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You
telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not,
in any way, mean that MY problem is specs. Not to mention that the systems
I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust than the system you are
talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this isn't a spec
issue.

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The
system is fast in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
project. Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
communicating and the configuration of the two products configured properly,
it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration
issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get
good results and these machines have those specs.

Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the
problem.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
re:
I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.


That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
earlier in this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I
have been using .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking
to find out how quickly it works for you. I'm trying to find out why
it's taking so long for me and I'm telling you that the specs are not the
issue.

Thanks anyway.

"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?

My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.

With VS 2003 it took about the same time.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy
specs.

The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating
the web application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
made, everything sails.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>
>
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>I have. No effect.
>>
>> "WJ" wrote:
>>
>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them
>>> running.
>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro.
>>> > (P4's
>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new
>>> > ASP.NET Web
>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>> >
>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
>>> > not
>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go
>>> > by.
>>> >
>>> > Thanks,
>>> >
>>> > Scott M.
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #20

P: n/a
On Wed, 5 Oct 2005 20:05:50 -0500, "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com>
wrote:

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.


I have a hunch the problem is network related. Most long operations
like you describe are because of Windows going off and trying to find
some netbios name that doesn't exist anymore or trying to do a reverse
name lookup on the computer name your computer used to have 6 months
ago.

I'm not sure how I'd track this down exactly, but I think I'd try some
tools from sysinternals.com to monitor registry, file, and network
access. I might even try a fresh install of IIS and give myself a new
metabase.

--
Scott
http://www.OdeToCode.com/blogs/scott/
Nov 19 '05 #21

P: n/a
re:
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re: You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in any
way, mean that MY problem is specs.
No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re: Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re: it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm talking
about).
That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
isn't a spec issue.

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is fast
in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since creating a
web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the two
products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS .NET
configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of experience I've
had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and these
machines have those specs.

Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
re:
I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.


That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been using
.NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm telling
you that the specs are not the issue.

Thanks anyway. "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?

My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.

With VS 2003 it took about the same time.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate workstations.
> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.

> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
> sails.
> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>I have. No effect.
>>>
>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>
>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>>
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>> >
>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks,
>>>> >
>>>> > Scott M.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #22

P: n/a
One last suggestion :

Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.

Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating applications.
If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the problem's source.
( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow through... )

If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app creation speed.
If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the problem's source.

If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the problem.

That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.

Good luck!
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
re:
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.


Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in any
way, mean that MY problem is specs.


No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re:
Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue


Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
talking about).


That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
isn't a spec issue.

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is fast
in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since creating
a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS
.NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
results and these machines have those specs.

Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
re:
I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.

That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been using
.NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm telling
you that the specs are not the issue.

Thanks anyway. "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>
> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>
> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>
>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>> sails.
>
>
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> ======================================
>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>
>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #23

P: n/a
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
re:
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.


Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in any
way, mean that MY problem is specs.


No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re:
Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue


Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm talking
about).


That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
isn't a spec issue.

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is fast
in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since creating a
web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the two
products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS .NET
configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of experience I've
had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and these
machines have those specs.

Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
re:
I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.

That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.

I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been using
.NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm telling
you that the specs are not the issue.

Thanks anyway. "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>
> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>
> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate workstations.
>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>
>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>> sails.
>
>
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> ======================================
>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>
>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>> >
>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #24

P: n/a
"last suggestion"? When did you make your first suggestion? Again, I think
you might just want to sit this one out. You are asking me to tear down a
house to find out why a door was creaking. You haven't offered one thing to
look at or check.

I know that I could re-build a machine from scratch, but gee, that's why I
wanted to some help on things I could check first.

It's ok to say you don't know if you don't know. Even better, you don't
have to respond to posts if you don't have anything valuable to contribute.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
One last suggestion :

Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.

Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating applications.
If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the problem's source.
( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow through... )

If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app creation speed.
If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the problem's source.

If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the problem.

That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.

Good luck!
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
re:
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.


Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in any
way, mean that MY problem is specs.


No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re:
Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue


Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
talking about).


That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
isn't a spec issue.

I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is fast
in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since creating
a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS
.NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
results and these machines have those specs.

Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
re:
>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.

That doesn't sound right.

All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.

I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
which is even slower-performing than my main system,
yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.

In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.

Make of those facts what you will.

If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>
> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been using
> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm telling
> you that the specs are not the issue.
>
> Thanks anyway.

> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>
>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>
>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>
>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>>> sails.
>>
>>
>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>
>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #25

P: n/a
Good bye, Scott.

I wish you luck in solving your problem.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
re:
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.


Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in
> any
> way, mean that MY problem is specs.


No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re:
> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue


Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
> talking
> about).


That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
> isn't a spec issue.
>
> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is
> fast
> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
> creating a
> web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
> two
> products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS
> .NET
> configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of experience
> I've
> had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and these
> machines have those specs.
>
> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.


> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> re:
>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>
>> That doesn't sound right.
>>
>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>
>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>
>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>>
>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>
>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>
>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>>> using
>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>>> telling
>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway.

>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>
>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>
>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>>>>> workstations.
>>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>
>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>>>>> sails.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #26

P: n/a
Like I said just now, Scott : good luck solving your problem.

I'm sorry you have to resort to flaming me in order
to feel better about your frustrations with your problem.

In the end, you'll wind up doing what I suggested.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:02**********************************@microsof t.com...
"last suggestion"? When did you make your first suggestion? Again, I think
you might just want to sit this one out. You are asking me to tear down a
house to find out why a door was creaking. You haven't offered one thing to
look at or check.

I know that I could re-build a machine from scratch, but gee, that's why I
wanted to some help on things I could check first.

It's ok to say you don't know if you don't know. Even better, you don't
have to respond to posts if you don't have anything valuable to contribute.
"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
One last suggestion :

Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.

Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating applications.
If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the problem's source.
( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow through... )

If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app creation speed.
If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the problem's source.

If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the problem.

That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.

Good luck!
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> re:
>>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>
> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
> configured for the answer.
>
> You have 3 things at play here :
>
> 1. Your hardware configuration
> 2. Your software configuration
> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>
> You'll need to check all of them.
>
> re:
>> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in
>> any
>> way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>
> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>
> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>
> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
> of items which need individual configuration.
>
> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>
> re:
>> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> configuration
>> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>
> Your original phrasing was :
> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>
> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>
> re:
>> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
>> talking about).
>
> That could very well be.
> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>
> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>
>
>
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying
>> that
>> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> system
>> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
>> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> robust
>> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that
>> this
>> isn't a spec issue.
>>
>> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is
>> fast
>> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> creating
>> a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
>> two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a
>> VS
>> .NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
>> experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
>> results and these machines have those specs.
>>
>> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>
>
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> re:
>>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> That doesn't sound right.
>>>
>>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>>
>>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>>
>>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>>>
>>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>>
>>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>>
>>>
>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> ======================================
>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier
>>>> in
>>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>>
>>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>>>> using
>>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
>>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>>>> telling
>>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks anyway.
>
>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>>
>>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>>
>>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>> ======================================
>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>>>>>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>>
>>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>>>>>> sails.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #27

P: n/a
Wow Scot, are you all frustrated over there?
You are not making friends here :)
I am even afraid to say anything (you might bark at me as well :)

Anyway i try. Never had a problem like you have but having some experience might suggest something useful.

Earlier you said that all machines in your corporation.

So i would think it has something to do with your mandatory company software running on all those machines.

-1. Check Windows even log. It might offer some clues at why is it happening.
0. Are you going thorough Frontpage extension to create the project? I hope not.
1. The antivirus is a viable candidate and i would definitely try to uninstall it (not just disable, i have an experience when disabling did not do a thing but uninstalling did the trick)
2. Your corporate network. Is it possible that localhost name resolution is not working well on your network. Try to create the project on 127.0.0.1 and see if there will be any difference between that and localhost. Or even try to disconnect you computer from the netwrok and check if it's making any difference.
Thanks
George.
Nov 19 '05 #28

P: n/a
Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some suggestions of
things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Good bye, Scott.

I wish you luck in solving your problem.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
re:
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in
> any
> way, mean that MY problem is specs.

No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.

re:
> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue

Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
> talking
> about).

That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying that
> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your system
> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE robust
> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that this
> isn't a spec issue.
>
> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is
> fast
> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
> creating a
> web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
> two
> products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a VS
> .NET
> configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of experience
> I've
> had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and these
> machines have those specs.
>
> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> re:
>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>
>> That doesn't sound right.
>>
>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>
>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>
>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>>
>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>
>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier in
>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>
>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>>> using
>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>>> telling
>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway.

>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>
>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>
>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>>>>> workstations.
>>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>
>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>>>>> sails.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #29

P: n/a
LOL: or, in the end, you'll learn how to troubleshoot.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Like I said just now, Scott : good luck solving your problem.

I'm sorry you have to resort to flaming me in order
to feel better about your frustrations with your problem.

In the end, you'll wind up doing what I suggested.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:02**********************************@microsof t.com...
"last suggestion"? When did you make your first suggestion? Again, I think
you might just want to sit this one out. You are asking me to tear down a
house to find out why a door was creaking. You haven't offered one thing to
look at or check.

I know that I could re-build a machine from scratch, but gee, that's why I
wanted to some help on things I could check first.

It's ok to say you don't know if you don't know. Even better, you don't
have to respond to posts if you don't have anything valuable to contribute.


"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
One last suggestion :

Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.

Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating applications.
If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the problem's source.
( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow through... )

If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app creation speed.
If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the problem's source.

If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the problem.

That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.

Good luck!
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> re:
>>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>
> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
> configured for the answer.
>
> You have 3 things at play here :
>
> 1. Your hardware configuration
> 2. Your software configuration
> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>
> You'll need to check all of them.
>
> re:
>> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not, in
>> any
>> way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>
> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>
> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>
> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
> of items which need individual configuration.
>
> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>
> re:
>> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> configuration
>> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>
> Your original phrasing was :
> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>
> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>
> re:
>> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
>> talking about).
>
> That could very well be.
> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>
> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>
>
>
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying
>> that
>> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> system
>> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem is
>> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> robust
>> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that
>> this
>> isn't a spec issue.
>>
>> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is
>> fast
>> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> creating
>> a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of the
>> two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a
>> VS
>> .NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
>> experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
>> results and these machines have those specs.
>>
>> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>
>
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> re:
>>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> That doesn't sound right.
>>>
>>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>>
>>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>>
>>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>>>
>>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>>
>>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>>
>>>
>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> ======================================
>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated earlier
>>>> in
>>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>>
>>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>>>> using
>>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly it
>>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>>>> telling
>>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks anyway.
>
>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>>
>>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>>
>>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>> ======================================
>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>>>>>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>>
>>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made, everything
>>>>>> sails.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #30

P: n/a
BINGO! That did the trick. Thanks George!

It took about 2 seconds after that. Do you think that this could be
resolved with an entry to the "hosts" file? If not, any thoughts on what
could clear this up?

Thanks again!

"George" wrote:
Try to create the project on 127.0.0.1 and see if there will be any difference between that and localhost. .
Thanks
George

Nov 19 '05 #31

P: n/a
Maybe, if you had answered my questions :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ? I could have had enough information to help you.

Just because you can do things quickly using 127.0.0.1,
doesn't mean you have solved your problem.

At most, you have worked around it.

You *should* be able to work sites with localhost, instead of with 127.0.0.1
If you can't, you *still* have a TCP/IP stack problem, like I said.

That could come back to bite you.

In any case, I see you prefer to lambast someone who is trying to help you,
instead of being courteous regarding that someone's attempts to help you.

I'll try not to interfere between you and your problems again.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:D5**********************************@microsof t.com... LOL: or, in the end, you'll learn how to troubleshoot. "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Like I said just now, Scott : good luck solving your problem.

I'm sorry you have to resort to flaming me in order
to feel better about your frustrations with your problem.

In the end, you'll wind up doing what I suggested.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:02**********************************@microsof t.com...
> "last suggestion"? When did you make your first suggestion? Again, I think
> you might just want to sit this one out. You are asking me to tear down a
> house to find out why a door was creaking. You haven't offered one thing to
> look at or check.
>
> I know that I could re-build a machine from scratch, but gee, that's why I
> wanted to some help on things I could check first.
>
> It's ok to say you don't know if you don't know. Even better, you don't
> have to respond to posts if you don't have anything valuable to contribute.


> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>> One last suggestion :
>>
>> Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
>> format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.
>>
>> Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating applications.
>> If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the problem's source.
>> ( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow through... )
>>
>> If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app creation speed.
>> If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the problem's
>> source.
>>
>> If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
>> you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the problem.
>>
>> That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
>> much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.
>>
>> Good luck!
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> > re:
>> >>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> > or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>> >
>> > My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
>> > never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> > configured for the answer.
>> >
>> > You have 3 things at play here :
>> >
>> > 1. Your hardware configuration
>> > 2. Your software configuration
>> > 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>> >
>> > You'll need to check all of them.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not,
>> >> in
>> >> any
>> >> way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>> >
>> > No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> > Sometimes a comparison helps.
>> >
>> > Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>> >
>> > I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> > starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> > of items which need individual configuration.
>> >
>> > Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
>> > and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> >> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> >> configuration
>> >> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>> >
>> > Your original phrasing was :
>> > "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>> >
>> > And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> > If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
>> >> talking about).
>> >
>> > That could very well be.
>> > Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>> >
>> > How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> > When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>> >
>> > Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> > ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> > Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> > ======================================
>> > "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> > news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >>
>> >> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying
>> >> that
>> >> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> >> system
>> >> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem
>> >> is
>> >> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> >> robust
>> >> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that
>> >> this
>> >> isn't a spec issue.
>> >>
>> >> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system
>> >> is
>> >> fast
>> >> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> >> creating
>> >> a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of
>> >> the
>> >> two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be
>> >> a
>> >> VS
>> >> .NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> >> corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
>> >> experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
>> >> results and these machines have those specs.
>> >>
>> >> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>> >
>> >
>> >> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>> re:
>> >>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>>
>> >>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>>
>> >>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>>
>> >>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> >>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>> >>>
>> >>> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>>
>> >>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> >>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>> ======================================
>> >>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
>> >>>> earlier
>> >>>> in
>> >>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>> >>>> using
>> >>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly
>> >>>> it
>> >>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>> >>>> telling
>> >>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thanks anyway.
>> >
>> >>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>> >>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>> >>>>>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>> >>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
>> >>>>>> everything
>> >>>>>> sails.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>> >>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>> >>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET
>> >>>>>>>>> > Web
>> >>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> >>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #32

P: n/a
> Maybe, if you had answered my questions :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly
? I could have had enough information to help you.


Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but you
didn't!
Just because you can do things quickly using 127.0.0.1,
doesn't mean you have solved your problem.
Yes, it does because it pointed me to what the problem centers around: the
resolution of server names.
At most, you have worked around it.
You are very quick to come to judgements. This is like the 3rd time you've
declared what I'll have to do to solve my problem and, in each case, you've
been wrong because YOU simply won't calm down and admit that you never
really asked me any questions at all, you just started right in disputing my
telling you that the hardware wasn't the problem.
You *should* be able to work sites with localhost, instead of with
127.0.0.1
If you can't, you *still* have a TCP/IP stack problem, like I said.
I know what I *should* be able to do and based on the help of someone who
actually offered some, I have located the problem and it has been solved
(and it was NOT a TCP/IP stack problem like you declared) it was a simple
problem with the hosts file.
That could come back to bite you.
Not really sice the problem is now solved.
In any case, I see you prefer to lambast someone who is trying to help
you,
instead of being courteous regarding that someone's attempts to help you.
I'll give you an "A" for effort, but you get an "F" for actually suppling
anything that was remotely helpful. In fact, you've been stubbornly
declaring what my problem is, what I'll have to do to solve it and you never
ONCE actually asked me for any information.
I'll try not to interfere between you and your problems again.
THANK YOU!
Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:D5**********************************@microsof t.com...
LOL: or, in the end, you'll learn how to troubleshoot.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Like I said just now, Scott : good luck solving your problem.

I'm sorry you have to resort to flaming me in order
to feel better about your frustrations with your problem.

In the end, you'll wind up doing what I suggested.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:02**********************************@microsof t.com...
> "last suggestion"? When did you make your first suggestion? Again, I
> think
> you might just want to sit this one out. You are asking me to tear
> down a
> house to find out why a door was creaking. You haven't offered one
> thing to
> look at or check.
>
> I know that I could re-build a machine from scratch, but gee, that's
> why I
> wanted to some help on things I could check first.
>
> It's ok to say you don't know if you don't know. Even better, you
> don't
> have to respond to posts if you don't have anything valuable to
> contribute.
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>> One last suggestion :
>>
>> Take ONE of the machines which exhibits the behavior,
>> format it, and install the OS, IIS and VS.NET manually.
>>
>> Then, in a standalone environment, check its speed when creating
>> applications.
>> If it's not working as fast as it should, your hardware is the
>> problem's source.
>> ( I know you already said that's not the source, but follow
>> through... )
>>
>> If it's working OK, connect it to the network and check its app
>> creation speed.
>> If it's *then* not working as fast as it should, your network is the
>> problem's source.
>>
>> If it's working OK after having connected the box to the network,
>> you can pretty much assume that the disk images are the source of the
>> problem.
>>
>> That will take you, tops, 2-3 hours, and will nail down the problem
>> much more easily than any other procedure I can think of.
>>
>> Good luck!
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> > re:
>> >>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> > or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>> >
>> > My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
>> > have
>> > never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> > configured for the answer.
>> >
>> > You have 3 things at play here :
>> >
>> > 1. Your hardware configuration
>> > 2. Your software configuration
>> > 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>> >
>> > You'll need to check all of them.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
>> >> time does not, in
>> >> any
>> >> way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>> >
>> > No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> > Sometimes a comparison helps.
>> >
>> > Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>> >
>> > I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> > starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> > of items which need individual configuration.
>> >
>> > Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
>> > ambiguities,
>> > and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
>> > describing.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
>> >> communicating and the
>> >> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be
>> >> an IIS
>> >> configuration
>> >> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>> >
>> > Your original phrasing was :
>> > "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
>> > not
>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go
>> > by."
>> >
>> > And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> > If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>> >
>> > re:
>> >> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
>> >> desktop image I'm
>> >> talking about).
>> >
>> > That could very well be.
>> > Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>> >
>> > How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> > When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
>> > quickly ?
>> >
>> > Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> > ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> > Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> > ======================================
>> > "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> > news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >>
>> >> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing
>> >> slowly. I am saying
>> >> that
>> >> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling
>> >> me that your
>> >> system
>> >> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
>> >> that MY problem is
>> >> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to
>> >> be much MORE
>> >> robust
>> >> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
>> >> tells me that
>> >> this
>> >> isn't a spec issue.
>> >>
>> >> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration
>> >> issue. The system is
>> >> fast
>> >> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
>> >> project. Since
>> >> creating
>> >> a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> >> configuration of the
>> >> two products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
>> >> issue, it may be a
>> >> VS
>> >> .NET configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is,
>> >> after all, a
>> >> corporate desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that,
>> >> with the years of
>> >> experience I've had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you
>> >> need to get good
>> >> results and these machines have those specs.
>> >>
>> >> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is
>> >> the problem.
>> >
>> >
>> >> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>> re:
>> >>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>>
>> >>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>>
>> >>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>>
>> >>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
>> >>> describe
>> >>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> >>> Framework.
>> >>>
>> >>> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>>
>> >>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for
>> >>> believing that
>> >>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>> ======================================
>> >>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are
>> >>>> (as stated earlier
>> >>>> in
>> >>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few
>> >>>> seconds (I have been
>> >>>> using
>> >>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
>> >>>> out how quickly it
>> >>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long
>> >>>> for me and I'm
>> >>>> telling
>> >>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thanks anyway.
>> >
>> >>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
>> >>>>> brand-name),
>> >>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>> >>>>> seconds.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>> >>>>>> corporate
>> >>>>>> workstations. As I stated, these are brand new machines with
>> >>>>>> beefy specs.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>> >>>>>> creating the web
>> >>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>> >>>>>> made, everything
>> >>>>>> sails.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you
>> >>>>>>>>> have them running.
>> >>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running
>> >>>>>>>>> > on XP Pro. (P4's
>> >>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create
>> >>>>>>>>> > a new ASP.NET Web
>> >>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away,
>> >>>>>>>>> > but it is not
>> >>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
>> >>>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>> > Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #33

P: n/a
re:
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but you didn't!


You are quoting the very same message in which
I asked those questions in your current reply.

I edited out your flames, so you can read them again.

You were too intent on flaming me, instead of reading what I wrote.

But, that's OK, Scott. Have a nice life.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:us**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Maybe, if you had answered my questions :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?

I could have had enough information to help you.


Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but you didn't!

"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:eG**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>
> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================

Nov 19 '05 #34

P: n/a
> You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as
an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.
I can tell you why he would say such a thing. Because many of us use the
same product without any problems whatsoever, in terms of speed, etc. I have
it installed on both my home and work machines, and we have it here at the
office on a number of machines. No problems. If the problem were in the
Visual Studio.Net application, it would exist in all copies of the
application. It doesn't. Therefore, it is outside the application, as Juan
stated.

The issue you mentioned ("communicate with IIS") does not indicate a problem
with Visual Studio. It indicates aproblem in the environment in which Visual
Studio operates, as Juan indicated. The fact that you figured out that it
was an issue with a hosts file confirms this.

Juan was being as helpful as he could, by attempting to reduce the number of
possible areas where the problem could originate. He speaks about what he
knows, and keeps silent about what he does not (or can not) know, as any
helpful person should. When attempting to solve an issue, knowing where the
problem does NOT originate is part of the problem-solving process. To quote
Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains,
however improbable, must be the truth." While this is not the only means to
solving a problem, it is certainly a useful one. And considering the size
and scope of Visual Studio, it eliminates quite a few possibilities.

While your frustration with the problem is understandable, your anger at
Juan is misplaced.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com... Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't
have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as
an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something
that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything
to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
re:
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.


Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time
> does not, in any
> way, mean that MY problem is specs.


No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
describing.

re:
> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating
> and the
> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
> configuration
> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue


Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop
> image I'm talking
> about).


That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly
?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I
> am saying that
> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me
> that your system
> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that
> MY problem is
> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be
> much MORE robust
> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
> tells me that this
> isn't a spec issue.
>
> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
> The system is fast
> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project.
> Since creating a
> web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> configuration of the two
> products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it
> may be a VS .NET
> configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all,
> a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
> experience I've
> had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
> results and these
> machines have those specs.
>
> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the
> problem.


> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> re:
>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>
>> That doesn't sound right.
>>
>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>
>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>
>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> Framework.
>>
>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>
>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing
>> that
>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
>>> stated earlier in
>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>
>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I
>>> have been using
>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out
>>> how quickly it
>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me
>>> and I'm telling
>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway.

>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>
>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>
>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>>>>> corporate workstations.
>>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>
>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>>>>> creating the web
>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>>>>> made, everything
>>>>> sails.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
>>>>>>>> them running.
>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP
>>>>>>>> > Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new
>>>>>>>> > ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but
>>>>>>>> > it is not
>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes
>>>>>>>> > go by.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #35

P: n/a
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a few
educated guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the ones that
didn't pan out, ubt he certainly did not present all of the possible causes
of your issue. The fact that one of his guesses, among the myriad
possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not make him a better person
than Juan, or any of the other people who have tried to help you. It is a
simple fact that you always find something in the last place you look for
it. After all, once you find it, you stop looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has
pulled many a foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced, and
illogical. I hope you don't program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some suggestions
of
things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Good bye, Scott.

I wish you luck in solving your problem.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough.
> I
> understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
> particular
> scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
> different
> systems.
>
> My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
> would
> take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
> ruled
> out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
> That's
> not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming
> in.
>
> Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
> doesn't
> mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
> don't have
> anything to contribute to the discussion.
>
> You categorically stated:
>
> "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
> 2005,
> have nothing to do with your problem."
>
> Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
> about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
> application,
> VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it
> as an
> application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say
> such a
> thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
> ridiculous
> and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.
>
> If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
> don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something
> that
> you don't.
>
> I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
> anything to
> me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
> relevant
> information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>
>
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> re:
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>>
>> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
>> have
>> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> configured for the answer.
>>
>> You have 3 things at play here :
>>
>> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> 2. Your software configuration
>> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>>
>> You'll need to check all of them.
>>
>> re:
>> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
>> > time does not, in
>> > any
>> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>>
>> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>>
>> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>>
>> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> of items which need individual configuration.
>>
>> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
>> ambiguities,
>> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
>> describing.
>>
>> re:
>> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
>> > communicating and the
>> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an
>> > IIS configuration
>> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>>
>> Your original phrasing was :
>> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
>> not
>> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>>
>> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>>
>> re:
>> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
>> > desktop image I'm
>> > talking
>> > about).
>>
>> That could very well be.
>> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>>
>> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
>> quickly ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly.
>> > I am saying that
>> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me
>> > that your system
>> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
>> > that MY problem is
>> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be
>> > much MORE robust
>> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
>> > tells me that this
>> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >
>> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
>> > The system is
>> > fast
>> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
>> > project. Since
>> > creating a
>> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> > configuration of the
>> > two
>> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue,
>> > it may be a VS
>> > .NET
>> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after
>> > all, a corporate
>> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years
>> > of experience
>> > I've
>> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
>> > results and these
>> > machines have those specs.
>> >
>> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is
>> > the problem.
>>
>>
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> re:
>> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>
>> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>
>> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>
>> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>
>> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
>> >> describe
>> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> >> Framework.
>> >>
>> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>
>> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing
>> >> that
>> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
>> >>> stated earlier in
>> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds
>> >>> (I have been
>> >>> using
>> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
>> >>> out how quickly it
>> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for
>> >>> me and I'm
>> >>> telling
>> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks anyway.
>>
>> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
>> >>>> brand-name),
>> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>> >>>> seconds.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>> ======================================
>> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>> >>>>> corporate
>> >>>>> workstations.
>> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>> >>>>> creating the web
>> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>> >>>>> made, everything
>> >>>>> sails.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
>> >>>>>>>> them running.
>> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on
>> >>>>>>>> > XP Pro. (P4's
>> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a
>> >>>>>>>> > new ASP.NET Web
>> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away,
>> >>>>>>>> > but it is not
>> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
>> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>


Nov 19 '05 #36

P: n/a
That i do not know.
It can be problem on your network or some software (like antivirus) messes up the TCP/IP.

You can easily check by disconnecting your PC from the network and try create project on localhost.
George.
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message news:54**********************************@microsof t.com...
BINGO! That did the trick. Thanks George!

It took about 2 seconds after that. Do you think that this could be
resolved with an entry to the "hosts" file? If not, any thoughts on what
could clear this up?

Thanks again!

"George" wrote:
Try to create the project on 127.0.0.1 and see if there will be any difference between that and localhost. .
Thanks
George

Nov 19 '05 #37

P: n/a
Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself have
been a participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't need
someone arguing with me over a point that is mute. Juan has done nothing
but that since his first post here. I don't doubt that he may have been
helpful to others in other circumstances, but he has not been here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem
arises or to argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works fine
on his system is not really the kind useful troubleshooting advice I was
asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at, things
that I could check, places I could look and that was/is helpful to someone
who is troubleshooting a problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely
different to insist that your opinion is correct when you have not asked any
questions or provided any direction as to what to try. This is what Juan
has done here and, I'm sorry, but I have no patience for that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a
few educated guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the
ones that didn't pan out, ubt he certainly did not present all of the
possible causes of your issue. The fact that one of his guesses, among the
myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not make him a better
person than Juan, or any of the other people who have tried to help you.
It is a simple fact that you always find something in the last place you
look for it. After all, once you find it, you stop looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has
pulled many a foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced, and
illogical. I hope you don't program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some suggestions
of
things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
Good bye, Scott.

I wish you luck in solving your problem.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough.
> I
> understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
> particular
> scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
> different
> systems.
>
> My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
> would
> take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
> ruled
> out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
> That's
> not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming
> in.
>
> Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
> doesn't
> mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
> don't have
> anything to contribute to the discussion.
>
> You categorically stated:
>
> "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
> 2005,
> have nothing to do with your problem."
>
> Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows
> anything
> about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
> application,
> VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it
> as an
> application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say
> such a
> thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
> ridiculous
> and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the
> subject.
>
> If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know,
> but
> don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know
> something that
> you don't.
>
> I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
> anything to
> me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
> relevant
> information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>
>
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> re:
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>>
>> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
>> have
>> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> configured for the answer.
>>
>> You have 3 things at play here :
>>
>> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> 2. Your software configuration
>> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>>
>> You'll need to check all of them.
>>
>> re:
>> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
>> > time does not, in
>> > any
>> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>>
>> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>>
>> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>>
>> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> of items which need individual configuration.
>>
>> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
>> ambiguities,
>> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
>> describing.
>>
>> re:
>> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
>> > communicating and the
>> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an
>> > IIS configuration
>> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>>
>> Your original phrasing was :
>> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
>> not
>> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>>
>> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>>
>> re:
>> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
>> > desktop image I'm
>> > talking
>> > about).
>>
>> That could very well be.
>> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>>
>> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
>> quickly ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly.
>> > I am saying that
>> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling
>> > me that your system
>> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
>> > that MY problem is
>> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to
>> > be much MORE robust
>> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
>> > tells me that this
>> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >
>> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
>> > The system is
>> > fast
>> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
>> > project. Since
>> > creating a
>> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> > configuration of the
>> > two
>> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue,
>> > it may be a VS
>> > .NET
>> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after
>> > all, a corporate
>> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years
>> > of experience
>> > I've
>> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
>> > results and these
>> > machines have those specs.
>> >
>> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is
>> > the problem.
>>
>>
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> re:
>> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>
>> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>
>> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>
>> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>
>> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
>> >> describe
>> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> >> Framework.
>> >>
>> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>
>> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for
>> >> believing that
>> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
>> >>> stated earlier in
>> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few
>> >>> seconds (I have been
>> >>> using
>> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
>> >>> out how quickly it
>> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long
>> >>> for me and I'm
>> >>> telling
>> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks anyway.
>>
>> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
>> >>>> brand-name),
>> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>> >>>> seconds.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>> ======================================
>> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>> >>>>> corporate
>> >>>>> workstations.
>> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>> >>>>> creating the web
>> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>> >>>>> made, everything
>> >>>>> sails.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
>> >>>>>>>> them running.
>> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on
>> >>>>>>>> > XP Pro. (P4's
>> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a
>> >>>>>>>> > new ASP.NET Web
>> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away,
>> >>>>>>>> > but it is not
>> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
>> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>


Nov 19 '05 #38

P: n/a
Kevin,

First of all, I am one of those people in the "us" you describe below that
use (and have used) this product without any problems what-so-ever. I have
been using .NET since early betas and also have it installed on several
different machines at home as well and I have not encountered this behavior
in the past either, hence my post.

I never said that the problem is with VS.NET (the software programming of
it) so I'm not sure why you are saying that I did. What I said was that
there is certainly the possibility that the configuration of VS.NET and/or
the configuration of IIS may be the culprit because the two have to
communicate in order for web applications to be created. Within that realm,
there are a number of variables that could be the cause. For Juan to
categorically state (which he did) that the problem is not with VS.NET or
IIS without knowing anything at all about the systems in question and their
configuration is hardly the sign of someone who has any form of in-depth
knowledge of the subject. And, to state this after categorically stating
that my hardware is the problem (which he also did) when I had already told
him that this was ruled out and again he had not known anything else about
the environment just tells me that Juan wants to be heard. He wants to be
agreed with and he wants his word taken as final. Again, I'm sorry, but
that is not being helpful.
I can tell you why he would say such a thing. Because many of us use the
same product without any problems whatsoever, in terms of speed, etc. I
have it installed on both my home and work machines, and we have it here
at the office on a number of machines. No problems. If the problem were in
the Visual Studio.Net application, it would exist in all copies of the
application. It doesn't. Therefore, it is outside the application, as Juan
stated.

The issue you mentioned ("communicate with IIS") does not indicate a
problem with Visual Studio. It indicates aproblem in the environment in
which Visual Studio operates, as Juan indicated. The fact that you figured
out that it was an issue with a hosts file confirms this.
Not so fast. If VS.NET is set up to use FrontPage Extensions and/or File
Sharing to communicate with IIS, then that is a VS.NET issue, not an
environment issue. You can't just rule out VS .NET and IIS without first
looking into the configuration of each.

Juan was being as helpful as he could, by attempting to reduce the number
of possible areas where the problem could originate. He speaks about what
he knows, and keeps silent about what he does not (or can not) know, as
any helpful person should. When attempting to solve an issue, knowing
where the problem does NOT originate is part of the problem-solving
process. To quote Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated the
impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."
While this is not the only means to solving a problem, it is certainly a
useful one. And considering the size and scope of Visual Studio, it
eliminates quite a few possibilities.
I agree. So when I repeatedly informed Juan that hardware has been ruled
out and he repeatedly insisted that this was, in fact, my problem, I knew
that he was not someone who understands how to troubleshoot.

While your frustration with the problem is understandable, your anger at
Juan is misplaced.
To each his own.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't
have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as
an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such
a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something
that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything
to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
re:
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time
> does not, in any
> way, mean that MY problem is specs.

No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
describing.

re:
> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating
> and the
> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an
> IIS configuration
> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue

Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop
> image I'm talking
> about).

That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I
> am saying that
> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me
> that your system
> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that
> MY problem is
> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be
> much MORE robust
> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
> tells me that this
> isn't a spec issue.
>
> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
> The system is fast
> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project.
> Since creating a
> web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> configuration of the two
> products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it
> may be a VS .NET
> configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after
> all, a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
> experience I've
> had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
> results and these
> machines have those specs.
>
> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the
> problem.
> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> re:
>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>
>> That doesn't sound right.
>>
>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>
>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>
>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> Framework.
>>
>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>
>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing
>> that
>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
>>> stated earlier in
>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>
>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds
>>> (I have been using
>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out
>>> how quickly it
>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for
>>> me and I'm telling
>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway.

>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>
>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>>>>
>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>>>>> corporate workstations.
>>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>
>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>>>>> creating the web
>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>>>>> made, everything
>>>>> sails.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
>>>>>>>> them running.
>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP
>>>>>>>> > Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a
>>>>>>>> > new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but
>>>>>>>> > it is not
>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes
>>>>>>>> > go by.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>


Nov 19 '05 #39

P: n/a
re:
when you have not asked any questions or provided any direction as to what to try
Scott, going into denial really doesn't help.

Let me repeat the dialogue :

You : Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but you didn't!
The text which you say I didn't write : How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
If you had been paying attention to the suggestions being made,
instead of looking to vent your frustration with your problems on me,
you could have found out that the TCP/IP stack *was* the problem
much sooner ( Even sooner than George's suggestion ).

You *still* have the TCP/IP problem, btw.
Working around it by using 127.0.0.1 will probably come back to bite you.

But don't mind me. Have a nice day.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl... Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself have been a
participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't need someone arguing with me
over a point that is mute. Juan has done nothing but that since his first post here. I
don't doubt that he may have been helpful to others in other circumstances, but he has
not been here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem arises or to
argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works fine on his system is not
really the kind useful troubleshooting advice I was asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at, things that I could
check, places I could look and that was/is helpful to someone who is troubleshooting a
problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely different to insist
that your opinion is correct when you have not asked any questions or provided any
direction as to what to try. This is what Juan has done here and, I'm sorry, but I have
no patience for that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a few educated
guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the ones that didn't pan out, ubt
he certainly did not present all of the possible causes of your issue. The fact that
one of his guesses, among the myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not
make him a better person than Juan, or any of the other people who have tried to help
you. It is a simple fact that you always find something in the last place you look for
it. After all, once you find it, you stop looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has pulled many a
foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced, and illogical. I hope you don't
program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some suggestions of
things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:

Good bye, Scott.

I wish you luck in solving your problem.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
> understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
> scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
> systems.
>
> My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
> take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
> out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
> not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.
>
> Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
> mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
> anything to contribute to the discussion.
>
> You categorically stated:
>
> "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
> have nothing to do with your problem."
>
> Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
> about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
> VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
> application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
> thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
> and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.
>
> If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
> don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
> you don't.
>
> I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
> me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
> information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>
>
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> re:
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>>
>> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
>> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> configured for the answer.
>>
>> You have 3 things at play here :
>>
>> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> 2. Your software configuration
>> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>>
>> You'll need to check all of them.
>>
>> re:
>> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not,
>> > in
>> > any
>> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>>
>> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>>
>> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>>
>> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> of items which need individual configuration.
>>
>> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
>> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>>
>> re:
>> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> > configuration
>> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>>
>> Your original phrasing was :
>> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>>
>> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>>
>> re:
>> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
>> > talking
>> > about).
>>
>> That could very well be.
>> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>>
>> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying
>> > that
>> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> > system
>> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY
>> > problem is
>> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> > robust
>> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that
>> > this
>> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >
>> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system
>> > is
>> > fast
>> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> > creating a
>> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of
>> > the
>> > two
>> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a
>> > VS
>> > .NET
>> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> > corporate
>> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
>> > experience
>> > I've
>> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and
>> > these
>> > machines have those specs.
>> >
>> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>>
>>
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> re:
>> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>
>> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>
>> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>
>> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>
>> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>> >>
>> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>
>> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
>> >>> earlier in
>> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have
>> >>> been
>> >>> using
>> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how
>> >>> quickly it
>> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>> >>> telling
>> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks anyway.
>>
>> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>> ======================================
>> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>> >>>>> workstations.
>> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
>> >>>>> everything
>> >>>>> sails.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them
>> >>>>>>>> running.
>> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro.
>> >>>>>>>> > (P4's
>> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET
>> >>>>>>>> > Web
>> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>



Nov 19 '05 #40

P: n/a
Argumentative fellow, aren't you?
Not so fast. If VS.NET is set up to use FrontPage Extensions and/or File
Sharing to communicate with IIS, then that is a VS.NET issue, not an
environment issue. You can't just rule out VS .NET and IIS without first
looking into the configuration of each.
Visual Studio uses lots and lots of things. It uses a multitude of services,
network protocols, Internet Explorer, FrontPage Server extensions, the
ENTIRE .Net Platform, and even the Operating System. So, if the problem was
with the operating system, would you say that the problem is a VS.Net issue
as well? A problem with a service does not equate to a problem with a
client. D00d!
I agree. So when I repeatedly informed Juan that hardware has been ruled
out and he repeatedly insisted that this was, in fact, my problem, I knew
that he was not someone who understands how to troubleshoot.
Your TCP/IP stack isn't hardware. It's software. And circumventing a problem
doesn't solve it.

As a suggestion, try adding a localhost entry to your machine's hosts and
lmhosts.sam files. It won't hurt to try, and it might help. And I think
Juan's recent advice would be well-taken. Look into your TCP/IP stack, if
you have the time.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
..Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:Ow**************@tk2msftngp13.phx.gbl... Kevin,

First of all, I am one of those people in the "us" you describe below that
use (and have used) this product without any problems what-so-ever. I
have been using .NET since early betas and also have it installed on
several different machines at home as well and I have not encountered this
behavior in the past either, hence my post.

I never said that the problem is with VS.NET (the software programming of
it) so I'm not sure why you are saying that I did. What I said was that
there is certainly the possibility that the configuration of VS.NET and/or
the configuration of IIS may be the culprit because the two have to
communicate in order for web applications to be created. Within that
realm, there are a number of variables that could be the cause. For Juan
to categorically state (which he did) that the problem is not with VS.NET
or IIS without knowing anything at all about the systems in question and
their configuration is hardly the sign of someone who has any form of
in-depth knowledge of the subject. And, to state this after categorically
stating that my hardware is the problem (which he also did) when I had
already told him that this was ruled out and again he had not known
anything else about the environment just tells me that Juan wants to be
heard. He wants to be agreed with and he wants his word taken as final.
Again, I'm sorry, but that is not being helpful.
I can tell you why he would say such a thing. Because many of us use the
same product without any problems whatsoever, in terms of speed, etc. I
have it installed on both my home and work machines, and we have it here
at the office on a number of machines. No problems. If the problem were
in the Visual Studio.Net application, it would exist in all copies of the
application. It doesn't. Therefore, it is outside the application, as
Juan stated.

The issue you mentioned ("communicate with IIS") does not indicate a
problem with Visual Studio. It indicates aproblem in the environment in
which Visual Studio operates, as Juan indicated. The fact that you
figured out that it was an issue with a hosts file confirms this.


Not so fast. If VS.NET is set up to use FrontPage Extensions and/or File
Sharing to communicate with IIS, then that is a VS.NET issue, not an
environment issue. You can't just rule out VS .NET and IIS without first
looking into the configuration of each.

Juan was being as helpful as he could, by attempting to reduce the number
of possible areas where the problem could originate. He speaks about what
he knows, and keeps silent about what he does not (or can not) know, as
any helpful person should. When attempting to solve an issue, knowing
where the problem does NOT originate is part of the problem-solving
process. To quote Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated the
impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."
While this is not the only means to solving a problem, it is certainly a
useful one. And considering the size and scope of Visual Studio, it
eliminates quite a few possibilities.


I agree. So when I repeatedly informed Juan that hardware has been ruled
out and he repeatedly insisted that this was, in fact, my problem, I knew
that he was not someone who understands how to troubleshoot.

While your frustration with the problem is understandable, your anger at
Juan is misplaced.


To each his own.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming
in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't
have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it
as an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such
a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something
that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
anything to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:

re:
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.

Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.

My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
configured for the answer.

You have 3 things at play here :

1. Your hardware configuration
2. Your software configuration
3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )

You'll need to check all of them.

re:
> You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
> time does not, in any
> way, mean that MY problem is specs.

No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
Sometimes a comparison helps.

Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?

I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
of items which need individual configuration.

Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
ambiguities,
and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
describing.

re:
> Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
> communicating and the
> configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an
> IIS configuration
> issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue

Your original phrasing was :
"It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."

And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.

re:
> it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking
> about).

That could very well be.
Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.

How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
quickly ?


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly.
> I am saying that
> ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me
> that your system
> does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
> that MY problem is
> specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be
> much MORE robust
> than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
> tells me that this
> isn't a spec issue.
>
> I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
> The system is fast
> in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
> project. Since creating a
> web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> configuration of the two
> products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue,
> it may be a VS .NET
> configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after
> all, a corporate
> desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years
> of experience I've
> had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
> results and these
> machines have those specs.
>
> Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the
> problem.
> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> re:
>>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>
>> That doesn't sound right.
>>
>> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>
>> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>
>> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> Framework.
>>
>> Make of those facts what you will.
>>
>> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing
>> that
>> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
>>> stated earlier in
>>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>>
>>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds
>>> (I have been using
>>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out
>>> how quickly it
>>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for
>>> me and I'm telling
>>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway.

>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>>>
>>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>>>> seconds.
>>>>
>>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>>>
>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>> ======================================
>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>>>>> corporate workstations.
>>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>>>
>>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>>>>> creating the web
>>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
>>>>> made, everything
>>>>> sails.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>>>>> ======================================
>>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
>>>>>>>> them running.
>>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> John
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on
>>>>>>>> > XP Pro. (P4's
>>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a
>>>>>>>> > new ASP.NET Web
>>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but
>>>>>>>> > it is not
>>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes
>>>>>>>> > go by.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #41

P: n/a
Apparently you need some work on reading as well, since I've already told
you that the problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the
problem has been solved. The TCP/IP stack was not the problem.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Ox**************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
re:
when you have not asked any questions or provided any direction as to
what to try


Scott, going into denial really doesn't help.

Let me repeat the dialogue :

You :
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but
you didn't!


The text which you say I didn't write :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly
?


If you had been paying attention to the suggestions being made,
instead of looking to vent your frustration with your problems on me,
you could have found out that the TCP/IP stack *was* the problem
much sooner ( Even sooner than George's suggestion ).

You *still* have the TCP/IP problem, btw.
Working around it by using 127.0.0.1 will probably come back to bite you.

But don't mind me. Have a nice day.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself have
been a participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't need
someone arguing with me over a point that is mute. Juan has done nothing
but that since his first post here. I don't doubt that he may have been
helpful to others in other circumstances, but he has not been here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem
arises or to argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works
fine on his system is not really the kind useful troubleshooting advice I
was asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at, things
that I could check, places I could look and that was/is helpful to
someone who is troubleshooting a problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely
different to insist that your opinion is correct when you have not asked
any questions or provided any direction as to what to try. This is what
Juan has done here and, I'm sorry, but I have no patience for that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a
few educated guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the
ones that didn't pan out, ubt he certainly did not present all of the
possible causes of your issue. The fact that one of his guesses, among
the myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not make him a
better person than Juan, or any of the other people who have tried to
help you. It is a simple fact that you always find something in the last
place you look for it. After all, once you find it, you stop looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has
pulled many a foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced,
and illogical. I hope you don't program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some
suggestions of
things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:

> Good bye, Scott.
>
> I wish you luck in solving your problem.
>
>
>
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
> news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
> > Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well
> > enough. I
> > understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
> > particular
> > scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
> > different
> > systems.
> >
> > My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web
> > application would
> > take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
> > ruled
> > out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
> > That's
> > not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that
> > coming in.
> >
> > Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
> > doesn't
> > mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
> > don't have
> > anything to contribute to the discussion.
> >
> > You categorically stated:
> >
> > "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
> > 2005,
> > have nothing to do with your problem."
> >
> > Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows
> > anything
> > about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
> > application,
> > VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure
> > it as an
> > application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say
> > such a
> > thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
> > ridiculous
> > and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the
> > subject.
> >
> > If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know,
> > but
> > don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know
> > something that
> > you don't.
> >
> > I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
> > anything to
> > me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
> > relevant
> > information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
> >
> >> re:
> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
> >>
> >> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
> >> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
> >>
> >> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
> >> have
> >> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
> >> configured for the answer.
> >>
> >> You have 3 things at play here :
> >>
> >> 1. Your hardware configuration
> >> 2. Your software configuration
> >> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
> >>
> >> You'll need to check all of them.
> >>
> >> re:
> >> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
> >> > time does not, in
> >> > any
> >> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
> >>
> >> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
> >> Sometimes a comparison helps.
> >>
> >> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
> >>
> >> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
> >> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
> >> of items which need individual configuration.
> >>
> >> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
> >> ambiguities,
> >> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
> >> describing.
> >>
> >> re:
> >> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
> >> > communicating and the
> >> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be
> >> > an IIS configuration
> >> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
> >>
> >> Your original phrasing was :
> >> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
> >> not
> >> configured as an application directory until several minutes go
> >> by."
> >>
> >> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
> >> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
> >>
> >> re:
> >> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
> >> > desktop image I'm
> >> > talking
> >> > about).
> >>
> >> That could very well be.
> >> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
> >>
> >> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
> >> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
> >> quickly ?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >> ======================================
> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
> >> >
> >> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing
> >> > slowly. I am saying that
> >> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling
> >> > me that your system
> >> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
> >> > that MY problem is
> >> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to
> >> > be much MORE robust
> >> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is
> >> > what tells me that this
> >> > isn't a spec issue.
> >> >
> >> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration
> >> > issue. The system is
> >> > fast
> >> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
> >> > project. Since
> >> > creating a
> >> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> >> > configuration of the
> >> > two
> >> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
> >> > issue, it may be a VS
> >> > .NET
> >> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is,
> >> > after all, a corporate
> >> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the
> >> > years of experience
> >> > I've
> >> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
> >> > results and these
> >> > machines have those specs.
> >> >
> >> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is
> >> > the problem.
> >>
> >>
> >> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> >> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >> >> re:
> >> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
> >> >>
> >> >> That doesn't sound right.
> >> >>
> >> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
> >> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
> >> >>
> >> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
> >> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
> >> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
> >> >>
> >> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
> >> >> describe
> >> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
> >> >> Framework.
> >> >>
> >> >> Make of those facts what you will.
> >> >>
> >> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for
> >> >> believing that
> >> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
> >> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >> >> ======================================
> >> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are
> >> >>> (as stated earlier in
> >> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few
> >> >>> seconds (I have been
> >> >>> using
> >> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
> >> >>> out how quickly it
> >> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long
> >> >>> for me and I'm
> >> >>> telling
> >> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> Thanks anyway.
> >>
> >> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> >> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
> >> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
> >> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
> >> >>>> brand-name),
> >> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
> >> >>>> seconds.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >> >>>> ======================================
> >> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
> >> >>>>> corporate
> >> >>>>> workstations.
> >> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
> >> >>>>> creating the web
> >> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application
> >> >>>>> is made, everything
> >> >>>>> sails.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
> >> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >> >>>>>> ======================================
> >> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
> >> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
> >> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
> >> >>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you
> >> >>>>>>>> have them running.
> >> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> John
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> >> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running
> >> >>>>>>>> > on XP Pro. (P4's
> >> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create
> >> >>>>>>>> > a new ASP.NET Web
> >> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
> >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away,
> >> >>>>>>>> > but it is not
> >> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
> >> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
> >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
> >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
> >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #42

P: n/a
> Argumentative fellow, aren't you?

Am I? I really am just telling you the way I see it.
Visual Studio uses lots and lots of things. It uses a multitude of
services, network protocols, Internet Explorer, FrontPage Server
extensions, the ENTIRE .Net Platform, and even the Operating System. So,
if the problem was with the operating system, would you say that the
problem is a VS.Net issue as well? A problem with a service does not
equate to a problem with a client. D00d!
I think that's really pushing it a bit. If VS.NET is set to use FrontPage
Server Extensions and the file access method is set to File Share, then
changing a setting in VS.NET would fix the problem. Do we really need to
split hairs on this? The point was that Juan categorically denied that
VS.NET could in any way be the problem and a smart guy like you knows that's
not a true statement.
Your TCP/IP stack isn't hardware. It's software. And circumventing a
problem doesn't solve it.
But, if you had read Juan's "diagnosis" PRIOR to that post, he assured me
that the problem was definitely hardware and NOT software. Starting to see
my point? He kept telling me absolutely what the problem was without knowing
anything about my system/setup. And (I think for the 3rd time) the problem
was found with an incorrect entry to our hosts file, the file has been
corrected. We have not circumvented the problem, we've found it and
corrected it.
As a suggestion, try adding a localhost entry to your machine's hosts and
lmhosts.sam files. It won't hurt to try, and it might help. And I think
Juan's recent advice would be well-taken. Look into your TCP/IP stack, if
you have the time.


Again, I appreciate your help and the hosts file was, in fact, the culprit -
not the TCP/IP stack.


First of all, I am one of those people in the "us" you describe below
that use (and have used) this product without any problems what-so-ever.
I have been using .NET since early betas and also have it installed on
several different machines at home as well and I have not encountered
this behavior in the past either, hence my post.

I never said that the problem is with VS.NET (the software programming of
it) so I'm not sure why you are saying that I did. What I said was that
there is certainly the possibility that the configuration of VS.NET
and/or the configuration of IIS may be the culprit because the two have
to communicate in order for web applications to be created. Within that
realm, there are a number of variables that could be the cause. For Juan
to categorically state (which he did) that the problem is not with VS.NET
or IIS without knowing anything at all about the systems in question and
their configuration is hardly the sign of someone who has any form of
in-depth knowledge of the subject. And, to state this after
categorically stating that my hardware is the problem (which he also did)
when I had already told him that this was ruled out and again he had not
known anything else about the environment just tells me that Juan wants
to be heard. He wants to be agreed with and he wants his word taken as
final. Again, I'm sorry, but that is not being helpful.
I can tell you why he would say such a thing. Because many of us use the
same product without any problems whatsoever, in terms of speed, etc. I
have it installed on both my home and work machines, and we have it here
at the office on a number of machines. No problems. If the problem were
in the Visual Studio.Net application, it would exist in all copies of
the application. It doesn't. Therefore, it is outside the application,
as Juan stated.

The issue you mentioned ("communicate with IIS") does not indicate a
problem with Visual Studio. It indicates aproblem in the environment in
which Visual Studio operates, as Juan indicated. The fact that you
figured out that it was an issue with a hosts file confirms this.


Not so fast. If VS.NET is set up to use FrontPage Extensions and/or File
Sharing to communicate with IIS, then that is a VS.NET issue, not an
environment issue. You can't just rule out VS .NET and IIS without first
looking into the configuration of each.

Juan was being as helpful as he could, by attempting to reduce the
number of possible areas where the problem could originate. He speaks
about what he knows, and keeps silent about what he does not (or can
not) know, as any helpful person should. When attempting to solve an
issue, knowing where the problem does NOT originate is part of the
problem-solving process. To quote Sherlock Holmes, "When you have
eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be
the truth." While this is not the only means to solving a problem, it is
certainly a useful one. And considering the size and scope of Visual
Studio, it eliminates quite a few possibilities.


I agree. So when I repeatedly informed Juan that hardware has been ruled
out and he repeatedly insisted that this was, in fact, my problem, I knew
that he was not someone who understands how to troubleshoot.

While your frustration with the problem is understandable, your anger at
Juan is misplaced.


To each his own.

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough.
I
understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
particular
scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
different
systems.

My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application
would
take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been
ruled
out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
That's
not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming
in.

Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
doesn't
mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
don't have
anything to contribute to the discussion.

You categorically stated:

"All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
2005,
have nothing to do with your problem."

Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
application,
VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it
as an
application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say
such a
thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
ridiculous
and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.

If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something
that
you don't.

I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
anything to
me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
relevant
information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.

"Juan T. Llibre" wrote:

> re:
> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>
> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>
> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
> have
> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
> configured for the answer.
>
> You have 3 things at play here :
>
> 1. Your hardware configuration
> 2. Your software configuration
> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>
> You'll need to check all of them.
>
> re:
> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of
> > time does not, in any
> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>
> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>
> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>
> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
> of items which need individual configuration.
>
> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
> ambiguities,
> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
> describing.
>
> re:
> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
> > communicating and the
> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an
> > IIS configuration
> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>
> Your original phrasing was :
> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
> not
> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>
> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>
> re:
> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
> > desktop image I'm talking
> > about).
>
> That could very well be.
> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>
> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
> quickly ?
>
>
>
>
> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> ======================================
> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
> >
> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly.
> > I am saying that
> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me
> > that your system
> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean
> > that MY problem is
> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be
> > much MORE robust
> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what
> > tells me that this
> > isn't a spec issue.
> >
> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue.
> > The system is fast
> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
> > project. Since creating a
> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
> > configuration of the two
> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue,
> > it may be a VS .NET
> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after
> > all, a corporate
> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years
> > of experience I've
> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good
> > results and these
> > machines have those specs.
> >
> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is
> > the problem.
>
>
> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >> re:
> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
> >>
> >> That doesn't sound right.
> >>
> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
> >>
> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
> >>
> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
> >> describe
> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
> >> Framework.
> >>
> >> Make of those facts what you will.
> >>
> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing
> >> that
> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
> >>
> >>
> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >> ======================================
> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as
> >>> stated earlier in
> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
> >>>
> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds
> >>> (I have been using
> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find
> >>> out how quickly it
> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for
> >>> me and I'm telling
> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks anyway.
>
> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
> >>>>
> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
> >>>> brand-name),
> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
> >>>> seconds.
> >>>>
> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
> >>>>
> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >>>> ======================================
> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
> >>>>> corporate workstations.
> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
> >>>>
> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
> >>>>> creating the web
> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is
> >>>>> made, everything
> >>>>> sails.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
> >>>>>> ======================================
> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have
> >>>>>>>> them running.
> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> John
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on
> >>>>>>>> > XP Pro. (P4's
> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a
> >>>>>>>> > new ASP.NET Web
> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
> >>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away,
> >>>>>>>> > but it is not
> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
> >>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
> >>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
> >>>>>>>> >
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>



Nov 19 '05 #43

P: n/a
I find it really interesting though, that at this point, you are still
willing to declare with certainty what my problem is.

Let's see:

First it was absolutely hardware.
Second, you were sure I would have to rebuild the machine (before offering
any suggestions to diagnose the problem)
Then there was how in absolutely no way could VS.NET or IIS be involved.
Finally (and this is the kicker since I had already told you the problem was
found and solved) you say I've got a TCP/IP stack problem.

These are the facts Juan. This is what you said. Offering an educated
opinion is one thing. Arguing that you are right without having any
knowledge on which to base your claim is something else entirely and that's
what you've done 4 times.

My problem is solved, it was an incorrect entry in our hosts file. Thanks
to George and Kevin for providing some useful guidance on areas to look at.

I've wasted enough time on you Juan, good day.
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:ez**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Apparently you need some work on reading as well, since I've already told
you that the problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the
problem has been solved. The TCP/IP stack was not the problem.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Ox**************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
re:
when you have not asked any questions or provided any direction as to
what to try


Scott, going into denial really doesn't help.

Let me repeat the dialogue :

You :
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but
you didn't!


The text which you say I didn't write :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
quickly ?


If you had been paying attention to the suggestions being made,
instead of looking to vent your frustration with your problems on me,
you could have found out that the TCP/IP stack *was* the problem
much sooner ( Even sooner than George's suggestion ).

You *still* have the TCP/IP problem, btw.
Working around it by using 127.0.0.1 will probably come back to bite you.

But don't mind me. Have a nice day.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself
have been a participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't
need someone arguing with me over a point that is mute. Juan has done
nothing but that since his first post here. I don't doubt that he may
have been helpful to others in other circumstances, but he has not been
here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem
arises or to argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works
fine on his system is not really the kind useful troubleshooting advice
I was asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at,
things that I could check, places I could look and that was/is helpful
to someone who is troubleshooting a problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely
different to insist that your opinion is correct when you have not asked
any questions or provided any direction as to what to try. This is what
Juan has done here and, I'm sorry, but I have no patience for that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a
few educated guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the
ones that didn't pan out, ubt he certainly did not present all of the
possible causes of your issue. The fact that one of his guesses, among
the myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not make him a
better person than Juan, or any of the other people who have tried to
help you. It is a simple fact that you always find something in the
last place you look for it. After all, once you find it, you stop
looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has
pulled many a foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced,
and illogical. I hope you don't program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some
> suggestions of
> things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> Good bye, Scott.
>>
>> I wish you luck in solving your problem.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> > Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well
>> > enough. I
>> > understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
>> > particular
>> > scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
>> > different
>> > systems.
>> >
>> > My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web
>> > application would
>> > take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has
>> > been ruled
>> > out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
>> > That's
>> > not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that
>> > coming in.
>> >
>> > Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
>> > doesn't
>> > mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
>> > don't have
>> > anything to contribute to the discussion.
>> >
>> > You categorically stated:
>> >
>> > "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or
>> > 2005,
>> > have nothing to do with your problem."
>> >
>> > Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows
>> > anything
>> > about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
>> > application,
>> > VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure
>> > it as an
>> > application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say
>> > such a
>> > thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
>> > ridiculous
>> > and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the
>> > subject.
>> >
>> > If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know,
>> > but
>> > don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know
>> > something that
>> > you don't.
>> >
>> > I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
>> > anything to
>> > me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
>> > relevant
>> > information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>> >
>> >> re:
>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >>
>> >> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> >> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>> >>
>> >> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I
>> >> have
>> >> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> >> configured for the answer.
>> >>
>> >> You have 3 things at play here :
>> >>
>> >> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> >> 2. Your software configuration
>> >> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>> >>
>> >> You'll need to check all of them.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period
>> >> > of time does not, in
>> >> > any
>> >> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>> >>
>> >> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> >> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>> >>
>> >> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>> >>
>> >> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> >> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> >> of items which need individual configuration.
>> >>
>> >> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
>> >> ambiguities,
>> >> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
>> >> describing.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
>> >> > communicating and the
>> >> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be
>> >> > an IIS configuration
>> >> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>> >>
>> >> Your original phrasing was :
>> >> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it
>> >> is not
>> >> configured as an application directory until several minutes go
>> >> by."
>> >>
>> >> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> >> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
>> >> > desktop image I'm
>> >> > talking
>> >> > about).
>> >>
>> >> That could very well be.
>> >> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>> >>
>> >> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> >> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
>> >> quickly ?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >> >
>> >> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing
>> >> > slowly. I am saying that
>> >> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You
>> >> > telling me that your system
>> >> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way,
>> >> > mean that MY problem is
>> >> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem
>> >> > to be much MORE robust
>> >> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is
>> >> > what tells me that this
>> >> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >> >
>> >> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration
>> >> > issue. The system is
>> >> > fast
>> >> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
>> >> > project. Since
>> >> > creating a
>> >> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> >> > configuration of the
>> >> > two
>> >> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
>> >> > issue, it may be a VS
>> >> > .NET
>> >> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is,
>> >> > after all, a corporate
>> >> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the
>> >> > years of experience
>> >> > I've
>> >> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get
>> >> > good results and these
>> >> > machines have those specs.
>> >> >
>> >> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion
>> >> > is the problem.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> >> re:
>> >> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
>> >> >> describe
>> >> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>> >> >> Framework.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for
>> >> >> believing that
>> >> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since
>> >> >> with
>> >> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >> ======================================
>> >> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are
>> >> >>> (as stated earlier in
>> >> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few
>> >> >>> seconds (I have been
>> >> >>> using
>> >> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to
>> >> >>> find out how quickly it
>> >> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long
>> >> >>> for me and I'm
>> >> >>> telling
>> >> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Thanks anyway.
>> >>
>> >> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
>> >> >>>> brand-name),
>> >> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>> >> >>>> seconds.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >>>> ======================================
>> >> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our
>> >> >>>>> corporate
>> >> >>>>> workstations.
>> >> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>> >> >>>>> creating the web
>> >> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application
>> >> >>>>> is made, everything
>> >> >>>>> sails.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in
>> >> >>>>> message
>> >> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you
>> >> >>>>>>>> have them running.
>> >> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> John
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running
>> >> >>>>>>>> > on XP Pro. (P4's
>> >> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply
>> >> >>>>>>>> > create a new ASP.NET Web
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right
>> >> >>>>>>>> > away, but it is not
>> >> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
>> >> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
>>



Nov 19 '05 #44

P: n/a
re:
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you
the problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the problem has been solved.
The TCP/IP stack was not the problem.
At least, I read the replies to my messages,
instead of not reading them, like you do even now.

heh, heh...

I understand, Scott.
It's hard for anybody to realize just where they went wrong.

What's even harder to understand is why you
need to make this a "make or break" issue.

You have insulted me; you have flamed me;
you have *insisted* on doing both of those things.

If you think that a bad hosts entry doesn't affect
your TCP/IP stack, you're just plain mistaken.

The hosts file is an integral component of your TCP/IP stack setup.

The hosts file is used to translate human readable
computer names into dotted octet internet addresses.

The Transmission Control Protocol/Internet Protocol (TCP/IP),
is the suite of communications protocols used to connect *hosts*
on the Internet.

The *hosts* file defines the Internet hosts, including the localhost

If you knew what the TCP/IP stack is, you must have forgotten it.

But, hey, just continue to flame me.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:ez**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl... Apparently you need some work on reading as well, since I've already told you that the
problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the problem has been solved. The
TCP/IP stack was not the problem.
"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Ox**************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
re:
when you have not asked any questions or provided any direction as to what to try


Scott, going into denial really doesn't help.

Let me repeat the dialogue :

You :
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but you didn't!


The text which you say I didn't write :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?


If you had been paying attention to the suggestions being made,
instead of looking to vent your frustration with your problems on me,
you could have found out that the TCP/IP stack *was* the problem
much sooner ( Even sooner than George's suggestion ).

You *still* have the TCP/IP problem, btw.
Working around it by using 127.0.0.1 will probably come back to bite you.

But don't mind me. Have a nice day.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself have been a
participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't need someone arguing with
me over a point that is mute. Juan has done nothing but that since his first post
here. I don't doubt that he may have been helpful to others in other circumstances,
but he has not been here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem arises or to
argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works fine on his system is not
really the kind useful troubleshooting advice I was asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at, things that I could
check, places I could look and that was/is helpful to someone who is troubleshooting a
problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely different to
insist that your opinion is correct when you have not asked any questions or provided
any direction as to what to try. This is what Juan has done here and, I'm sorry, but
I have no patience for that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made a few educated
guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of the ones that didn't pan out,
ubt he certainly did not present all of the possible causes of your issue. The fact
that one of his guesses, among the myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue,
does not make him a better person than Juan, or any of the other people who have
tried to help you. It is a simple fact that you always find something in the last
place you look for it. After all, once you find it, you stop looking.

Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has pulled many a
foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced, and illogical. I hope you
don't program with that logic! ;-)

--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some suggestions of
> things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> Good bye, Scott.
>>
>> I wish you luck in solving your problem.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> > Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
>> > understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
>> > scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
>> > systems.
>> >
>> > My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
>> > take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
>> > out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
>> > not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.
>> >
>> > Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
>> > mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
>> > anything to contribute to the discussion.
>> >
>> > You categorically stated:
>> >
>> > "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
>> > have nothing to do with your problem."
>> >
>> > Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
>> > about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
>> > VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
>> > application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
>> > thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
>> > and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.
>> >
>> > If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
>> > don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
>> > you don't.
>> >
>> > I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
>> > me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
>> > information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>> >
>> >> re:
>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >>
>> >> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> >> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>> >>
>> >> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
>> >> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> >> configured for the answer.
>> >>
>> >> You have 3 things at play here :
>> >>
>> >> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> >> 2. Your software configuration
>> >> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>> >>
>> >> You'll need to check all of them.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does
>> >> > not, in
>> >> > any
>> >> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>> >>
>> >> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> >> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>> >>
>> >> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>> >>
>> >> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> >> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> >> of items which need individual configuration.
>> >>
>> >> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
>> >> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> >> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> >> > configuration
>> >> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>> >>
>> >> Your original phrasing was :
>> >> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> >> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>> >>
>> >> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> >> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>> >>
>> >> re:
>> >> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image
>> >> > I'm
>> >> > talking
>> >> > about).
>> >>
>> >> That could very well be.
>> >> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>> >>
>> >> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> >> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >> >
>> >> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am
>> >> > saying that
>> >> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> >> > system
>> >> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY
>> >> > problem is
>> >> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> >> > robust
>> >> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me
>> >> > that this
>> >> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >> >
>> >> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system
>> >> > is
>> >> > fast
>> >> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> >> > creating a
>> >> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of
>> >> > the
>> >> > two
>> >> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be
>> >> > a VS
>> >> > .NET
>> >> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> >> > corporate
>> >> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of
>> >> > experience
>> >> > I've
>> >> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and
>> >> > these
>> >> > machines have those specs.
>> >> >
>> >> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> >> re:
>> >> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> >> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> >> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >> ======================================
>> >> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
>> >> >>> earlier in
>> >> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have
>> >> >>> been
>> >> >>> using
>> >> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how
>> >> >>> quickly it
>> >> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and
>> >> >>> I'm
>> >> >>> telling
>> >> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>> Thanks anyway.
>> >>
>> >> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>> >> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >>>> ======================================
>> >> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>> >> >>>>> workstations.
>> >> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the
>> >> >>>>> web
>> >> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
>> >> >>>>> everything
>> >> >>>>> sails.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >> >>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them
>> >> >>>>>>>> running.
>> >> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> John
>> >> >>>>>>>>
>> >> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro.
>> >> >>>>>>>> > (P4's
>> >> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new
>> >> >>>>>>>> > ASP.NET Web
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is
>> >> >>>>>>>> > not
>> >> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>> >> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.

Nov 19 '05 #45

P: n/a
re:
the hosts file was, in fact, the culprit - not the TCP/IP stack.


The hosts file is an integral part of your TCP/IP stack setup.
See my detailed answer in the previous post.


Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
Argumentative fellow, aren't you?


Am I? I really am just telling you the way I see it.
Visual Studio uses lots and lots of things. It uses a multitude of services, network
protocols, Internet Explorer, FrontPage Server extensions, the ENTIRE .Net Platform,
and even the Operating System. So, if the problem was with the operating system, would
you say that the problem is a VS.Net issue as well? A problem with a service does not
equate to a problem with a client. D00d!


I think that's really pushing it a bit. If VS.NET is set to use FrontPage Server
Extensions and the file access method is set to File Share, then changing a setting in
VS.NET would fix the problem. Do we really need to split hairs on this? The point was
that Juan categorically denied that VS.NET could in any way be the problem and a smart
guy like you knows that's not a true statement.
Your TCP/IP stack isn't hardware. It's software. And circumventing a problem doesn't
solve it.


But, if you had read Juan's "diagnosis" PRIOR to that post, he assured me that the
problem was definitely hardware and NOT software. Starting to see my point? He kept
telling me absolutely what the problem was without knowing anything about my
system/setup. And (I think for the 3rd time) the problem was found with an incorrect
entry to our hosts file, the file has been corrected. We have not circumvented the
problem, we've found it and corrected it.
As a suggestion, try adding a localhost entry to your machine's hosts and lmhosts.sam
files. It won't hurt to try, and it might help. And I think Juan's recent advice would
be well-taken. Look into your TCP/IP stack, if you have the time.


Again, I appreciate your help and the hosts file was, in fact, the culprit - not the
TCP/IP stack.


First of all, I am one of those people in the "us" you describe below that use (and
have used) this product without any problems what-so-ever. I have been using .NET
since early betas and also have it installed on several different machines at home as
well and I have not encountered this behavior in the past either, hence my post.

I never said that the problem is with VS.NET (the software programming of it) so I'm
not sure why you are saying that I did. What I said was that there is certainly the
possibility that the configuration of VS.NET and/or the configuration of IIS may be
the culprit because the two have to communicate in order for web applications to be
created. Within that realm, there are a number of variables that could be the cause.
For Juan to categorically state (which he did) that the problem is not with VS.NET or
IIS without knowing anything at all about the systems in question and their
configuration is hardly the sign of someone who has any form of in-depth knowledge of
the subject. And, to state this after categorically stating that my hardware is the
problem (which he also did) when I had already told him that this was ruled out and
again he had not known anything else about the environment just tells me that Juan
wants to be heard. He wants to be agreed with and he wants his word taken as final.
Again, I'm sorry, but that is not being helpful.

I can tell you why he would say such a thing. Because many of us use the same product
without any problems whatsoever, in terms of speed, etc. I have it installed on both
my home and work machines, and we have it here at the office on a number of machines.
No problems. If the problem were in the Visual Studio.Net application, it would exist
in all copies of the application. It doesn't. Therefore, it is outside the
application, as Juan stated.

The issue you mentioned ("communicate with IIS") does not indicate a problem with
Visual Studio. It indicates aproblem in the environment in which Visual Studio
operates, as Juan indicated. The fact that you figured out that it was an issue with
a hosts file confirms this.

Not so fast. If VS.NET is set up to use FrontPage Extensions and/or File Sharing to
communicate with IIS, then that is a VS.NET issue, not an environment issue. You
can't just rule out VS .NET and IIS without first looking into the configuration of
each.
Juan was being as helpful as he could, by attempting to reduce the number of possible
areas where the problem could originate. He speaks about what he knows, and keeps
silent about what he does not (or can not) know, as any helpful person should. When
attempting to solve an issue, knowing where the problem does NOT originate is part of
the problem-solving process. To quote Sherlock Holmes, "When you have eliminated the
impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." While this is
not the only means to solving a problem, it is certainly a useful one. And
considering the size and scope of Visual Studio, it eliminates quite a few
possibilities.

I agree. So when I repeatedly informed Juan that hardware has been ruled out and he
repeatedly insisted that this was, in fact, my problem, I knew that he was not someone
who understands how to troubleshoot.
While your frustration with the problem is understandable, your anger at Juan is
misplaced.

To each his own.
--
HTH,

Kevin Spencer
Microsoft MVP
.Net Developer
Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.

"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
> Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well enough. I
> understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test particular
> scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many different
> systems.
>
> My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web application would
> take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has been ruled
> out and your response is now essentially "check your environment". That's
> not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that coming in.
>
> Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing doesn't
> mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you don't have
> anything to contribute to the discussion.
>
> You categorically stated:
>
> "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003 or 2005,
> have nothing to do with your problem."
>
> Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows anything
> about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web application,
> VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory, configure it as an
> application and set the correct access permissions. For you to say such a
> thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is ridiculous
> and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the subject.
>
> If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't know, but
> don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know something that
> you don't.
>
> I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed anything to
> me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with relevant
> information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>
>
>
> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>
>> re:
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>
>> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>>
>> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which I have
>> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>> configured for the answer.
>>
>> You have 3 things at play here :
>>
>> 1. Your hardware configuration
>> 2. Your software configuration
>> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>>
>> You'll need to check all of them.
>>
>> re:
>> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period of time does not,
>> > in any
>> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>>
>> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>>
>> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>>
>> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>> of items which need individual configuration.
>>
>> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming ambiguities,
>> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are describing.
>>
>> re:
>> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may be an IIS
>> > configuration
>> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>>
>> Your original phrasing was :
>> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> configured as an application directory until several minutes go by."
>>
>> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>>
>> re:
>> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate desktop image I'm
>> > talking
>> > about).
>>
>> That could very well be.
>> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>>
>> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond quickly ?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> ======================================
>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>> >
>> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing slowly. I am saying
>> > that
>> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You telling me that your
>> > system
>> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way, mean that MY problem
>> > is
>> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem to be much MORE
>> > robust
>> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is what tells me that
>> > this
>> > isn't a spec issue.
>> >
>> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration issue. The system is
>> > fast
>> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web project. Since
>> > creating a
>> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the configuration of
>> > the two
>> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration issue, it may be a
>> > VS .NET
>> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a
>> > corporate
>> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the years of experience
>> > I've
>> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get good results and
>> > these
>> > machines have those specs.
>> >
>> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion is the problem.
>>
>>
>> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >> re:
>> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>
>> >> That doesn't sound right.
>> >>
>> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>> >>
>> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>> >>
>> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you describe
>> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net Framework.
>> >>
>> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>> >>
>> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for believing that
>> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since with
>> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >> ======================================
>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are (as stated
>> >>> earlier in
>> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few seconds (I have been
>> >>> using
>> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to find out how quickly
>> >>> it
>> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so long for me and I'm
>> >>> telling
>> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks anyway.
>>
>> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>> >>>>
>> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a brand-name),
>> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10 seconds.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>> ======================================
>> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of our corporate
>> >>>>> workstations.
>> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that creating the web
>> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application is made,
>> >>>>> everything
>> >>>>> sails.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>> >>>>>> ======================================
>> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>> >>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you have them running.
>> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> John
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003 running on XP Pro. (P4's
>> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply create a new ASP.NET
>> >>>>>>>> > Web
>> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it is not
>> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several minutes go by.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.
>> >>>>>>>> >
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>



Nov 19 '05 #46

P: n/a
Two points, 1 for Scott & 1 for MVP's

Scott, you have a serious piece of corn cob stuck in your ass. How come
you're so grumpy? And BTW it's a "MOOT" point, not "MUTE" point.

MVP's, I'm really distressed by the fact that so often when I post detailed
questions to various newsgroups my questions are ignored, and yet when some
grumpy guy with cob stuck in his ass flames you, you spend the rest of the
day responding to him. How about spending more time with those of us who
respect your advice and less time with grumpy guys who have cob stuck in
their ass?

Bill
Nov 19 '05 #47

P: n/a
re:
How about spending more time with those of us who respect
your advice and less time with grumpy guys who have cob stuck in
their ass?
Your wise advice is humbly accepted, Bill.

;-)

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Bill" <Bi**@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:8C**********************************@microsof t.com... Two points, 1 for Scott & 1 for MVP's

Scott, you have a serious piece of corn cob stuck in your ass. How come
you're so grumpy? And BTW it's a "MOOT" point, not "MUTE" point.

MVP's, I'm really distressed by the fact that so often when I post detailed
questions to various newsgroups my questions are ignored, and yet when some
grumpy guy with cob stuck in his ass flames you, you spend the rest of the
day responding to him. How about spending more time with those of us who
respect your advice and less time with grumpy guys who have cob stuck in
their ass?

Bill

Nov 19 '05 #48

P: n/a
If you equate "flame" with telling you that your ability to diagnose and
troubleshoot a problem based on the information you have in hand is poor,
then yes, I have flamed you.

If you are hurt and feel insulted because of that, then you should probably
grow up a bit and learn to take constructive criticism.

I don't need lessons on what TCP/IP stands for and what it is and I know
what the hosts file is and what it is used for. It's a little too late to
jump on the bandwagon of "I solved your problem" after the problem was
solved.

"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:uf*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
re:
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you
the problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the problem has
been solved. The TCP/IP stack was not the problem.


At least, I read the replies to my messages,
instead of not reading them, like you do even now.

heh, heh...

I understand, Scott.
It's hard for anybody to realize just where they went wrong.

What's even harder to understand is why you
need to make this a "make or break" issue.

You have insulted me; you have flamed me;
you have *insisted* on doing both of those things.

If you think that a bad hosts entry doesn't affect
your TCP/IP stack, you're just plain mistaken.

The hosts file is an integral component of your TCP/IP stack setup.

The hosts file is used to translate human readable
computer names into dotted octet internet addresses.

The Transmission Control Protocol/Internet Protocol (TCP/IP),
is the suite of communications protocols used to connect *hosts*
on the Internet.

The *hosts* file defines the Internet hosts, including the localhost

If you knew what the TCP/IP stack is, you must have forgotten it.

But, hey, just continue to flame me.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:ez**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
Apparently you need some work on reading as well, since I've already told
you that the problem was an incorrect entry in our hosts file and the
problem has been solved. The TCP/IP stack was not the problem.


"Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:Ox**************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
re:
when you have not asked any questions or provided any direction as to
what to try

Scott, going into denial really doesn't help.

Let me repeat the dialogue :

You :
Maybe if you had ASKED those questions, I would have answered you, but
you didn't!

The text which you say I didn't write :
How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
quickly ?

If you had been paying attention to the suggestions being made,
instead of looking to vent your frustration with your problems on me,
you could have found out that the TCP/IP stack *was* the problem
much sooner ( Even sooner than George's suggestion ).

You *still* have the TCP/IP problem, btw.
Working around it by using 127.0.0.1 will probably come back to bite
you.

But don't mind me. Have a nice day.

Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
======================================
"Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
news:%2***************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
Kevin, I appreciate your help, but I don't need a lecture. I, myself
have been a participant of these NG's for years. But I certainly don't
need someone arguing with me over a point that is mute. Juan has done
nothing but that since his first post here. I don't doubt that he may
have been helpful to others in other circumstances, but he has not been
here.

Telling me to rebuild my machine and step-by-step see where the problem
arises or to argue that hardware IS my problem because everything works
fine on his system is not really the kind useful troubleshooting advice
I was asking for.

George and yourself provided things that I could actually look at,
things that I could check, places I could look and that was/is helpful
to someone who is troubleshooting a problem.

It's one thing to offer a guess and try to be helpful, it's entirely
different to insist that your opinion is correct when you have not
asked any questions or provided any direction as to what to try. This
is what Juan has done here and, I'm sorry, but I have no patience for
that.

Thanks again for your help.
"Kevin Spencer" <ke***@DIESPAMMERSDIEtakempis.com> wrote in message
news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> George, like Juan, myself, and the others who tried to help you, made
> a few educated guesses. He had the advantage of having heard some of
> the ones that didn't pan out, ubt he certainly did not present all of
> the possible causes of your issue. The fact that one of his guesses,
> among the myriad possibilities, happened to be the issue, does not
> make him a better person than Juan, or any of the other people who
> have tried to help you. It is a simple fact that you always find
> something in the last place you look for it. After all, once you find
> it, you stop looking.
>
> Juan is one of the most helpful paricipants in this newsgroup, and has
> pulled many a foot out of the fire. Your anger with him is misplaced,
> and illogical. I hope you don't program with that logic! ;-)
>
> --
> HTH,
>
> Kevin Spencer
> Microsoft MVP
> .Net Developer
> Ambiguity has a certain quality to it.
>
> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
> news:04**********************************@microsof t.com...
>> Thanks. It has been solved by George, who actually had some
>> suggestions of
>> things to try, rather than telling me to rebuild my pc.
>>
>> "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>>
>>> Good bye, Scott.
>>>
>>> I wish you luck in solving your problem.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> ======================================
>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>> news:81**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>> > Juan, with all due respect, I think you haven't listened well
>>> > enough. I
>>> > understand what the problems *might* be and I know how to test
>>> > particular
>>> > scenarios. I have been using .NET for nearly 5 years and on many
>>> > different
>>> > systems.
>>> >
>>> > My post asked if anyone knew why creating a localhost web
>>> > application would
>>> > take an inordinate amout of time. I told you that hardware has
>>> > been ruled
>>> > out and your response is now essentially "check your environment".
>>> > That's
>>> > not a very helpful answer, especially since I knew all of that
>>> > coming in.
>>> >
>>> > Just because you haven't experienced the scenario I'm discussing
>>> > doesn't
>>> > mean it doesn't exist for others, but it may mean that perhaps you
>>> > don't have
>>> > anything to contribute to the discussion.
>>> >
>>> > You categorically stated:
>>> >
>>> > "All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET, whether 2003
>>> > or 2005,
>>> > have nothing to do with your problem."
>>> >
>>> > Why in the world would you say such a thing? Anyone who knows
>>> > anything
>>> > about VS.NET and ASP.NET knows that in order to make a new web
>>> > application,
>>> > VS.NET must communicate with IIS to create the directory,
>>> > configure it as an
>>> > application and set the correct access permissions. For you to
>>> > say such a
>>> > thing without knowing anything about my software configuration is
>>> > ridiculous
>>> > and clearly shows that you have a limited understanding of the
>>> > subject.
>>> >
>>> > If you don't know, then don't post or just say that you don't
>>> > know, but
>>> > don't just make ridicuous statements to try to prove you know
>>> > something that
>>> > you don't.
>>> >
>>> > I know you say you are an ASP.NET MVP, but you haven't displayed
>>> > anything to
>>> > me that even implies you know how to read a post and respond with
>>> > relevant
>>> > information, much less a good knowledge of ASP.NET.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > "Juan T. Llibre" wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> re:
>>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>> >>
>>> >> Perhaps you haven't supplied the correct information,
>>> >> or asked yourself the correct questions, or listened well enough.
>>> >>
>>> >> My only point is that you're presenting a unique situation which
>>> >> I have
>>> >> never seen reported, so you should look to how your system(s) are
>>> >> configured for the answer.
>>> >>
>>> >> You have 3 things at play here :
>>> >>
>>> >> 1. Your hardware configuration
>>> >> 2. Your software configuration
>>> >> 3. Your network environment ( both hardware and software )
>>> >>
>>> >> You'll need to check all of them.
>>> >>
>>> >> re:
>>> >> > You telling me that your system does the job in a short period
>>> >> > of time does not, in
>>> >> > any
>>> >> > way, mean that MY problem is specs.
>>> >>
>>> >> No one is disputing that, as far as hardware goes.
>>> >> Sometimes a comparison helps.
>>> >>
>>> >> Don't your disk/software images have specs, too ?
>>> >>
>>> >> I've seen no end of problems come from standard disk images,
>>> >> starting with name ambiguities and running a whole gamut
>>> >> of items which need individual configuration.
>>> >>
>>> >> Networked environments are particularly sensitive to naming
>>> >> ambiguities,
>>> >> and they could lead to, precisely, the type of problem you are
>>> >> describing.
>>> >>
>>> >> re:
>>> >> > Since creating a web application involves VS.NET and IIS
>>> >> > communicating and the
>>> >> > configuration of the two products configured properly, it may
>>> >> > be an IIS configuration
>>> >> > issue, it may be a VS .NET configuration issue
>>> >>
>>> >> Your original phrasing was :
>>> >> "It seems that the IIS directory gets created right away, but it
>>> >> is not
>>> >> configured as an application directory until several minutes go
>>> >> by."
>>> >>
>>> >> And the *same* problem exists in *all* the machines, right ?
>>> >> If so, this, again, points to name ambiguities.
>>> >>
>>> >> re:
>>> >> > it may be a permissions issue (this is, after all, a corporate
>>> >> > desktop image I'm
>>> >> > talking
>>> >> > about).
>>> >>
>>> >> That could very well be.
>>> >> Many IIS settings depend on machine-specific configurations.
>>> >>
>>> >> How about something simple, like the TCP/IP stacks ?
>>> >> When you run applications on the localhosts, do the sites respond
>>> >> quickly ?
>>> >>
>>> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> >> ======================================
>>> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> >> news:u5**************@TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >I really don't think you understand what I'm even saying.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > I am NOT saying that the systems in question are performing
>>> >> > slowly. I am saying that
>>> >> > ONE particular task is taking longer than it should. You
>>> >> > telling me that your system
>>> >> > does the job in a short period of time does not, in any way,
>>> >> > mean that MY problem is
>>> >> > specs. Not to mention that the systems I'm talking about seem
>>> >> > to be much MORE robust
>>> >> > than the system you are talking about. That, right there, is
>>> >> > what tells me that this
>>> >> > isn't a spec issue.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > I am quite sure that the problem is a software configuration
>>> >> > issue. The system is
>>> >> > fast
>>> >> > in everything that it does EXCEPT for the creation of the web
>>> >> > project. Since
>>> >> > creating a
>>> >> > web application involves VS.NET and IIS communicating and the
>>> >> > configuration of the
>>> >> > two
>>> >> > products configured properly, it may be an IIS configuration
>>> >> > issue, it may be a VS
>>> >> > .NET
>>> >> > configuration issue, it may be a permissions issue (this is,
>>> >> > after all, a corporate
>>> >> > desktop image I'm talking about). The point is that, with the
>>> >> > years of experience
>>> >> > I've
>>> >> > had with VS.NET, I'm pretty sure what specs. you need to get
>>> >> > good results and these
>>> >> > machines have those specs.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Again, thanks for your help, but I don't think your suggestion
>>> >> > is the problem.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> > "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> >> > news:Oq**************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >> re:
>>> >> >>>I'm telling you that the specs are not the issue.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> That doesn't sound right.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> All I'm telling you is that .Net, nor even VS.NET,
>>> >> >> whether 2003 or 2005, have nothing to do with your problem.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> I have another lowly, twin-800Mhz, 512 MB ram system,
>>> >> >> which is even slower-performing than my main system,
>>> >> >> yet it churns application creation in less than 15 seconds.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> In fact, I have *never* heard of a problem like the one you
>>> >> >> describe
>>> >> >> affecting normal, run-of-the-mill hardware running VS.Net/.Net
>>> >> >> Framework.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Make of those facts what you will.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> If you wish to dispute that, please post your reasons for
>>> >> >> believing that
>>> >> >> either VS.NET or the .NET Framework should be blamed, since
>>> >> >> with
>>> >> >> slower, older, systems than yours, there's no problem here.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> >> >> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> >> >> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> >> >> ======================================
>>> >> >> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> >> >> news:%2****************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >>> What does that even mean? The machines I'm talking about are
>>> >> >>> (as stated earlier in
>>> >> >>> this thread) P4's/2GHz w/1GB RAM.
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>> I am fully aware that the process "should" take just a few
>>> >> >>> seconds (I have been
>>> >> >>> using
>>> >> >>> .NET since early betas - 2001). I'm really not looking to
>>> >> >>> find out how quickly it
>>> >> >>> works for you. I'm trying to find out why it's taking so
>>> >> >>> long for me and I'm
>>> >> >>> telling
>>> >> >>> you that the specs are not the issue.
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>> Thanks anyway.
>>> >>
>>> >> >>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in message
>>> >> >>> news:uL*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >>>> Maybe your "brand new machines with beefy specs"
>>> >> >>>> have "beefy specs" but not enough performance ?
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>> My main development machine has a lowly P4 2.0 Ghz processor
>>> >> >>>> and 512 MB ram, and is a clone built by myself (not a
>>> >> >>>> brand-name),
>>> >> >>>> yet creating a web application with VS 2005 takes about 10
>>> >> >>>> seconds.
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>> With VS 2003 it took about the same time.
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> >> >>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> >> >>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> >> >>>> ======================================
>>> >> >>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> >> >>>> news:un*************@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >>>>> This isn't just one machine, this is happening on all of
>>> >> >>>>> our corporate
>>> >> >>>>> workstations.
>>> >> >>>>> As I stated, these are brand new machines with beefy specs.
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>> The machines are fast at everything they do, it's just that
>>> >> >>>>> creating the web
>>> >> >>>>> application takes exceptionally long. Once the application
>>> >> >>>>> is made, everything
>>> >> >>>>> sails.
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>> "Juan T. Llibre" <no***********@nowhere.com> wrote in
>>> >> >>>>> message
>>> >> >>>>> news:u%****************@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >>>>>> Is your hard drive in good condition ?
>>> >> >>>>>> Run a hard drive integrity check.
>>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>> Juan T. Llibre, ASP.NET MVP
>>> >> >>>>>> ASP.NET FAQ : http://asp.net.do/faq/
>>> >> >>>>>> Foros de ASP.NET en Español : http://asp.net.do/foros/
>>> >> >>>>>> ======================================
>>> >> >>>>>> "Scott M." <s-***@nospam.nospam> wrote in message
>>> >> >>>>>> news:7D**********************************@microsof t.com...
>>> >> >>>>>>>I have. No effect.
>>> >> >>>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>> "WJ" wrote:
>>> >> >>>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>>> Try disable Norton Anti-Virus software or any AV if you
>>> >> >>>>>>>> have them running.
>>> >> >>>>>>>> These stuffs are nothing but a nuisance.
>>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>>> John
>>> >> >>>>>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>>>> "Scott M." <No****@NoSpam.com> wrote in message
>>> >> >>>>>>>> news:em**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > Can anyone give me any ideas on why VS.NET 2003
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > running on XP Pro. (P4's
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > with 1GB RAM) would take over 3 minutes to simply
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > create a new ASP.NET Web
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > Application on http://localhost?
>>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > It seems that the IIS directory gets created right
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > away, but it is not
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > configured as an application directory until several
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > minutes go by.
>>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > Thanks,
>>> >> >>>>>>>> >
>>> >> >>>>>>>> > Scott M.


Nov 19 '05 #49

P: n/a
I'm also distressed Bill, at how MVP's are so quick to rally around each
other under all most any circumstance, even when an MVP is wrong or when
someone points out any criticism of them.

I also find it interesting that everyone is telling me how I have flamed
Juan, yet I have not used any profanity or called anyone names. I've simply
stated the facts and indicated that Juan has been of no help. If you folks
can't take that then PLEASE do yourselves and me a favor and just filter me
out of your NG reader. There's no need for you to waste your precious time
on someone like that.

But by all means, read Bill's messages and "humbly" accept his criticism
because all he's doing is using profanity and slinging insults around.

PS - I really hope you never mis-type a word in a public communication Bill
(I know that you never have in your life, but just a hope for the future).
Because some smart-ass might want to try to publicly point out your simple
error and then tell you that you have a corn cob stuck in your ass.
"Bill" <Bi**@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:8C**********************************@microsof t.com...
Two points, 1 for Scott & 1 for MVP's

Scott, you have a serious piece of corn cob stuck in your ass. How come
you're so grumpy? And BTW it's a "MOOT" point, not "MUTE" point.

MVP's, I'm really distressed by the fact that so often when I post
detailed
questions to various newsgroups my questions are ignored, and yet when
some
grumpy guy with cob stuck in his ass flames you, you spend the rest of the
day responding to him. How about spending more time with those of us who
respect your advice and less time with grumpy guys who have cob stuck in
their ass?

Bill

Nov 19 '05 #50

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