Web hosting and SQL Server Enterprise Manager?

[John]

Do you guys have any idea if web hosting companies usually give access to
SQL Server databases through Enterprise Manager?
I used to have have access to my DB through EE with my previous provider and
now the more I am looking into offers on the net the less I can see this
feature specified.

What can I do without EE to backup my database in a completely automated
way? Can I assume SQLDMO will always be available so that I can backup the
database myself without hardcoding the table structure in my scripts (I'll
be doing some ASP.NET)?

Thank you.

[David Gugick]

John wrote:

Do you guys have any idea if web hosting companies usually give
access to SQL Server databases through Enterprise Manager?
I used to have have access to my DB through EE with my previous
provider and now the more I am looking into offers on the net the
less I can see this feature specified.

What can I do without EE to backup my database in a completely
automated way? Can I assume SQLDMO will always be available so that I
can backup the database myself without hardcoding the table structure
in my scripts (I'll be doing some ASP.NET)?

Thank you.

Depends entirely on your hosting plan. To be honest, it's probably
better you don't have SQL EM access because that would mean the hosting
company has exposed SQL Server to the internet. And that might be
considered a security problem. Most low-fee hosting plans (read: shared
hosting) do not give users the ability to back up databases if it's
hidden behind the web server. They usually provide rudimentary means to
access the server, but backups are performed by the hosting company
daily, weekly, monthly, or never.

In any case, you probably won't have SQL EM access. More likely you'll
use the Web Data Administrator. I've not seen a hosting company that
provides the SQL Server Client Tools as an local installation option,
but they may exist.

The question you raise is a concern. Depending on what you're doing with
SQL Server, you may be able to keep a local SQL Server copy and update
the web SQL Server when needed. If updates occur on the web site's SQL
Server, you need to check with your hosting company to see the options
you have for backup.

--
David Gugick
Imceda Software
www.imceda.com

[Scott Allen]

I'm not sure if hosters generally grant access - but I know at least a
few that do. SQLDMO might also be a problem if the hosting company
gives your applications less than full trust.

You can do all this stuff (including backups) with T-SQL.

--
Scott
http://www.OdeToCode.com/blogs/scott/

On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 09:53:27 +1200, "John" <so******@somewhere.com>
wrote:

Do you guys have any idea if web hosting companies usually give access to
SQL Server databases through Enterprise Manager?
I used to have have access to my DB through EE with my previous provider and
now the more I am looking into offers on the net the less I can see this
feature specified.

What can I do without EE to backup my database in a completely automated
way? Can I assume SQLDMO will always be available so that I can backup the
database myself without hardcoding the table structure in my scripts (I'll
be doing some ASP.NET)?

Thank you.

[John]

"Scott Allen" <sc***@nospam.odetocode.com> wrote in message
news:4l********************************@4ax.com...

I'm not sure if hosters generally grant access - but I know at least a
few that do. SQLDMO might also be a problem if the hosting company
gives your applications less than full trust.

You can do all this stuff (including backups) with T-SQL.

What are my options exactly to create and drop tables programmatically
really?

1) SQLDMO. As you say, maybe it's disabled by default.
2) Creating a stored procedure with CREATE TABLE and DROP TABLE statements.
Is it what you mean and do you think my provider is likely to have this
feature disabled?

[John]

"David Gugick" <da***********@imceda.com> wrote in message
news:OM**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...

John wrote:

Do you guys have any idea if web hosting companies usually give
access to SQL Server databases through Enterprise Manager?
I used to have have access to my DB through EE with my previous
provider and now the more I am looking into offers on the net the
less I can see this feature specified.

What can I do without EE to backup my database in a completely
automated way? Can I assume SQLDMO will always be available so that I
can backup the database myself without hardcoding the table structure
in my scripts (I'll be doing some ASP.NET)?

Thank you.

Depends entirely on your hosting plan. To be honest, it's probably better
you don't have SQL EM access because that would mean the hosting company
has exposed SQL Server to the internet. And that might be considered a
security problem. Most low-fee hosting plans (read: shared hosting) do not
give users the ability to back up databases if it's hidden behind the web
server. They usually provide rudimentary means to access the server, but
backups are performed by the hosting company daily, weekly, monthly, or
never.

In any case, you probably won't have SQL EM access. More likely you'll use
the Web Data Administrator. I've not seen a hosting company that provides
the SQL Server Client Tools as an local installation option, but they may
exist.

The question you raise is a concern. Depending on what you're doing with
SQL Server, you may be able to keep a local SQL Server copy and update the
web SQL Server when needed. If updates occur on the web site's SQL Server,
you need to check with your hosting company to see the options you have
for backup.

Well I will work locally mostly. Create, drop and alter my tables probably
quite often, at least in the first months of the development.
If I have got to reflect manually the changes through the web interface of
the provider, that will be no good...
With Enterprise Manager, I would just backup my local database in a file.
Then connect to the remote server, drop the database and restore it from the
backup file.

I probably can live without EE, but only if I have a way to programmatically
create or drop database tables. I guess I'll have to ask the different
providers what my options are.

[jasonkester]

John wrote:

CREATE TABLE and DROP TABLE statements.
Realistically, you should be keeping change scripts for all your DB
changes. Enterprise Manager will generate them for you if you'd like.
It makes life so much easier when it comes to deploying your
applications. Just run all the scripts since the last push, and you're
done.
Is it what you mean and do you think my provider is likely to have this feature disabled?

I would be surprised if your hosting provider gave you an SQL server
account that did not have CREATE and DROP priviledges.

Jason Kester
Expat Software Consulting Services
http://www.expatsoftware.com/

[Devmaster]

If you are serious about a service provider that will provide EE access I
know one but I am not going to broadcast it here. Send an email to
ru******@verizon.net
"John" <so******@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:eE**************@TK2MSFTNGP12.phx.gbl...

Do you guys have any idea if web hosting companies usually give access to
SQL Server databases through Enterprise Manager?
I used to have have access to my DB through EE with my previous provider and now the more I am looking into offers on the net the less I can see this
feature specified.

What can I do without EE to backup my database in a completely automated
way? Can I assume SQLDMO will always be available so that I can backup the
database myself without hardcoding the table structure in my scripts (I'll
be doing some ASP.NET)?

Thank you.

[Scott Allen]

Hi John:

You can always pump scripts into SQL Server using SqlConnection and
ExecuteNonQuery with SqlCommand from the .NET framework.

Generally, you'll be database owner (dbo) in your hosted database and
will be able to execute any of the DDL you need.

--
Scott
http://www.OdeToCode.com/blogs/scott/

On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 11:12:27 +1200, "John" <so******@somewhere.com>
wrote:

"Scott Allen" <sc***@nospam.odetocode.com> wrote in message
news:4l********************************@4ax.com.. .

I'm not sure if hosters generally grant access - but I know at least a
few that do. SQLDMO might also be a problem if the hosting company
gives your applications less than full trust.

You can do all this stuff (including backups) with T-SQL.

What are my options exactly to create and drop tables programmatically
really?

1) SQLDMO. As you say, maybe it's disabled by default.
2) Creating a stored procedure with CREATE TABLE and DROP TABLE statements.
Is it what you mean and do you think my provider is likely to have this
feature disabled?