Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:[color=blue][color=green]
>> A single, clean layout table for a page often is still the best way
>> to go.[/color]
> No, it is not. For example, it renders slower and it does not follow
> accessibility standards.[/color]
It does neither.
In fact, I've seen CSS-only layouts that render slower than a single table.
Saying that a single table will render slow is absurd, unless you think in
nanoseconds.
Accessibility is a concern, but the information in a table layout still
flows correctly top-to-bottom in the source. Since table layouts have been
used for years, any accessibility tool should be able to deal with a simple
table layout.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> Trying to do some things with pure CSS that can be done trivially
>> with a table layout often involves CSS hacks, doctype-dependencies,
>> and bulky "wrapper" <div>'s,[/color]
> No, it does not.[/color]
Your lack of anything resembling an argument does not help your "point".
If CSS layouts didn't require hacks we tables like this:
http://www.dithered.com/css_filters/css_only/index.php wouldn't exist.
[color=blue][color=green]
>> not to mention a steep learning curve for most.[/color]
> You would prefer to keep people incompetent, so that you can "sell"
> them your software? I see.[/color]
The reality is that people don't have hours and hours to spend learning
every new web technique. Some of us have families and jobs. And the truth
is, learning to use CSS to the degree required to do complex layouts is
something many people don't have time to do.
And once again, despite your push towards people doing things the "right"
way, your own web site reoutinely demonstrates the _opposite_ of what you
preach. Is your lack of ability to do things the "right way" incompetence on
your part? Or just laziness?
I've used CSS extensively for complex layouts without tables. I'm very
familiar with the arguments for and against using tables for layouts. I'm
very familiar with the nuances of CSS and how they affect real-world
development. Although I use a single layout table on
http://www.javascripttoolbox.com/ you are welcome to look at my CSS
techniques there and critique all you want. I think you will find that my
standards are far above other sites like, oh, say,
http://pointedears.de/ .
[color=blue][color=green]
>> For developers who understand the issues and are not zealots for
>> either side, a common-sense marriage of tables and CSS is the true
>> nirvana.[/color]
> A true nirvana for you. Because you can follow your natural
> laziness, can avoid learn anything new, and can better "sell" your
> software. To the disadvantage of everybody else. There is a word
> for that: antisocial.[/color]
You are truly a piece of work, Mr. Lahn. I am neither lazy nor anti-social
nor do I "sell" my software nor am I disadvantaging anyone else.
You, sir, are a troll, and just barely above VK in the amount of value that
you add to this newsgroup. If the word "anti-social" describes anyone here,
it would be you. Maybe you don't interact with humans in the real world, but
if you behave in real life as you do here, I don't imagine that many people
would find your company welcome. You are judgemental, insulting, demeaning,
elitist, anal retentive, combative, and unpleasant.
Do me a favor and add me to your kill file or adjust my score or whatever it
is that you do, so you never need to be bothered with seeing or responding
to my posts again.
Have a nice day!
--
Matt Kruse
http://www.JavascriptToolbox.com http://www.AjaxToolbox.com 
