I'm working on a new site for my wife's college art organization:
http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to go
"invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but it's
always there.

I already validated the page with w3c.org and it's OK with it.
I know layers and iframes aren't good ideas. But, layers is the best I
could come up with to do what they want with overlaps (I'm sure some
CSS way would be better, but I need this done fast and I don't know CSS
very well.)
And iframe is the only way I could come up with to have a PDF show in a
layer.

Any alternatives would indeed be appreciated, as is any advice. =)

Thanks!
Liam

news@celticbear.com wrote:[color=blue]
> I'm working on a new site for my wife's college art organization:
> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
> and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to go
> "invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but it's
> always there.
>
> I already validated the page with w3c.org and it's OK with it.
> I know layers and iframes aren't good ideas. But, layers is the best I
> could come up with to do what they want with overlaps (I'm sure some
> CSS way would be better, but I need this done fast and I don't know CSS
> very well.)
> And iframe is the only way I could come up with to have a PDF show in a
> layer.
>
> Any alternatives would indeed be appreciated, as is any advice. =)
>
> Thanks!
> Liam
>[/color]

i dont know much about iframes but i dont think you can hide them by
wrapping it into a invisible div (just my 2 ct)

z-index is also deprecated (3 ct)

btw .. nice comment you inserted :
<quote>If you can read this, you have an old browser! Update for
goodness sake! Or, you have inline frames (iframes) turned off. There's
no reason for that. Go into your options and turn IFrames back on.
</quote>

"Martin!" <martin.smidt@home.nl.knip.knip.knip> wrote:[color=blue]
>news@celticbear.com wrote:[color=green]
>> I'm working on a new site for my wife's college art organization:
>> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
>> and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to go
>> "invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but it's
>> always there.[/color][/color]

The PDF is being displayed by a separate application, not by the
browser. The fact that it's embedded in the page (for some users
depending on browser, plugins, and configuration - for me the PDF
opens in a normal Acrobat Reader window leaving a very empty looking
web page) makes no difference. Often items that are displayed with a
separate application are layered on top of the page and are hence hard
to hide.

That said the iframe containing the PDF hides and unhides perfectly
okay in IE6 and Opera (though in Opera it's a blank white square - the
PDF having already opened in a Acrobat Reader window). I guess that
you're problem is with Gecko browsers?
[color=blue][color=green]
>> I already validated the page with w3c.org and it's OK with it.
>> I know layers and iframes aren't good ideas. But, layers is the best I
>> could come up with to do what they want with overlaps (I'm sure some
>> CSS way would be better, but I need this done fast and I don't know CSS
>> very well.)
>> And iframe is the only way I could come up with to have a PDF show in a
>> layer.[/color][/color]
[color=blue][color=green]
>> Any alternatives would indeed be appreciated, as is any advice. =)[/color][/color]

Convert the contents of the PDF to HTML.

Or make the link to the PDF a proper link and let it load normally
(open a new window if you really must but remember that this will lead
to a blank window for people who have their browsers configured to
always save PDFs or display them in a separate application window).

And add some alt attributes. At the moment your page is totally blank.
[color=blue]
>i dont know much about iframes but i dont think you can hide them by
>wrapping it into a invisible div (just my 2 ct)[/color]

You can, if the iframe contained a web page rather than something that
required an external application then it could be hidden in Gecko as
well as in IE and Opera.
[color=blue]
>z-index is also deprecated (3 ct)[/color]

Source?
[color=blue]
>btw .. nice comment you inserted :
><quote>If you can read this, you have an old browser! Update for
>goodness sake! Or, you have inline frames (iframes) turned off. There's
>no reason for that. Go into your options and turn IFrames back on.
></quote>[/color]

Yep, very nice. Nice display of ignorance and arrogrance bundled into
one.

Steve

--
"My theories appal you, my heresies outrage you,
I never answer letters and you don't like my tie." - The Doctor

Steve Pugh <steve@pugh.net> <http://steve.pugh.net/>

> a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to go[color=blue]
> "invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but[/color]
it's[color=blue]
> always there.[/color]

I think that strictly this is a browser bug, but I believe it is one
that they all have. Things handled by plugins do not cooperate with
other page elements in terms of z-index etc. Furthermore in some
browsers the PDF will not be embedded at all and you'll get a offer to
save it to disk (I've just tried it in Opera). PDF is not suitable for
this situation; use HTML.

--Phil.

>[color=blue][color=green]
>>z-index is also deprecated (3 ct)[/color]
>
> Source?
>[/color]

i am completely wrong here, not deprecated at all, part of css2 and
unalterred in css2.1

it applies only to positioned elements, and thus correctly applied by OP.

source: w3c.org

i own somebody 3ct,

<news@celticbear.com> wrote in message
news:1110433857.811485.209750@l41g2000cwc.googlegr oups.com...[color=blue]
> I'm working on a new site for my wife's college art organization:
> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
> and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to go
> "invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but it's
> always there.
>
> I already validated the page with w3c.org and it's OK with it.
> I know layers and iframes aren't good ideas. But, layers is the best I
> could come up with to do what they want with overlaps (I'm sure some
> CSS way would be better, but I need this done fast and I don't know CSS
> very well.)
> And iframe is the only way I could come up with to have a PDF show in a
> layer.
>
> Any alternatives would indeed be appreciated, as is any advice. =)
>
> Thanks!
> Liam[/color]

My browser may be configured to only open PDF's in their own window, I don't
remember. I've never seen a pdf displayed in the way you're attempting.
Usually (always?) there's just a link and the PDF opens in it's own window.

The PDF is invisible to me in IE6. This is because you have set visibility
for that div to hidden. If you want the div (aka layer) to become visible
you will have to use DW to assign some behavior to it or just set it to
visible if that's what you want.

Incidentally I did pull up the contest rules manually and 4/18 is just
around the corner so you better hurry up and finish that page!
Good Luck,
me

news@celticbear.com wrote:[color=blue]
>
> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
> and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame[/color]

It is really rude to open a PDF without warning the visitor. Either
convert it to HTML, or use a plain link to the PDF and make it really
obvious what the file is.

--
Reply email address is a bottomless spam bucket.
Please reply to the group so everyone can share.

Steve Pugh wrote:[color=blue]
> "Martin!" <martin.smidt@home.nl.knip.knip.knip> wrote:[color=green]
> >news@celticbear.com wrote:[color=darkred]
> >> I'm working on a new site for my wife's college art organization:
> >> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/
> >> and I'm having a problem where a PDF in an IFrame is supposed to[/color][/color][/color]
go[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
> >> "invisible" (and in fact is supposed to be hidden by default) but[/color][/color][/color]
it's[color=blue][color=green][color=darkred]
> >> always there.[/color][/color]
>
> The PDF is being displayed by a separate application, not by the
> browser. The fact that it's embedded in the page (for some users
> depending on browser, plugins, and configuration - for me the PDF
> opens in a normal Acrobat Reader window leaving a very empty looking
> web page) makes no difference. Often items that are displayed with a
> separate application are layered on top of the page and are hence[/color]
hard[color=blue]
> to hide.
>
> That said the iframe containing the PDF hides and unhides perfectly
> okay in IE6 and Opera (though in Opera it's a blank white square -[/color]
the[color=blue]
> PDF having already opened in a Acrobat Reader window). I guess that
> you're problem is with Gecko browsers?
>[color=green][color=darkred]
> >> Any alternatives would indeed be appreciated, as is any advice. =)[/color][/color]
>
> Convert the contents of the PDF to HTML.[/color]

Thanks for the feedback.
Looks like I have no choice, I'll need to make them separate pages,
probably with HTML with links to PDF perhaps.
Yeah, I was testing with Firefox which does the inline iframes just
fine, and keeps the PDF in the defined parameters. In Opera it does
exactly what you described...another reason I'm going to have to eschew
the idea of PDF's in layers altogether.
[color=blue]
>
> You can, if the iframe contained a web page rather than something[/color]
that[color=blue]
> required an external application then it could be hidden in Gecko as
> well as in IE and Opera.
>[color=green]
> >z-index is also deprecated (3 ct)[/color]
>
> Source?[/color]

I'm interested in that as well. Even if I don't use PDF's I'll probably
still use frames.
Anyway, W3C.org passed my HTML validation.
[color=blue]
>[color=green]
> >btw .. nice comment you inserted :
> ><quote>If you can read this, you have an old browser! Update for
> >goodness sake! Or, you have inline frames (iframes) turned off.[/color][/color]
There's[color=blue][color=green]
> >no reason for that. Go into your options and turn IFrames back on.
> ></quote>[/color]
>
> Yep, very nice. Nice display of ignorance and arrogrance bundled into
> one.
>[/color]

Uhm, yeah, er, *koff koff* I uh wrote that a few years ago for another
page back before XML and CSS took over and I thought I knew everything
*grin* and then just copy-n-pasted it over from that page to this new
one.
So uh, sorry about that. =)

Gazing into my crystal ball I observed kchayka <usenet@c-net.us> writing in
news:39bk77F5e46mbU1@individual.net:
[color=blue]
> news@celticbear.com wrote:[color=green]
>>
>> http://www.ie-studios.net/mci/ and I'm having a problem where a PDF in
>> an IFrame[/color]
>
> It is really rude to open a PDF without warning the visitor. Either
> convert it to HTML, or use a plain link to the PDF and make it really
> obvious what the file is.
>[/color]

Agreed, I have my browsers set up to NOT open PDF in the browser. I don't
like the way the browser hangs.

--
Adrienne Boswell
http://www.cavalcade-of-coding.info
Please respond to the group so others can share

Adrienne wrote:[color=blue]
> Gazing into my crystal ball I observed kchayka <usenet@c-net.us>[/color]
writing in[color=blue]
> news:39bk77F5e46mbU1@individual.net:[color=green]
> >
> > It is really rude to open a PDF without warning the visitor. Either
> > convert it to HTML, or use a plain link to the PDF and make it[/color][/color]
really[color=blue][color=green]
> > obvious what the file is.
> >[/color]
>
> Agreed, I have my browsers set up to NOT open PDF in the browser. I[/color]
don't[color=blue]
> like the way the browser hangs.[/color]

Thanks all!
That's what I needed. It's evident that I'm going to need to get some
convertible-to-HTML copy of the documents and use those. Then
everything will be hunkydory and nearly 100% universally compliant. =)
Thanks for the feedback!

Liam